U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Idaho
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Old 04-16-2015, 06:59 PM
8,440 posts, read 12,836,134 times
Reputation: 6283


This whole "experience" I don't know what else to call it given all the bizarre twists and turns) is more bizarre to me than fiction. I honestly don't know that a skilled writer could get all the twists and turns included in one book.

As Boisefan, I believe it was, suggested, maybe money as in campaign donations did play a bigger role than we know. I saw the publication of who donated to Gov. Otter's re-election. Most easily written, the owners of Double Down/ Intermountain Racing were the only ones connected to horse racing who did NOT. Since the day this bill was returned to the Legislature, Otter has singled out Double Down.

For those not in the east side of the state, this gets even more twisted. Double Down had a letter from the City of Idaho Falls saying there were no problems. But one of the Legislators who has been dogmatic about them upped the ante last week. He said they didn't have enough in writing from Bonneville County (8B), where the Sandy Downs Race Track is. He told the Bernards, that he had served as a Bonneville County Commissioner, he knew they didn't have enough whatever from the county.

Tomorrow will be the deadline for the Bernards to have met with the Bonneville County Commissioners. They canceled their appt. scheduled for last Friday at the last minute. There has been nothing in the media since then.

Can this get stranger yet? Yes! Mike knows from what I've written about the Idaho Falls City Council and Mayor Casper that she is having a bit of a rough time lately. She made it worse on a conference call this past week. She implied the Bonneville County Commissioners could meet with the Bernards most days because they never really adjourned their meetings. Not what the 8B Commissioners wanted to hear. Mayor Casper apologized.

To be fair, I honesty believe both Mayor Casper and the 8B Commissioners are fair. They know these are real jobs and entertainment for the area. Additionally, in a way that neither Boise or Couer d' Alene experience, Idaho Falls is the retail/medical hub for western WY. The local elected officials know how much revenue comes from WY. It is especially a bitter pill for city and county leaders to swallow since WY is listed as having Historical Horse Racing (HHR). They can quickly add the losses economically if horse racing and HHR go to WY.

Furthermore, I hope Mayor Casper, who has had a somewhat tight connection with the Gov. won't try to bail Otter out of almost certain litigation from the C'd A Tribe and throw locals under the bus. After all, it was her Parks and Recreation Director who wrote the letter stating the appropriate conditions had been met, at the time, to open Double Down. I think the 8B Commissioners will be fair. These two governing bodies don't need to bail out Otter or the Legislature out of the difficulties they created. State Gov. is responsible for their actions, not the county or city.

As a different secondary issue I'm not sure what I think about Boise residents writing letters to the editor of the Post Register. If they subscribe then I have no issue. However, to just write a letter because someone wants their personal view heard, I don't know if any more out-of-area letters will be published.

I seriously doubt getting whatever from the Bonneville County Commissioners will change much in this mess. I hope so but I doubt it. I don't know when the Bernards will decide to stop jumping through the hoops, race in WY and probably move all their business interests there too, vs. having local harrassment, IMO, from two Legislators who couldn't repeal the 2013 law. Had there been a functioning racing committee, any additional letters etc. could have been obtained earlier. The Legislators could have asked for this in Jan. or Feb. Perhaps they (The Bernards) will sue before the Native Americans do.


Last edited by Mtn. States Resident; 04-16-2015 at 07:16 PM..
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message

Old 04-17-2015, 01:16 PM
Location: Old Mother Idaho
28,479 posts, read 20,376,688 times
Reputation: 22934
The issue just keeps getting more difficult and complicated. It's like trying to grasp a big slick fish that's still squirming.

For sure, Idaho potentially faces a lot of lost revenue from this. With Montana and it's casinos less than 100 miles away in almost every route that lies eastward, and Wyoming the same where Montana's boundary ends, and with the Nevada casinos only somewhat farther away in Jackpot and other towns that lie right on the Nevada boundaries, all can easily take over this gaming.
Worse, none have as many racing tracks as Idaho, and none have horse industries nearly as large. It's now obvious that the tracks will be the biggest losers in this, along with the entire quarter horse and thoroughbred breeders in Idaho who employ so many folks directly or indirectly.

