Our Flip House......A Weekly Story (dishwasher, ceiling, living room, cleaning)

[Beena]

YoungLisa, you appear to be a hard working, ambitious couple...I have to give you that.

My favorite TV Show is "Property Ladder" with Kirsten Kemp. It follows amateurs, usually with zero skills or experience, attempting to strike it rich flipping houses because they watched an infomercial last night. Entertainment value is high as they crash and burn. Why? Because the economics don't work.

Distressed house sells for 100k. Flipper puts in 50k attempting to put lipstick on a pig (no real repairs like new roof or plumbing...paint, carpet, and cabinets). Flipper attempts to sell to some nice lower/middle class family of 4 for 300k. Flipper pockets 150. What is the problem there? Well why in hells bells wouldn't and shouldn't that little family of 4 purchase the house for 100k themselves, and put the work and 50k into the house THEMSELVES, and pocket that 150k for THEMSELVES??

Multiply this times a few million lower/middle class families and you can kind of see how the money is going into the wrong pockets. Add onto that the few dozen times I have heard a flipper say "I ain't gonna live here....just patch up that wall so nobody can see the leaking plumbing and slap some paint on it!!". The bottom line is that there is usually very little profit in completely rehabbing an older house, as in new plumbing, roofing, electrical, etc. It is simply too expensive, and often cheaper to tear down and start over.

And don't get me started on the fact that yes this really is the most distressed housing market in history, with prices dropping and continuing to drop. Prices have to get back to where that little family of 4 can afford them with a 30 year fixed loan, and houses need to be purchased by people who are actually going to live there...not flip them. If everyone did what you are doing, we would have a disastrous housing market. Oh wait, everyone WAS a real estate genius in 2005 and we DO have a disastrous housing market!!! :0

Having said that. I am impressed that you two have a lot of knowledge and actually do the hard work yourselves. Enjoy that Florida sunshine!!!! The escape from Tennessee alone must be worth it.

[drjones96]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

I've got a 100% original 1922 bathroom that helped me get the highest price in my area when I sold it in 2002...

All of the other homes in this 1922 California Subdivision have endured horrible remodels whereas my home was 1922 throughout... perfectly working wood sash windows, matchstick hardwood, gravity central heating, hi-leg stove, push button light switches, 30 amp main electrical service, kitchen tile and floor, etc... it had an old wringer washer... but the original owner I bought the home back in 1989 had it hauled away along with a high leg ice box

Just wanted to say that new isn't always better...

OH yeah I believe that for sure! Old appliances are way superior to newer stuff in terms of durability....as well as old construction.

Things just took a turn in the later half of the 20th century toward 'cheap & easy'....and steadily got worse.

[samstersmom]

Originally Posted by Driller1

I must have NO taste at all!!!! I liked the bathroom.

I liked the white tile. My old bathroom had pepto pink tile but I kept it. I liked the fact that it was made well and held up great. I did manage to decorate the bathroom with a victorian feel and it came out nice. And mine had a white tub.

[ylisa7]

Gee thanks. You guys are making me feel old, lol. I grew up with the Avocado green and the Harvest gold colors. Maybe some day they will be retro or people will want to have them but I never will. I am a neutral kind of girl.

JBMallory- Thanks for writing in. We are north of Port Charlotte. I have no problem passing things on and recycling as long as the people who want it come and get it. I have huge respect for people who are willing to work for something so c'mon and get it.

Ultrarunner- I knew you would write in sooner or later. Hi. It sounds like you did great in your neighborhood. Congrats. Unfortunately "original" doesn't fly in this neighborhood unless it is super cheap.

I agree 100% that newer isn't always better. Over the years Mike and I have seen the workmanship in everything go down hill. From tools, to materials, to how they build new houses using OSB. It doesn't seem to matter anymore where things are made. We now live in a very expensive disposable society.

I also can't imagine taking a house apart 10, 20, or 30 years from now. Everything is being glued.

While I can really appreciate the workmanship that goes into all the wood in old homes, I still like the new. But that's just me. We all have our likes and dislikes.

Alaskapat- Welcome and thanks for writing. Yes we will not be giving up our home in TN. How can you beat those views.

Beena- Hi and thank you for writing in. Like you I also liked Property Ladder. Kirsten Kemp was a "real" example of a house investor. Some of the others jumped on the band wagon when they shouldn't have.

