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Examples such as damage being done. I don’t have to give examples of slavery, raping natives, taking land, discounting them as citizens and so forth. We all know the damage is done here and that’s the root cause of the racial-ethnic wealth distribution. But what are examples to fix this. Investing into better schools of vulnerable areas is the most obvious. Fair treatment for i economic incubators and so forth. It was ironically made a much bigger priority before then it is now. Biden has publicly spoken to such organizations and turned down any compromise yet.
Examples such as damage being done. I don’t have to give examples of slavery, raping natives, taking land, discounting them as citizens and so forth. We all know the damage is done here and that’s the root cause of the racial-ethnic wealth distribution. But what are examples to fix this. Investing into better schools of vulnerable areas is the most obvious. Fair treatment for i economic incubators and so forth. It was ironically made a much bigger priority before then it is now. Biden has publicly spoken to such organizations and turned down any compromise yet.
Youre not addressing the argument you made which was "Biden hasn’t even fully explained his intentions on immigration.". Those are your words. He listed extensively on his website what his intentions on immigration are so that is simply incorrect.
Then you said, "The biggest issues in black and Hispanic communities are the ones that aren’t listed in policies." and that "organizations that have reached out to Trump and Biden both to address them and as of now, both have failed miserably to even compromise.". Thats a completely different argument, but ok. Lets look at specific examples of what youre talking about so we can get to the bottom of what Biden is missing.
Then you said "I don’t have to give examples of slavery, raping natives, taking land, discounting them as citizens and so forth.". Thats you moving the goal posts to a completely different argument. Those are horrible things but they have NOTHING to do with Joe Biden's modern day immigration intentions.
We are talking about immigration. If you have examples to give to show that Joe Biden hasnt shown his clear intentions based on groups hes spoken to about IMMIGRATION, then show them. Otherwise, you have to back off that argument because it simply wouldnt be true.
I think what he said was that he wanted to make a plan to transition away from fossil fuels. That is different than saying he wanted to close down the energy industry. Can you imagine the energy industry being in fossil fuels forever? If so why? If not, don't you think it's smart to think about how to transition the industry toward something else? I mean, if the resource of oil is finite, the industry is literally going to disappear unless it transitions to more infinite resources like wind and solar. How did we every get it in our heads that planning for the future is ideologically bad?
He tried to walk back the comment, which doesn't have the support of all Dems. Amusing he said nobody would lose their job because new jobs would be created in other alternatives. Sure.
Youre not addressing the argument you made which was "Biden hasn’t even fully explained his intentions on immigration.". Those are your words. He listed extensively on his website what his intentions on immigration are so that is simply incorrect.
Then you said, "The biggest issues in black and Hispanic communities are the ones that aren’t listed in policies." and that "organizations that have reached out to Trump and Biden both to address them and as of now, both have failed miserably to even compromise.". Thats a completely different argument, but ok. Lets look at specific examples of what youre talking about so we can get to the bottom of what Biden is missing.
Then you said "I don’t have to give examples of slavery, raping natives, taking land, discounting them as citizens and so forth.". Thats you moving the goal posts to a completely different argument. Those are horrible things but they have NOTHING to do with Joe Biden's modern day immigration intentions.
We are talking about immigration. If you have examples to give to show that Joe Biden hasnt shown his clear intentions based on groups hes spoken to about IMMIGRATION, then show them. Otherwise, you have to back off that argument because it simply wouldnt be true.
False. Every president is tied in while the damage is done. We aren’t expecting anyone to solve the damages overnight or in 4-8 years. But we expect progress, and we’ve severely fallen behind well before Trump’s turn. This “policy” Biden has listed on hid campaign website only taps into the surface. Which yes, as I’ve repeatedly said, Trump is worse in his stance. I have not once said Biden isn’t better except for once as a typo that I fixed. Defunding a well fixed tax dollars with little use as a fence isn’t stopping much. In fact not a single “promise” you listed solves the real issue at hand which is what to do with immigration. At the end of the day we all know why it’s hard to take on immigration. Because we want the immigrant labor force. And while free citizenship for all isn’t really reasonable, one could implement sanctuary cities combined with labor laws for immigrants to prevent labor abuse. Plus with a promise of not deporting( this would put them at better position to possibly even pay taxes. It’s our countries fault they aren’t able to. Again, not denying Trump’s policies make it harder, but Biden’s is far from solving it or tapping into the problem at hand.
