Are geothermal heating/cooling systems common in Houston? (Dallas, Austin: credit, how much)

[kpoeppel]

I've heard that electricity bills are quite high in Houston due to the need for air conditioning much of the year. Are people responding to this problem by installing geothermal systems in houses? Is it fairly easy to find a contractor that will install one? Are these systems cost-effective in Houston's climate and geology?

[Poltracker]

From what I understand, they are not cost effective in this climate. Solar is a better option in this climate. Check out FindSolar.com for info on PV systems it is run by the USDOE and others.

[cdelena]

I think the combination of higher initial costs and the requirement for land area have discouraged residential installations in Texas. We know they work well as many schools in the Austin area have used them for a good period of time. I do not know of any installations in the Houston area.

As I understand it Austin was the first school district to use geothermal heating and cooling systems on a large scale and it is considered a sucess.

[jfre81]

Wouldn't the frequent cloud cover make solar a bit inconsistent (if much cleaner than burning more fossil fuels)?

The area doesn't really lend itself to geothermal heating - it's not very hard to stay warm in the winter as it doesn't usually get very cold here (when it does it is mainly in streaks of a few days to a couple weeks and then it's 70 degrees again )

Cooling....there isn't much that's naturally cold in the land, water, air or under ground. This is a city on a sun-baked swamp. Air conditioning, using electricity generated in whichever fashion, is how we keep cool in the summertime.

Virtually every public building and most residential houses/units have central AC, or one or more window AC units. AC in cars is considered a luxury option most everywhere else, but it's pretty much a necessity.

[m27]

ive talked to a consultant at BNIM, and if i remember correctly the high cost for geothermal cooling in Houston is that the water table avg temp is about 75-76 degrees F. at a 10' depth. to get "A/C" temps, 65, you would need to go about 1000' or further.

a few ideas to help with your cooling costs is,

pre-cooling camber - set up all the A/C intake air to pass underground (below 10') at a distance = speed of air / heat exchange or x heat exhange of air. i forget the exact equation.

passive solar cooling and shading

if you have a really well insulated house your main problem is dehumidification

low MPH wind turbines

[Poltracker]

Originally Posted by jfre81

Wouldn't the frequent cloud cover make solar a bit inconsistent (if much cleaner than burning more fossil fuels)?

The area doesn't really lend itself to geothermal heating - it's not very hard to stay warm in the winter as it doesn't usually get very cold here (when it does it is mainly in streaks of a few days to a couple weeks and then it's 70 degrees again )

Cooling....there isn't much that's naturally cold in the land, water, air or under ground. This is a city on a sun-baked swamp. Air conditioning, using electricity generated in whichever fashion, is how we keep cool in the summertime.

Virtually every public building and most residential houses/units have central AC, or one or more window AC units. AC in cars is considered a luxury option most everywhere else, but it's pretty much a necessity.

Actually, solar is pretty good here in Houston. I forgot the effciency ratio but I know it would take aprroximately 600 sq ft of PV shingles to power my house (1350 sq ft, 1 occupant). The site I listed above has a calculator on it to figure out what you need. There are pretty good tax credits too and the state exempts (the added value part) solar improvements from property taxes. Been researching it for my roof replacement.

[kpoeppel]

I guess it makes sense that the ground is pretty warm there, unlike up here in PA. Solar is an interesting possibility, though...after all, you need air conditioning the most when the sun is beating down full force. I've heard that solar panels are very expensive, though. Poltracker, about how much would it cost for that 600 sq ft of solar panel shingles? Of course, they'd probably have to be hail-resistant for Texas thunderstorms and wind resistant for possible hurricanes...am I right?

[sidecar]

Originally Posted by m27

ive talked to a consultant at BNIM, and if i remember correctly the high cost for geothermal cooling in Houston is that the water table avg temp is about 75-76 degrees F. at a 10' depth. to get "A/C" temps, 65, you would need to go about 1000' or further.

Wouldn't it be more efficient to cool your condensing coil with 75 degree water than with 100 degree air on a hot summer day?
I am meeting with a contractor tomorrow to talk about a geothermal system for my beach house in Galveston. Not having an outside unit to rust in the salt air would be the biggest advantage in my mind. I will let me know more after I run the numbers.

[fordlover]

Originally Posted by m27

ive talked to a consultant at BNIM, and if i remember correctly the high cost for geothermal cooling in Houston is that the water table avg temp is about 75-76 degrees F. at a 10' depth. to get "A/C" temps, 65, you would need to go about 1000' or further.

I'm not sure I buy that. Earth (dirt) is an incredible insulator. I believe you'll find after digging down to just 10 feet below existing natural grade, you'll find fairly consistant tempatures across the US.

Even in the most extreme winter weather in the most northern part of the US, the Frost line is only 6 feet below grade. That means that despite being well below 0 degrees F for days the freezing air and precipitation can't penetrate more than 6 feet of dirt. Pretty incredible considering it's just dirt.

[alliedairtexas]

Let me clear all this up. I am a geothermal installer in Houston and yes it works well, and hundreds of systems are in use. Efficiency is about 30-40 SEER, about double the best conventional systems. Heating costs about 1/4 of gas heat costs.

Ground temp here is about 72 degrees year round. This means we do not need to use antifreeze in the system. Drilling loops avg 250-300 ft each per ton, and drilling is not tough here.

Cost is higher than coventional initially, but payback is in about 3-4 years. There is a 30% federal tax rebate on installed systems.

These systems are more commonin Dallas and Austin, just because they are being pushed there more by manufacturers. Now that those markets are set, Houston is next.

An investment that pays for itself many times over. In a 20 yr period. a typical 4 ton system will save over $70,000 in utilities.

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