Now I have a few things to say about the real estate market in general during the early 2000's to the mid 2000's. There was a lot of greed and free money out there that should have never happened. Take your pick of who to blame. We can start with no regulation on the banks and Wall Street. Then add in that our president was saying (not a direct quote) "everyone deserves or should have a house" which is so wrong. We seemed to have forgotten if you can't afford something then I'm sorry but you don't deserve it. There was also a lack of education in finances. Many people were signing mortgage papers and taking out home equities without knowing the consequences which we see now as a disaster for many. It was a time of pure craziness and it should never have happened to the extent that it did. The problem was too many people were making money and a lot of people foolishly thought it would never end. Does everyone remember the stock market at the end of the 90's? We should have learned. If things go up so fast on phonie money then you can be sure of a crash. Mike and I tried to warn many people back then to get out. Sell. The prices are going up too fast. Realtors and neighbors all thought we were crazy. They literally laughed at us.

On to flippers. Ok maybe I used the wrong term for my story. Mike and I are real estate investors. We take 100% of the risk for our actions. We also care about our work. We do our best and fix things that are broken. While there are good and bad flippers out there, there are also good and bad homeowners, and good and bad contractors. And don't forget a flipper doesn't mean "the house has been done from the wiring out". The original homeowner should be doing that kind of work. It used to be that a flip was easy because basically the previous homeowner was just too lazy to fix their own house. A house can be drastically improved with fresh paint, carpet, cleaning, and landscaping. Now there are some homeowners who care but in my experience most of the houses in our area lack care or they are just too old to fix things. Flippers exist because not all homeowners take care of their homes. It's just that in the 2000's some flippers should have never gotten the loans to do the houses.

Also, not everyone can or wants to do their own remodel. First off right now mortgages are very hard to get. Second if you can qualify and you do have the down payment you probably can't afford to do the remodel. So yes a lot of buyers want move in ready. And don't forget when you get a home that someone is living in you have the "move out" effect. Furniture marks on the floor, holes in the walls after all the wall coverings and paintings are taken down, etc. It is also very costly if you have to hire contractors for everything.

Housing prices went insane and we do need an adjustment. I know that in my area we are back down to the early 2000 prices for a full gut. Houses do have to be affordable in order to sell. Also whenever you buy a home people should be doing an inspection. No house is perfect. You just need to decide what you can handle when buying a house.

Sorry for the rant. Like you I could probably go on and on, lol. Life has no guarantees. We are just hoping for the best. If the houses sell now, great, if not then we just have to wait a little longer.

Again thanks for writing in.

drjones- I know they don't make things the way they used to . Unfortunately we are stuck with them for the most part. We just bought a $300.00 tile cutter and it's garbage

samstersmom- Thanks for writing in. With so many different tastes here maybe we should start a picture thread about all of our different style.

Have a great weekend and I will write tomorrow night.

[MotleyCrew]

Ok. Now I am addicted to this post. Please let us know what the purchase price was of the home and how much you spent fixing it up. We just did a little fixer with the help of our daughter and the benifit we had was we do our own work. They are so much fun to do if you have the young bodies to do the heavy stuff, lol.

We also love FL so you could not have picked a better spot to get my attention. Just don't do that horrible white tile and pickled oak cabinet that seem to be in just about every home there. In fact, please say no to oak, lol. Good luck and I will watch with interest!!!!

[cassy1]

Hey Lisa and Mike!
Interesting thread and am so happy to see you two renovating a FL home! Looks like the area is a keeper and I wish you all the best
Sandy

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by younglisa7

I also can't imagine taking a house apart 10, 20, or 30 years from now. Everything is being glued.

.

I've thought about that too... I better get a second sawzall

[DubbleT]

Originally Posted by younglisa7

Also, not everyone can or wants to do their own remodel. First off right now mortgages are very hard to get. Second if you can qualify and you do have the down payment you probably can't afford to do the remodel. So yes a lot of buyers want move in ready. And don't forget when you get a home that someone is living in you have the "move out" effect. Furniture marks on the floor, holes in the walls after all the wall coverings and paintings are taken down, etc. It is also very costly if you have to hire contractors for everything.

The house I bought last year was a flipped house. It had been through a fire and the guy that flipped it did a really nice job for the most part. He probably made a fairly nice profit and I got a nice, move in ready house in a great neighborhood for less than I would have paid otherwise. Win-win for both of us.
I suspect there are enough people like me, not at all handy, and willing to pay a bit more for an older house that someone else has done the work on already.

[LaceyEx]

Lisa you and Mike never cease to amaze.i

[DKVA]

Originally Posted by LaceyEx

Lisa you and Mike never cease to amaze.i

I second that ! We have done renovations over the years but not to your extent. Now we are just tired.
We need to finish our basement please send some of your energy our way.