People Say Houston's ugly but not cities like Chicago, NYC, etc? (Dallas: gardens, friendly)

[jaycich]

Originally Posted by biscuit_head

Implying that all of Philadelphia is an ugly city is no better than the Swedish lady saying all of Houston is ugly. Philly is very rough around the edges, but there are some very nice parts to the city. When it's nice, its nice, but when it's bad, it's bad. That stretch of I-95 through Chester is one of the most grim and depressing drives I've had the displeasure of driving. Philly also has a historical charm that Houston lacks. Natural setting is subjective, since some people prefer the Gulf Coast/Piney Woods environment Houston offers, others may prefer the Piedmont/Delaware Valley environment of Philadelphia. It sounds as if the lady prefers a more traditional older city environment as opposed to the newer, autocentric environment of Houston. Probably because those are the types of cities she's accustomed to since she's from Europe. The two cities have such different aesthetics and layouts, they're not even remotely comparable. Be that as it may, I always thought Houston and Philly were kindred spirits because they're often overlooked and seen as "underdog" cities compared to the more glamourous, hip cities out there...but there's so much more to them.



That sounds a lot more like San Francisco or Los Angeles than Philadelphia, I used to live in Hawthorne, near LAX and I was paying a lot of money for a hovel that was owned by a slumlord, but hey, I lived 20 minutes from the beach I didn't hate Los Angeles as much as I thought I would, and it certainly has the potential to be so much more than it is in terms of having a walkable, urban environment throughout the city, but a lot of the city where the "rest of us" live is pretty dirty and looks like it needs to be power-washed. Give me "generic," shiny and new Houston any day before returning to that again. Can I still drive my Tesla in Texas (if I ever get one) if I move there?

I never said all of philly was ugly. Picture you and I riding through this area and me telling you this is the ugliest city. https://www.google.com/search?q=nice...sFr-y19fk_rCM:

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by jaycich

I never said all of philly was ugly. Picture you and I riding through this area and me telling you this is the ugliest city. https://www.google.com/search?q=nice...sFr-y19fk_rCM:

Can't knock Philly, and I never meant to imply that it was all ugly, just that I think there is a double standard that always pits Houston's best, in this case the Heights, with a city like Philly that likewise has a lot of blight too. All the stuff Philly has that might be considered ugly is overlooked in favor of it's appeal to the urban purists standards.

[jaycich]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

Yes I didn't mean to imply that it was Philly but just that people have this strange rejection of newer modern things in favor of the older, trashier but more dense and urban environments because they believe it's "real", while Houston's urbanity is "cookie cutter", "fake", "shiny", "too corporate", etc.

I guess it all depends on your perspective. I remember getting a shuttle ride to LAX and the driver of the van was from South LA and when I told him I was headed to Houston, he asked me about it. He wouldn't stop asking questions and I kept telling him about the area where I used to live and how it was and he was giving a lot of thought to moving. I asked him why, you live in LA, it's gorgeous, the weather, the scenery, the life, and he said that it wasn't enough for him to stay. He wanted something more tangible and that LA wasn't for him.

I also wonder about how much race plays a part into the perspective. It isn't always the case but a lot of African Americans I met in LA or are already in Houston, really like Houston. They have no qualms with it. Most prefer it to Austin. When I talk to white yuppies they say all this crap about Houston and think LA or Austin are the bees knees and act as though Houston offends their sensibilities. As though it's an abomination to urban environments everywhere.

This might be the intangible qualities vs tangible qualities debate Houston seems to elicit from different people with differing perspectives.

That's pretty accurate in my experience too.

[LocalPlanner]

Please, no more palm trees, unless they're the Canary palms like along Post Oak Boulevard.

The ones along Westheimer in Highland Village - the tall skinny type - make that area look trashy. Keep the palms out of anywhere north of Ellington Field.

Regular deciduous trees are what's needed. Texas cypress is OK too.

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by jaycich

That's pretty accurate in my experience too.

I am generalizing and going completely off anecdotal evidence of course, but whenever I talk to them about Houston they think it's a cool city, it's OK, or they really like it. There is usually never this visceral knee jerk reaction that I usually see come from non-minorities who are also upwardly mobile urban professionals. It's usually these types that seem to think there is some sort of set standard for a proper urban environment and they think cities such as Houston are just terrible in this regard. And the fact that Houston continues to develop how it wants to without heeding to the urban purist mantra just annoys them more. The city isn't learning from their past mistakes, according to them!

[biscuit_head]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

I also wonder about how much race plays a part into the perspective. It isn't always the case but a lot of African Americans I met in LA or are already in Houston, really like Houston. They have no qualms with it. Most prefer it to Austin. When I talk to white yuppies they say all this crap about Houston and think LA or Austin are the bees knees and act as though Houston offends their sensibilities. As though it's an abomination to urban environments everywhere.

This might be the intangible qualities vs tangible qualities debate Houston seems to elicit from different people with differing perspectives.

