Arizona's Immigration Law for Houston (Howe: house, unemployment, buy)

[SouthmoreAve]

Originally Posted by studiobtm

I have friends that have been waiting 20 years for a chance to get into the US. A "heavy fine" doesn't cut it.

And you would have 30 million - not 1 million new "citizens" - a majority of whom are ready to take advantage of every free social service available (and generally already are).

Obviously, we wouldn't allow just any illegal immigrants, I specifically said that we should only allow the ones who have NO criminal history, who have made an effort to speak english and continiuing to do so, etc.

Basically the good ones, who deserve a chance to be productive citizens in the US, so thats why I said at least a million. No way is it the entire illegal population, and it probably is more than that 1/30, but I know theres at least that many good ones.

Your letting your disliking of the stereotypical illegal immigrant hinder your sight of giving people a chance.
(^If your going to reply with something like they should done it the correct way, don't bother.)

The point is, they're all here, we can deport them all, but what about the good illegal immigrants, hard-working, speaking english, wanting their children to succeed, who, again are already here, and they'll be as good of a citizen as any, so what's so bad that they can't get some sort of punishment, like paying some sort of monetary value for their years as illegals, and just let them become citizens. They have the same American dream that some of our ancestors had, the same ones we have, if we haven't attained it already, and they will continue to have that dream.

After that, I say we all can try to make illegal immigration tougher, but not before we fix the problem here.
Theres 2 ways to do this, and we got to pick one of them, because working on both at the same time is clearly not working.
A. We fix our border issues to stop illegal immigration in some manner, THEN work on some sort of way to deport illegal immigrants, preferably my way.
B. See above, just flip the order.

[chris_ut]

The reason people do not want enforcement of the law is because the law as it stands is stupid, it restricts immigration far under the demand of US businesses and households for cheap immigrant labor thus forcing immigrant workers onto the black market where they can be exploited more easily. You can easily spot someone who knows nothing at all about immigration because they start spouting about how illegal immigrants want to come here and exploit the US for our benefit programs. The truth is exactly the opposite, businesses, farmers and indirectly homeowners want the system so that they can exploit the immigrants labor. Yes immigrants use some social services but they still pay sales tax, property tax and many pay their income tax through ITINs and their SSN tax under a fake social (which the IRS keeps of course). In return everyone gets cheaper food, cheaper building prices and cheap lawn care. People also claim illegals are taking citizens jobs, yet you don't see any citizens standing at Home Depot fighting for day laborer work. Of course you might claim that citizens can't live on illegals low wages but that is the whole point of the system isn't it.

[glorplaxy]

Originally Posted by chris_ut

People also claim illegals are taking citizens jobs, yet you don't see any citizens standing at Home Depot fighting for day laborer work. Of course you might claim that citizens can't live on illegals low wages but that is the whole point of the system isn't it.

This is one thing I really have a problem with.

People are always saying how Americans wouldn't do the jobs that illegal immigrants take, yet Americans were happily doing those jobs before the massive wave of illegal immigrants from Mexico and Latin America. Americans still do the jobs typically associated with illegal immigrants in places like Maine where pretty much everyone is white.

Of course they get paid less, and that really is a double-edged blade because on one side you have the employers who are purposely undercutting Americans by only hiring foreigners, but those employers would have no one to hire if the illegals weren't here in the first place. We are a nation of laws and while I don't support every single law, I think minimum wage is a good one.

I think chris_ut's mindset is very wrong on many levels. This mindset is basically saying that's it's OK to undercut our own uneducated American population so that uneducated foreigners can take the lowly manual labor jobs. We have more than enough uneducated labor here to do those jobs. We should be taking care of uneducated Americans, not uneducated foreigners. A good capitalist society will always need a lower, uneducated class, yet we are purposely leaving our own perfectly-able American lower-class behind.

[glorplaxy]

I don't really support this bill. I don't think it's completely there.

However, I don't support illegal immigration, either, but I can understand why people would want to illegally immigrate.