Everything else I’ve mentioned I look into a candidate before voting isn’t being addressed. And I stand by my previous response of president being responsible for progress for the damage done by former presidents. Not solving it but Atleast getting to progress. That’s who I’m voting for. Unfortunately I don’t see any of this in Biden. I do love his take on funding green energy projects. I’m just not convinced on that to ignore the rest yet.
Also, I didn’t randomly speak on damage from our history. I mentioned it earlier in the thread. You can scroll up, I just didn’t elaborate on it. Clearly we both agree Biden is the lesser of the evils. If to you, he’s enough of a lesser to get your vote, that’s completely okay. But I don’t agree.
False. Every president is tied in while the damage is done. We aren’t expecting anyone to solve the damages overnight or in 4-8 years. But we expect progress, and we’ve severely fallen behind well before Trump’s turn. This “policy” Biden has listed on hid campaign website only taps into the surface. Which yes, as I’ve repeatedly said, Trump is worse in his stance. I have not once said Biden isn’t better except for once as a typo that I fixed. Defunding a well fixed tax dollars with little use as a fence isn’t stopping much. In fact not a single “promise” you listed solves the real issue at hand which is what to do with immigration. At the end of the day we all know why it’s hard to take on immigration. Because we want the immigrant labor force. And while free citizenship for all isn’t really reasonable, one could implement sanctuary cities combined with labor laws for immigrants to prevent labor abuse. Plus with a promise of not deporting( this would put them at better position to possibly even pay taxes. It’s our countries fault they aren’t able to. Again, not denying Trump’s policies make it harder, but Biden’s is far from solving it or tapping into the problem at hand.
Everything else I’ve mentioned I look into a candidate before voting isn’t being addressed. And I stand by my previous response of president being responsible for progress for the damage done by former presidents. Not solving it but Atleast getting to progress. That’s who I’m voting for. Unfortunately I don’t see any of this in Biden. I do love his take on funding green energy projects. I’m just not convinced on that to ignore the rest yet.
Also, I didn’t randomly speak on damage from our history. I mentioned it earlier in the thread. You can scroll up, I just didn’t elaborate on it. Clearly we both agree Biden is the lesser of the evils. If to you, he’s enough of a lesser to get your vote, that’s completely okay. But I don’t agree.
Dude, youre working too hard.
I asked you simply to show what you were actually talking about because you said "The biggest issues in black and Hispanic communities are the ones that aren’t listed in policies." and that "organizations that have reached out to Trump and Biden both to address them and as of now, both have failed miserably to even compromise."
Im not asking you to justify why you want to vote third party, but I cannot understand your argument unless you actually can show that its real. For the record, your argument is that Biden spoke to groups about immigration and refused to compromise. That is what you need to address, not why you personally feel the way you do. Im not trying to convince you to feel any different way, but Im also not going to make your argument for you. Dont tell me to Google it or do research. You made that claim, you need to be specific about which immigration based groups Biden refused to listen to.
But thats not causation. Florida is a purple state and its black/white wealth gap is better than Georgia or North Carolina.
Being a blue, red, or purple state has nothing to do with how the black/white wealth gap plays out. There is no statistical causation that can be drawn:
I get the idea that enough change has not occurred so the desire to burn it all down and rebuild it is tempting. Here is the problem: it will never happen. Whatever changes are to be implemented have to be voted in through elected politicians. That means you have to convince a large portion of the American public of those changes. Tearing it down to start over will never fly with a majority of voters.
I also get that the two party system is annoying. I dont like it either. I wouldnt mind seeing the Republicans split into two parties: Conservatives and Libertarians and the Democrats do the same: Socialists and Moderates. But for now we have to work with what we have. We have a binary system whether we like it or not.
As for the Democrats and vulnerable communities, yes they do fall way short. But I must point out that there is a difference between an imperfect acquaintance and an enemy. For disadvantaged communities of color, immigrants, and the LGBTQ community, Republican policies are negative. Democratic policies often dont go far enough and are misguided, but at the very least their policies are far less negative to those groups.
I’m not suggesting tear it down because that’s impossible. But at some point American will evolve into something different. I mean it’s happening right before our eyes. Prior to the 1990s you had liberal Republicans and Conservative Democrats. These 2 parties have adapted to their base while causing more of a ridge between voters. I’ve never seen partisan animosity this high. It’s gotten that out of control so much so that they’re could be serious consequences after elections are over. Both sides are guilty of this.