It's a shame. In the past, equine events- multi-breed horse shows, single-breed multi-state regional shows, performance trials, draft horse pulling events, dressage events, and our unique form of winter racing, the cutter races, were all very popular spectator sports that commonly drew hundreds of paying spectators. They all helped our equine industry and many events were held at our race tracks.

Not so much now. The Intermountain Regional Horse Show once brought thousands of dollars yearly to Blackfoot and the E.I State fairgrounds, as did similar events in Lewiston, C d'A, Boise, and Idaho Falls. Folks from neighboring states would come to these events and spend their money for a week here, but all the shows are only history now.

We still have thousands of passers-through every tourist season in all corners of Idaho, and we have less and less unique attractions to hold them a day or two and allow our cities to pick up some good revenue. They come and go and spend their money in our neighbor's attractions instead.
If we want to keep our share of tourist dollars, we need to offer them something they can't get staying in a hotel room watching the TV. We have so much that they would enjoy. We need to quit squandering away our entertainment resources so casually and freely.
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 04-17-2015, 06:49 PM
8,440 posts, read 12,836,134 times
Reputation: 6283
I agree Mike about having race tracks and other horse related events in Idaho for recreation for locals and tourists. The travel councils are probably ticked as well.

Over the years I've known about individuals who had horses. Farm kids and horse riding are quite normal. Same for the dairy farms or those who graze cattle or sheep in the hills. Some keep a few just for recreation, like my brother. He has six. He rides to unwind.

I was driving on 15th east, in Bonneville County today. With such a picture perfect day I could see a lot of the really big horse barns on both sides of the road. I kept thinking about the crazy mess this has become.
Talk about an industry many don't realize they are benefiting from.

I don't know how this twisted cobweb could be untangled.

Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2015, 12:45 PM
8,440 posts, read 12,836,134 times
Reputation: 6283
There is a comprehensive article in the Post Register today. Hopefully the AP picks the article up so the contents can be linked here. There are some voices of reason, now that the Legislature isn't involved.

Probably the strongest and most unflappable voice is that of Bonneville County Commissioner Roger Christensen. His bottom line is no one in the state will tell the Commissioners how long their investigation can or can't take. The Bernards have already been granted two extensions getting everything the county wants.

IMO Christensen stated how *complicated * this entire process has been. Instead of rushing to a decision, the Commissioners will probably even have a public hearing for local residents to comment. Additionally, while the Legislature seems to either not have attempted to reach the former Chairman of Racing, who resigned in Jan., or not wanted to hear what the former Chairman said. Conversely, Roger Christensen and fellow commissioners have spoken with him several times the past month. Also, the Bonneville County Commissioners have had several conference calls and video discussions with the Racing Commission since the beginning of March. Did the Legislature do anything similar except inject their personal views?

It is entirely possible the Bernards will lose their license. Then again, reading comments from all the Racing Commission emphasized their purpose is to help establishments get the licenses they need. Bonneville County has concerns but facts and not opinions are what the investigation seeks.

Understandable to me, the Bernards do not want to get everything the county may require only to have the state declare it ill-legal.

In searching briefly, it appears the Post Falls Police are investigating the facility there. I don't know if the local governing and investigative bodies can help add clarity and sound judgement to this twisted mess or not. I saw one of the huge equestrian facilities south of Idaho Falls listed for sale recently. I hope there can be rulings that don't destroy the livelihoods of hundreds to thousands in the state, while waiting for Gov. Otter's lawsuit against the Cd'A Tribe is in line to be heard in Federal Court.

A couple of articles updating positions. The Spokesman Review mentions the Post Falls facility.

