What is Metro's plan to connect downtown to the HSR station? (Houston: transplants, hotel)

[LocalPlanner]

Originally Posted by Pine to Vine

Thanks for answering my question. This is incredibly short-sighted. Houston has always been myopic about mass transit. That’s a reason why Dallas has leapfrogged Houston when it comes to their light rail systems. While Houston’s congressmen were fighting against rail dollars to benefit their developer friends, who wanted to extend planned communities out to the horizons, Dallas was on a tear investing transit dollars into in its central core. Houston rail transit easily fell 20 years behind Dallas while doing so.

Anyone who thinks that the Northline Mall is a great place to dump off businessmen and tourists while Dallas delivers riders smack downtown is really just making excuses. Houston has a chance to do this right for a change, instead of, once again, falling behind Dallas. Houston used to be a can-do kind of place. It’s time to resurrect some of that spirit and complete this project as I’m sure it was initially envisioned.

What about all the travelers (business travelers especially) who are going to Plano/Frisco or Irving? Why does being dropped off downtown help them?

In that vein, why do travelers bound for Uptown (Houston's most important hotel area), Westchase, Memorial City, Energy Corridor, Greenway Plaza prefer to be dropped off Downtown?

[KerrTown]

Originally Posted by Pine to Vine

Anyone who thinks that the Northline Mall is a great place to dump off businessmen and tourists while Dallas delivers riders smack downtown is really just making excuses. Houston has a chance to do this right for a change, instead of, once again, falling behind Dallas. Houston used to be a can-do kind of place. It’s time to resurrect some of that spirit and complete this project as I’m sure it was initially envisioned.

Why make it easier for Dallas to siphon business away from Houston? I'm in favor of a Houston-centric Texas like a Chicago-centric Illinois.

Houston does need commuter rail since the park-n-ride buses are almost filled to capacity. The park-n-ride busses could be re-used to serve corridors between the rail lines with less demand.

The mayor of Houston has a responsibility to the citizens within city limits first, thus the concentration of light rail within the Inner Loop but not anything reaching the edges of city limits/suburbs. Also, Tom DeLay and John Culberson, two powerful Congressmen, have been detrimental to public transportation development in the Houston area. Culberson basically gave away the money for Dallas to build their light rail system with his opposition to the line connecting the Galleria to Greenway.

But I could see the wisdom of the former Northwest Mall being the location of the station. The Galleria is directly down the street, Downtown is not much further along the existing freight rail lines near the station, and the center of the metro is now BW-8 and I-10 currently (thus the raison d'être of CityCentre).

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

What about all the travelers (business travelers especially) who are going to Plano/Frisco or Irving?

Frisco/Plano is a very long drive, especially for a weary traveler.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by Pine to Vine

Thanks for answering my question. This is incredibly short-sighted. Houston has always been myopic about mass transit. That’s a reason why Dallas has leapfrogged Houston when it comes to their light rail systems. While Houston’s congressmen were fighting against rail dollars to benefit their developer friends, who wanted to extend planned communities out to the horizons, Dallas was on a tear investing transit dollars into in its central core. Houston rail transit easily fell 20 years behind Dallas while doing so.

Anyone who thinks that the Northline Mall is a great place to dump off businessmen and tourists while Dallas delivers riders smack downtown is really just making excuses. Houston has a chance to do this right for a change, instead of, once again, falling behind Dallas. Houston used to be a can-do kind of place. It’s time to resurrect some of that spirit and complete this project as I’m sure it was initially envisioned.

I think it should have been downtown, but NW Mall isn't a bad spot. Its better than Hobby or IAH. Its close to downtown, the Galleria and not far from the Energy Corridor.

[Mr. Clutch]

Originally Posted by Pine to Vine

Thanks for answering my question. This is incredibly short-sighted. Houston has always been myopic about mass transit. That’s a reason why Dallas has leapfrogged Houston when it comes to their light rail systems. While Houston’s congressmen were fighting against rail dollars to benefit their developer friends, who wanted to extend planned communities out to the horizons, Dallas was on a tear investing transit dollars into in its central core. Houston rail transit easily fell 20 years behind Dallas while doing so.

