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Even though heat simply rises, and even though with a properly insulated slab there is ultimately no where else for the heat to go but into the room, it must also be true that it is possible to "insulate" the slab to the point where there is insufficient heat transfer -- the heat simply remains in the slab the way a pizza stays warm on the delivery truck because it is in an insulated bag.
Hot air (being less dense than cool air) rises. Heat, on the other hand, is an energy form that radiates equally in all directions.
It sounds like you have a badly tuned/designed/installed system. I've been in houses where radiant heat puts out too much, and they keep the windows open, as well as places where the best the system can do it make it lukewarm.
But when it works right, radiant heat can't be beat.
Another vote for radiant heat from a cold winter climate. Our system works very well, keeps the entire house toasty, and we're very happy with it. We have tile and engineered cork and hardwood floors and no problems or "furniture" issues.
Saying that a radiant system "doesn't work" or is inadequate in a cold climate is nonsense. A well-designed one works fine.
Buddy of mine put in radiant heating when he refurbed a cabin into a permanent home in central Ontario. The temperature drops to -40 at times. He has no problem keeping the house heated with the radiant flooring. He has hardwood, no carpet.
He does have a gas stove but it is more for atmosphere, or really cold days.
Radiant heating is very common in the interior of Alaska. It has been little colder than -40 degrees F. this week, and it finally warmed to -26 four hours ago
Forced air is just too dry, but some people use furnaces. I just don't like the dry air.
I made a lot of money replacing Radiant floor heat with forced air. Most people I worked with werent happy for many of the same reasons that the OP mentioned. I would assume that most of them werent installed well but many people just plain didnt like the utility expense. Most Installations I did saved near 50% in their fuel bills. Some saved nothing too just to be fair.
So apparently it's knowing what an individual likes... my folks built 2 structures (a ~40x60 shop and their dream house) in Montana 7 and 8 years ago. Radiant floors in both, mind you that this is in a place where you occasionally get a week or two where the HIGHS don't top -20F and the lows are south of -40F, and their house is always perfectly comfortable. The shop (which is a shooting range too) is a kept at a cool 50F, but after about an hour of the lights on and moving about, it's in the 60's. Makes for easy winter vehicle maintenance, especially when you leave the vehicle in the building overnight... or better, their attached garage (63F).
I love it. But I've always loved radiant heat. Forced air is a painful system to live with (noise, maintenance, frequent repair costs... given that one radiant/boiler system I owned was over 100 years old and mostly original, not to mention simple Comfort of not having dust stirred up and air blowing on you when you don't want it). Necessary evil if you want AC though.
So apparently it's knowing what an individual likes... my folks built 2 structures (a ~40x60 shop and their dream house) in Montana 7 and 8 years ago. Radiant floors in both, mind you that this is in a place where you occasionally get a week or two where the HIGHS don't top -20F and the lows are south of -40F, and their house is always perfectly comfortable. The shop (which is a shooting range too) is a kept at a cool 50F, but after about an hour of the lights on and moving about, it's in the 60's. Makes for easy winter vehicle maintenance, especially when you leave the vehicle in the building overnight... or better, their attached garage (63F).
I love it. But I've always loved radiant heat. Forced air is a painful system to live with (noise, maintenance, frequent repair costs... given that one radiant/boiler system I owned was over 100 years old and mostly original, not to mention simple Comfort of not having dust stirred up and air blowing on you when you don't want it). Necessary evil if you want AC though.
You are right. Its about preference. The average person dosent like 50 or 60 or even 70 degree room temp. 75 is closer to the mark. Many are cold at 80. Difficult to do with floor heat and generally takes a long time to warm up the space.
Forced air isnt noisy if installed correctly. Sometimes it is difficult to install correctly due to construction type or more common, architectural considerations. But a good architect will soon learn just how unhappy his customer will be with their beautiful house if it is miserable to live in so they consult with the HVAC contractor while in design stage.
Maintenance costs on all gas fire systems, either forced air or hot water are roughly the same. For the most part they use all the same controls so repair costs are similar too unless you chose a high end furnace with a variable speed fan motor. Glycol breaks down and needs to be replaced in hot water systems and is a considerable expense.
Many people who install floor heat end up installing an auxiliary forced air system eventually. Forced air systems will help to keep the air clean with even the most basic filter. Many people suffer from allergies especially in cold climates and the addition of a humidifier and good HEPA filter does wonders for these people. These are things you just cannot do with Floor heat. Indoor air quality is a big deal and is addressable with floor heat.
I made a lot of money replacing Radiant floor heat with forced air. Most people I worked with werent happy for many of the same reasons that the OP mentioned. I would assume that most of them werent installed well but many people just plain didnt like the utility expense. Most Installations I did saved near 50% in their fuel bills. Some saved nothing too just to be fair.
If someone is saving 50% on their fuel bills it's because of poor installation. They are probably losing a lot of heat to the ground because it wasn't insulated properly.
This can lead to more electric cost too because the pumps need to run more. Same thing if the distribution system is undersized, not only will you will get a cold room but it will increase the cost of electric because the pump needs to keep running. This is the case with any hydronic heating system, if you have radiators for example and not enough radiation they can't extract enough heat. The boiler if sized correctly isn't going to run anymore but the pumps will.
Generally speaking in floor radiant heat shouldn't cost you any more or less to run that anything else assuming the same fuel source.
You are right. Its about preference. The average person dosent like 50 or 60 or even 70 degree room temp. 75 is closer to the mark. Many are cold at 80. Difficult to do with floor heat and generally takes a long time to warm up the space.
It's slow to heat up but it's constant once it does and maintains a very even temperature. Properly installed and sized there is nothing you can't do with in floor compared to anything else.
Quote:
Glycol breaks down and needs to be replaced in hot water systems and is a considerable expense.
Unless you have outdoor boiler plain water is fine. The oxygen in boiler water is consumed and becomes "dead" and will no longer react with the metal. You want to make sure there is no leaks, even small ones. Very little or no fresh water should be needed.
Quote:
Many people who install floor heat end up installing an auxiliary forced air system eventually. Forced air systems will help to keep the air clean with even the most basic filter. Many people suffer from allergies especially in cold climates and the addition of a humidifier and good HEPA filter does wonders for these people. These are things you just cannot do with Floor heat. Indoor air quality is a big deal and is addressable with floor heat.
While you can add a filter forced air introduces it's own set of problems for air quality.
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