What can you tell me about Fox and Jacobs? (floor, foundation, windows)
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I was reading the thread in the Fort worth section about History Maker homes. They sure seem to look a lot like F&J homes. Do any of you own one of these homes? They are pretty and seem to be a good deal. A friend of mine owns one. Any good stories, customer service, etc.
Fox and Jacobs are typically known as starter homes. My brother in law looked into those in Wylie years ago and decided against them and went with Kaufman and Broad. They had heard they cut alot of corners in Fox and Jacobs and went the other however they aren't too happy with Kaufman and Broad. They are moving out in a few months and moving into a DR Horton.
I have heard that older homes are better construction these days here in DFW. I have heard the stories, even fecal matter being found in the attic. Can you imagine?
By reputation, the best starter homes tend to be Centex, Plantation and First Texas Homes. There are some homes that are reproduction that cost more, but you will be getting more for the money it seems. Sotherby, Huntington and Darling homes tend to be these. I looked at a Darling home in Stonebridge and it cost 625 K and was blown away. The next home with identical in floor plan but different elevation and colors. We though decided against those and go with an older home closer to 75.
From what I found out Centex Homes builds Fox And Jacobs homes. I did some research on other threads and found others to be quite pleased with them. I have heard nothing but bad things about Kaufman/Broad KB Homes and Grand. Also I have heard horror stories about Lennar.
Thanks for the reply
Centex and Fox & Jacobs are one in the same. Years and years ago they were just Fox & Jacobs (or as we referred to them F&J). Then about 13 years ago they started using Centex as a "higher end" home. They did not last long in that area, maybe 5 houses total. Then they changed Centex to a more mid range home (120K and up) but nothing extravagant. They dropped the F&J name and used nothing but Centex for several years. About 6 years ago they brought back the Fox & Jacobs name for entry level. Basic boxes w/ very little to add thru them. You could upgrade after you bought it but that just means you would overbuild the neighborhood and would not get your money back when you sold.
My parents live in a home built by F&J about 30 years ago. Same cookie cutter floorplans used all over the D/FW area. I can recognize them a mile away. Back then they had 3 levels of F&J's. Theirs is the topend and was under the California Flair name.
We built a F&J home 14 years ago and had no problems. A few neighbors did then but it was mostly windows that had lost their seals. Then in 1997 we built a Centex. Now THAT is where the problems started. MAJOR PROBLEMS!!! They bought back at least 4 homes in the neighborhood for foundation problems. We found out about a class action suit that many neighbors had settled that year. Ours had foundation problems for one and just plain crappy workmenship because the 3 foreman aka the 3 Musketeers did not know ANYTHING about construction. Trust me on that one, I have a minor in construction and they did not know anything. Centex has had many problems and they were not good at standing behind their work. What they are good at is keeping things patched until the warranty is expired and then things fall apart and you are stuck holding the bag. It is really sad because those houses were twice the price of our first F&J and the neighborhood looks like crap. But then in the last phase they were already phasing in the typical F&J box w/ nothing on it or in it. I've seen Palm Harbor Homes that looked better.
K&B are not any better. Most of these are low end homes that are just trying to attract a buyer for the larger square footage. More sq footage for your money but then you have to remember, you get what you pay for. I would rather have a smaller home that is better built. Lennar is in the same boat along w/ D.R. Horton (I used to work for them). I have also known several that had Grand Homes and had MAJOR problems. Don't count on the BBB to help you out. All the builder has to do is respond that they are trying to work things out and made an "offer" to fix things. The best thing to do is drive the neighborhood and talk to the homeowners and ask them how things have gone.
We know live in a Drees and I LOVE IT!!!!!! Drees and Standard Pacific are pretty good. They also offer a lot of very high quality upgrades. They are between tract homes and a true custom home. A lot of builders use the term "custom home" but they are not. If they offer you a set of set floorplans that they build in that neighborhood, that is NOT a "custom home".
You are right on momof2dfw and thanks for sharing that. My inlaws are trying to sell their Kaufman Broad home in Cedar Hill and move to Savannah in a DR Horton. They though might not make it because their home is not showing well due to it being small. They would loose 500 dollars if they are faced with not being able to sell their home and move there. My first home was a First Texas and we lived in a neighborhood with Drees and Centex homes. The Drees had a beautiful classic look to them. The Centex were nice too and everyone who built Centex in that neighbohood liked the quality but that was well over 13 years plus ago. Our 2nd was a true custom built by a custom certified builder Troy Priddy out of Waxahatchie. He actually sent me to an architect and I told him how I wanted the home to look, drew out the elevations, sketched out how I wanted the brick work to look with ribbons and soildiering and designed the whole home and it came to life. I was tickled pink and was so happy there, then we had to move because the market fell out here in Dallas. The neighborhood I am in now has custom homes and some that aren't but truly beautiful. It all doesn't matter to me if it is or if it isn't. Reproduction homes come in all price levels and top ones can be better than some custom homes. It is all is just a matter what a person wants and what they want to spend these days.