And, I don't think it would be the worst thing in the world to be racially profiled and simply asked for some papers. I have spent a lot of time in Mexico and am going back for over a month soon. In Mexico, it is illegal for foreign nationals to be without documentation on them and I have been stopped by police many times who have asked to see my papers. It really was not that painful. I took out my paper, showed it, and all was right because I had proved that I was in the country legally.

I think the only thing this law should really target is day-laborers. I really do not approve of that.

[usc619]

Originally Posted by chris_ut

The reason people do not want enforcement of the law is because the law as it stands is stupid, it restricts immigration far under the demand of US businesses and households for cheap immigrant labor thus forcing immigrant workers onto the black market where they can be exploited more easily. You can easily spot someone who knows nothing at all about immigration because they start spouting about how illegal immigrants want to come here and exploit the US for our benefit programs. The truth is exactly the opposite, businesses, farmers and indirectly homeowners want the system so that they can exploit the immigrants labor. Yes immigrants use some social services but they still pay sales tax, property tax and many pay their income tax through ITINs and their SSN tax under a fake social (which the IRS keeps of course). In return everyone gets cheaper food, cheaper building prices and cheap lawn care. People also claim illegals are taking citizens jobs, yet you don't see any citizens standing at Home Depot fighting for day laborer work. Of course you might claim that citizens can't live on illegals low wages but that is the whole point of the system isn't it.

No mention of how Illegal immigrants are driving down the blue collar living wages that companies would other wise have to pay and people wonder why the gap between the rich and the poor continues to grow lol

What US citizen in their right mind would want to work under those conditions and wages? There's two side to that story and both are wrong!

[SunFl0wer]

Arizona's Immigration Law for Houston

If the Federal government isn't doing very much (if anything) about the illegal problem in America, I certainly wouldn't blame any state, county, city, or unincorporated area, which is attempting to protect itself from this situation, when they enact their own laws.

[MrSykes]

Originally Posted by glorplaxy

This is one thing I really have a problem with.

People are always saying how Americans wouldn't do the jobs that illegal immigrants take, yet Americans were happily doing those jobs because the massive wave of illegal immigrants from Mexico and Latin America. Americans still do the jobs typically associated with illegal immigrants in places like Maine where pretty much everyone is white.

Indeed. No one can convince me that Americans won't do the jobs that illegal immigrants do when I see consistently see a line of Americans outside the Labor Ready downtown at 2:30-3:00 in the morning looking for work.

[Cathy4017]

Originally Posted by alidoremi

On the contrary. I would LOVE it if Texas would have the same law, and I'd be so out of this 'so-open-minded-that-your-brains-leaked-out', liberal state of California tomorrow.

I am a legal immigrant and have a green card, which the law says I'm required to carry with me at all times. I find it OFFENSIVE that people choose to break the law, then complain when they must pay the consequences of their actions.

I say, round 'em all up and ship 'em back to Mexico.

And...it's people like you who should be the most PO'ed over illegal immigration, period.

Those who have done it the right way should be mad as hell at every illegal alien in this country.

If TX does not get on the ball and pass a measure just as stringent as AZ, we are going to be in even more deep doodoo than now. They're going to come here in droves.

[Houston321]

[quote=chris_ut;13987845]The reason people do not want enforcement of the law is because the law as it stands is stupid
Wow, so we should get to pick and choose which laws to follow based on if a person deems it "stupid?"

Also, many of us, do want enforcement of the law.

[chris_ut]

[quote=Houston321;13990544]

Originally Posted by chris_ut

The reason people do not want enforcement of the law is because the law as it stands is stupid
Wow, so we should get to pick and choose which laws to follow based on if a person deems it "stupid?"

Also, many of us, do want enforcement of the law.

Have you ever exceeded the posted speed limit or crossed the street where there was not a crosswalk? If so you have chosen to violate a law that you didn't agree with or that was inconvenient to you.