Black Californians and Black Texans have very strong connections with each other due to migration from TX to CA from the 50s to the 70s. So there's a familiarity with Houston and DFW since those are the largest metro areas with the largest black populations in Texas. A lot of them have relatives and/or friends who've relocated to those cities in Texas, so they have a general idea of what life is like there. It's similar to the connections between Blacks in the Northeast Corridor and the Southeast metros like Atlanta and Charlotte. Most black people I knew in LA who wanted to leave the state either looked to Las Vegas or Houston as destinations. Austin was not on the radar for most of them. A few white yuppie and hipster types I knew in LA and Atlanta (where I previously lived) looked at me like I had a third head when I said I preferred Houston or Dallas as oppposed to Austin. I wasn't in the mood for a racial discussion with these people, so I only said that I felt I'd have more cultural connections living in Houston or DFW as opposed to Austin or San Antonio...definitely an intangible, nuanced quality that isnt understood by those who view things strictly through an "urban lifestyle" lens...

I can only speak on my perspective as a Black man, but I'm sure Hispanics and Asians who are familiar with both California and Texas have perspectives they can speak on on the intangible qualities that attract them to Houston and other parts of the state. Look at the fast growing population of second generation Vietnamese who have migrated to Houston from Southern California over the past decade or so.

[radiolibre99]

Originally Posted by biscuit_head

Black Californians and Black Texans have very strong connections with each other due to migration from TX to CA from the 50s to the 70s. So there's a familiarity with Houston and DFW since those are the largest metro areas with the largest black populations in Texas. A lot of them have relatives and/or friends who've relocated to those cities in Texas, so they have a general idea of what life is like there. It's similar to the connections between Blacks in the Northeast Corridor and the Southeast metros like Atlanta and Charlotte. Most black people I knew in LA who wanted to leave the state either looked to Las Vegas or Houston as destinations. Austin was not on the radar for most of them. A few white yuppie and hipster types I knew in LA and Atlanta (where I previously lived) looked at me like I had a third head when I said I preferred Houston or Dallas as oppposed to Austin. I wasn't in the mood for a racial discussion with these people, so I only said that I felt I'd have more cultural connections living in Houston or DFW as opposed to Austin or San Antonio...definitely an intangible, nuanced quality that isnt understood by those who view things strictly through an "urban lifestyle" lens...

That explains a lot. I could see that. A lot of AAs I meet in CA seem to have relatives in Texas or Louisiana, especially the latter.

But I get that look that you mentioned from my co-workers who think Austin is the best city in Texas. I try to tell them that Houston is the most diverse, cosmopolitan and more like LA in terms of largeness and amenities and they just cannot fathom it. I don't know what it is about having annoyingly quirky and kitschy development that makes a city better than a real metropolitan city, but I do wonder how much popular tastes and standards are modeled after hipster preferences.

[radiolibre99]

I can only speak on my perspective as a Black man, but I'm sure Hispanics and Asians who are familiar with both California and Texas have perspectives they can speak on on the intangible qualities. Look at the fast growing population of second generation Vietnamese who migrated to Houston from Southern California.

It all depends but again going by anecdotal evidence alone, most minorities I have spoken to love Houston over Austin. It starts to vary depending on the race/ethnicity but I've come to see that they can see the actual real world urban qualities of a large city such as Houston over media hype and hipster kitschyness.

[biscuit_head]

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

That explains a lot. I could see that. A lot of AAs I meet in CA seem to have relatives in Texas or Louisiana, especially the latter.

But I get that look that you mentioned from my co-workers who think Austin is the best city in Texas. I try to tell them that Houston is the most diverse, cosmopolitan and more like LA in terms of largeness and amenities and they just cannot fathom it. I don't know what it is about having annoyingly quirky and kitschy development that makes a city better than a real metropolitan city, but I do wonder how much popular tastes and standards are modeled after hipster preferences.

And I bet they've never been to Houston to really even know, or think that a trip to SXSW in Austin is representative of the city the entire year.

Originally Posted by radiolibre99

It all depends but again going by anecdotal evidence alone, most minorities I have spoken to love Houston over Austin. It starts to vary depending on the race/ethnicity but I've come to see that they can see the actual real world urban qualities of a large city such as Houston over media hype and hipster kitschyness.

^ Yep. All of this.

[Gunion Powder]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

Please, no more palm trees, unless they're the Canary palms like along Post Oak Boulevard.

The ones along Westheimer in Highland Village - the tall skinny type - make that area look trashy. Keep the palms out of anywhere north of Ellington Field.

Regular deciduous trees are what's needed. Texas cypress is OK too.

With exception of cypress, most deciduous trees don't do well in Houston, though. If they give any fall color at all, it comes around Christmas or the leaves just turn an ugly brown and leave things looking dead. If Houston were located further north in East Texas then I could see it.

I can't imagine why anyone would be opposed to more palms being planted in a southern coastal city. Canary palms are big, beautiful plants but are an invasive species. I would love for Houston to make our state's native sabal the Texas palmetto a signature tree. And take down all of those disgusting Baja palms that look dramatically out of place.

I do love the conical look of cypress when they're planted in rows. Houston needs more of them as well.