Oh there are some custom builders to watch out for. They may be "custom" but they are not great by any means. I know of one that does use the same stamped out foundation but changes a few things. The houses still all look the same. And this is in a very small neighborhood that is required to have all custom homes. It is a shame. I know of one of his houses that was on the market recently and they were having trouble selling it because there was no hot water run to the upstairs. I would LOVE to know how that passed code? We almost went the true custom home route and all but we found a house that fit our needs that was already built and was perfect. Saved us some headaches (I would have been the gm for the job, eek) since it would have been the third home we would have built and this one would have been from scratch not a set of floorplans to pick from.
I'm in the Dallas area and the market has not really "fallen". It has become a lot more stable than what it was a few years ago. But then the homes in some areas were going for way more than they should have and those areas have fallen off. Ours has increased and there has not been a real estate fall out at all in the Garland area. As a matter of fact when a house does come on the market in this part of Garland (Firewheel) it does not last long. Not many come on the market to start with since no one wants to move. Plus it seems we have a lot of residents that own businesses in the area and such so they don't suffer as much from the fallouts of the IT and dot.com failures. Now my sister lives in McKinney. If you want a house in McKinney there are plenty to choose from, new build and existing. Then there is the Waterview neighborhood of Rowlett, take your pick there. On the main street there has never been less than 15 houses for sale at any given time. My cousin lives in Plano. The house they are in they recently bought and they also had plenty to choose from. I went w/ my parents looking this past weekend at houses here in Firewheel in Garland and they did not have much to choose from. The one they really wanted had a contract on it w/ in the first 4 days.
Wow Momof2 you make it sound like Firewheel in Garland is the best neighborhood ever. I should look into it.
Thanks everyone for all the replies. That helps a lot.
No, it's probably not THE BEST neighborhood ever. It just happens to be a very nice neighborhood that is convienent to most of the metroplex. Great schools w/ great parental involvement (moms and dads). Most of the moms do not work nor do they need to in order to support their habits or their lifestyle (in other words no one is trying to "keep up with the Jones's"). Nice amenities with the golf course, trees and swim & rec club. Lots of "country" still left w/ the Holford Farm and the SpringPark Preserve around this area. The houses don't go on the market often around here because most of the people around here for the most part grew up here, went off to college, grew in their profession and like the small town feel that still exists in G-land. I can get to the SuperTarget in no time and don't have the traffic congestion feel that I do when I go to my sisters just traveling down El Dorado Pkwy and all of the lights or my cousins in Plano sitting at every light once I get off of 75 or 190.
We have a good friend that works for the city and back when the dot.com and IT industries were taking a hit and houses were going up for sale and foreclosures all over Plano & Frisco and all it was not going on in Garland. The main reason being is that the industries in Garland are more diverse and are based more on manufacturing. Which being that we have a business in Garland I can say that is true. There are many manufacturing companies around here that are expanding like there is a major boom going on. They are running 2 & 3 shifts and can not keep up. Tiring on us but it is nice to see local businesses doing well.
Good luck looking for a home. I know it is not fun after awhile. LOL!!! I went the other day w/ my parents looking for them a new house.
BTW, Drees is building in a new neighborhood over here off of Brand Rd called "The Provence". I have not been in the homes but the neighborhood is small w/ several cul-de-sacs. They do not have a swim & rec club though. If you want acreage then anything along Talley Rd which is right off of Provence. If a house or lot comes up for sale on that road, you better be there when the sign goes in the ground or know the owner is even remotely thinking about selling if you want a chance at it. No lie.
To all those that are purchasing new homes in the Dallas area: Be very cautious when doing so, because many of the construction workers have little to no experience building homes. Cheap Labor = Larger Profits! I woud never buy a Fox and Jacobs home, because like someone said earlier, they're boxes! I read a Dallas Morning News article a few years ago that mentioned the subdivsions built by Fox and Jacobs in The Colony in late 70's and how many of the houses were falling apart.
The Colony was invented by F&J for people that could not afford an F&J in Carrollton. The houses were dinky and piled on top of each other. They have one huge section of these houses that are kind of like on a circle, you pull into a "drive" of sorts and then up to your drive in front of your house. The houses were built so cheap that you could literally put your hand thru the walls (this happened to someone I know years ago). I just remember The Colony as home to the purple house with the limo's out front on the main street (we said it was a brothel) and the massage parlors along 121.
As for the cheap labor, that is everywhere not just in Dallas.
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No lie.