Take for instance countries like Germany and Ireland have transitioned there political landscape. The Green Party in the EU is making an impact. But I understand, America imo is more ass backwards. Of course it’s not perfect but it’s more political representation then what we have here in America. Allegedly one of the most diverse countries in the Western world yet no so much when it comes to who’s in office and the three branches of government.
As far as the blue/purple/red bit, what I’m saying is neither party in any state has stepped to the plate to deliver on a promise to better the conditions of its most vulnerable communities. By and large I have not seen the benefit of either party.
Now you say the Democrats policies are far less negative than Republican policies. Are you sure about that?
I can tell you that the welfare reforms and crime bill under the Clinton administration did far worse or just as much negatively than any policy the Republicans pass.
I mean Democrats have gone out there way to distance themselves from creating any policies that are specifically for my community. Barrack for instance made it a point to say he’s not Black Americans president but America’s president. So on one hand while the Affordable Care Act did help Black Americans he also enacted policies that actually triggered a decline in Black wealth in this country. And he had the power to change it but chose not to.
And these are not opinions. I’m not impressed by promises made during election year. I’m all about holding politicians accountable. I’ll admit, Black Americans haven’t held Democrats accountable enough. Majority don’t even vote Republican so of course they’re not going to do anything. They’re going to pander to their base.
I’m not suggesting tear it down because that’s impossible. But at some point American will evolve into something different. I mean it’s happening right before our eyes. Prior to the 1990s you had liberal Republicans and Conservative Democrats. These 2 parties have adapted to their base while causing more of a ridge between voters. I’ve never seen partisan animosity this high. It’s gotten that out of control so much so that they’re could be serious consequences after elections are over. Both sides are guilty of this.
Take for instance countries like Germany and Ireland have transitioned there political landscape. The Green Party in the EU is making an impact. But I understand, America imo is more ass backwards. Of course it’s not perfect but it’s more political representation then what we have here in America. Allegedly one of the most diverse countries in the Western world yet no so much when it comes to who’s in office and the three branches of government.
As far as the blue/purple/red bit, what I’m saying is neither party in any state has stepped to the plate to deliver on a promise to better the conditions of its most vulnerable communities. By and large I have not seen the benefit of either party.
Now you say the Democrats policies are far less negative than Republican policies. Are you sure about that?
I can tell you that the welfare reforms and crime bill under the Clinton administration did far worse or just as much negatively than any policy the Republicans pass.
I mean Democrats have gone out there way to distance themselves from creating any policies that are specifically for my community. Barrack for instance made it a point to say he’s not Black Americans president but America’s president. So on one hand while the Affordable Care Act did help Black Americans he also enacted policies that actually triggered a decline in Black wealth in this country. And he had the power to change it but chose not to.
And these are not opinions. I’m not impressed by promises made during election year. I’m all about holding politicians accountable. I’ll admit, Black Americans haven’t held Democrats accountable enough. Majority don’t even vote Republican so of course they’re not going to do anything. They’re going to pander to their base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by As Above So Below...
Dude, youre working too hard.
I asked you simply to show what you were actually talking about because you said "The biggest issues in black and Hispanic communities are the ones that aren’t listed in policies." and that "organizations that have reached out to Trump and Biden both to address them and as of now, both have failed miserably to even compromise."
Im not asking you to justify why you want to vote third party, but I cannot understand your argument unless you actually can show that its real. For the record, your argument is that Biden spoke to groups about immigration and refused to compromise. That is what you need to address, not why you personally feel the way you do. Im not trying to convince you to feel any different way, but Im also not going to make your argument for you. Dont tell me to Google it or do research. You made that claim, you need to be specific about which immigration based groups Biden refused to listen to.
My argument is that Biden doesn’t address the real problem (doesn’t mean Trump doesn’t either). You’re argument is that they’re policies are better than Trump’s. Both are true. At the end, I won’t give up my vote for something that’s only less worse while it ignores the real problem at hand (explained in my previous comment).
On Biden, speaking with organization leaders and refusing to compromise or take a stance there enough evidence of. I prefer not to mention the organizations because they’re unfortunately still viewed as “reverse racism” which will start something else.
could be 3/4 hour lines to vote, many will just go home.
Nope. Every single person I talk to that is going to vote, is going to do WHATEVER it takes to vote. Myself included.
While I've never missed an election, or walked away from voting due to a crowd, I also never faced hour long waits. And I can't honestly say what I would have done had there been an hour or two wait in years past.
This time, I went prepared to wait as long as needed to vote. NOTHING was going to prevent me from voting. And I think tens of millions feel the same way.
At some point, you have to do whatever it takes to make change happen.
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