Anyone who thinks that the Northline Mall is a great place to dump off businessmen and tourists while Dallas delivers riders smack downtown is really just making excuses. Houston has a chance to do this right for a change, instead of, once again, falling behind Dallas. Houston used to be a can-do kind of place. It’s time to resurrect some of that spirit and complete this project as I’m sure it was initially envisioned.

I don't really think the decision to put the station at Northwest mall was Houston's decision as much as it was Texas Central's. Its much easier amd cheaper to run rail through South Dallas to downtown Dallas than it is through North Houston to downtown Houston due to ROW issues in Houston. North Houston is just denser and trickier to make a downtown station work with.

NW Mall is far from a bad location - keep in mind that if it becomes a new public transit hub, its better located with respect to Houston's primary business centers than Downtown Dallas is in the context of DFW business centers. Not an ideal location but far from the end of the world. Most HSR stations worldwide are not located downtown.

[Jimmy1953]

Originally Posted by KerrTown

Why make it easier for Dallas to siphon business away from Houston? I'm in favor of a Houston-centric Texas like a Chicago-centric Illinois.

Houston does need commuter rail since the park-n-ride buses are almost filled to capacity. The park-n-ride busses could be re-used to serve corridors between the rail lines with less demand.

The mayor of Houston has a responsibility to the citizens within city limits first, thus the concentration of light rail within the Inner Loop but not anything reaching the edges of city limits/suburbs. Also, Tom DeLay and John Culberson, two powerful Congressmen, have been detrimental to public transportation development in the Houston area. Culberson basically gave away the money for Dallas to build their light rail system with his opposition to the line connecting the Galleria to Greenway.

But I could see the wisdom of the former Northwest Mall being the location of the station. The Galleria is directly down the street, Downtown is not much further along the existing freight rail lines near the station, and the center of the metro is now BW-8 and I-10 currently (thus the raison d'être of CityCentre).



Frisco/Plano is a very long drive, especially for a weary traveler.

DART Red Line train goes to Plano. https://www.dart.org/maps/currentand...ervicesmap.asp

Frisco has their Frisco Shuttle. http://www.friscoshuttle.com

[DabOnEm]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

What about all the travelers (business travelers especially) who are going to Plano/Frisco or Irving? Why does being dropped off downtown help them?

In that vein, why do travelers bound for Uptown (Houston's most important hotel area), Westchase, Memorial City, Energy Corridor, Greenway Plaza prefer to be dropped off Downtown?

Because despite how much business goes on in the suburbs, Downtown Dallas is still the largest business district with the most conventions and hotels. Same goes for Downtown Houston. There are multiple rail lines for the people in the areas you mentioned to get there after the high speed rail drops them off in Downtown Dallas. With the way Houston is laid out, Downtown makes even more sense, especially if the University Line ever got off the ground.

NW Mall isn't the worst site but it's not the best site.

[dallasboi]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

What about all the travelers (business travelers especially) who are going to Plano/Frisco or Irving? Why does being dropped off downtown help them?

In that vein, why do travelers bound for Uptown (Houston's most important hotel area), Westchase, Memorial City, Energy Corridor, Greenway Plaza prefer to be dropped off Downtown?

Because Our local DART rail will be connected to the HSR. And it will take them to Irving or Plano once they arrive.

[Jack Lance]

Originally Posted by dallasboi

Because Our local DART rail will be connected to the HSR. And it will take them to Irving or Plano once they arrive.

So the purpose of this HSR line is so people can commute from Plano or Irving into Houston's Uptown ?

[Pine to Vine]

Dallas is making a much smarter decision than Houston by placing its HSR station downtown. Most of the responses here seem to express resignation that the route will terminate at Northest Mall rather than genuine excitement. As Dab posted earlier, however, there is still time for the powers to be to make a more sensible decision.

[Jack Lance]

Originally Posted by Pine to Vine

Dallas is making a much smarter decision than Houston by placing its HSR station downtown. Most of the responses here seem to express resignation that the route will terminate at Northest Mall rather than genuine excitement. As Dab posted earlier, however, there is still time for the powers to be to make a more sensible decision.

Pine it is not Houston that is making this decision. Texas Central doesn't want to spend the money for the inner loop ROW or deal with the political resistance to bring the HSR into downtown Houston.


I seriously doubt this will ever be built without public assistance or at least public guarantee's and that ain't happening...