Nonini pitches bill to cap 'instant racing' locations at three, including Greyhound Park - Spokesman Mobile - Feb. 6, 2015

Updated info on Double Downs - scroll to the very bottom:

Double Down Idaho Falls Sports Bar |Restaurant in Idaho Falls


Last edited by Mtn. States Resident; 04-23-2015 at 12:54 PM..
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 06-05-2015, 10:32 AM
Location: Wayward Pines,ID
2,043 posts, read 4,045,895 times
Reputation: 2259
Default Update

Coeur d'Alene Tribe takes betting machine battle to court - Coeur d'Alene Press: Idaho News
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 06-05-2015, 06:34 PM
Location: Old Mother Idaho
28,479 posts, read 20,376,688 times
Reputation: 22934
This fight is far from over, that's for sure.
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 06-05-2015, 07:59 PM
8,440 posts, read 12,836,134 times
Reputation: 6283
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
This fight is far from over, that's for sure.
Amen to that. The Tribe suggested dates for the Supreme Court of Idaho (SCI) to hear their case. They want every historical betting machine out of ID before July 1, 2015. They bypassed District Court trying to force the issue and the SCI delivered a letter this week with the date of preliminary arguments or whatever it is called. I didn't know a lawsuit against an Idaho elected official (Denney) could go directly to the SCI. The Tribe hopes the SCI orders Denney to certify that Gov. Otter didn't veto in time, thus by default the repeal becomes law 07/01/2015.

What I'd like to know are two things: 1. What is the status of Gov. Otter's lawsuit against the C'dA Tribe? 2. What Appealate or Supreme Court will be hearing Otter vs. Cd'A Tribe? There aren't that many Court Systems. I wonder if there is any Conflict of Interest in the SCI?

This is a convoluted mess! I think there is blame enough for all. But I have to say I am confused how the Tribe can be heard prior to the lawsuit the Gov. filed last year

Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 06-06-2015, 06:39 PM
Location: Old Mother Idaho
28,479 posts, read 20,376,688 times
Reputation: 22934
American Pharaoh just won the Belmont!
The first Triple Crown winner in 37 years!

And man alive, how he won! He sprinted to the lead, took the rail and by the first turn was settled and running easy and fast. None of the field crowded him, and his head was up all the way. Espinoza held him in a little until they were out of the 2nd turn and then just let him run. He took it by 5 1/2 lengths.

The Belmont is a very deceptive race. The turns are so wide that the horses don't feel a centrifugal tug to cue them, and the straight to the finish line is 1,000 yards to the finish line, a quarter of a mile away. If jockey or horse starts their final sprint too soon, they will run out of gas. Pharaoh, however, was so calm and in stride he was running his own race, and Espinoza just let him go. I don't think he even touched him with his crop.

Dang! It was a thrilling race! I was jumping up and down by the final stretch.

When a horse is running with their head up, its always a sign they are doing well. None of the others ran all the way like that. By the 2nd turn, they were all digging deep and their heads were down. Only the 2nd place horse, Frosted, looked like he still had some reserves.

This is really going to give the racing industry a needed boost. 37 years is the longest dry spell ever.

Interestingly, the name Pharaoh for a horse has a very long and proud American tradition. Several famous racers from the 1800s carried the name, as did some very famous cavalry horses. All of them were bays.

American Pharaoh is a real character. Half of his tail was bitten off by another colt when he was a 2 year old, and he's remarkably placid for a racing Thoroughbred. He likes to be around people, likes to get patted, and is very sociable. Most of them are much more aggressive in nature. He's also quick to relax. The only problem he has is noise distraction. He runs with earplugs.
The horse reminds me of Seattle Slew; Slew had the same casual affability and natural conservation. He always ran just fast enough to win. Pharaoh, however, loves to run, just like Secretariat.

Carlos Espinoza had run 3 tries for the Triple Crown before, and he really deserved this win. At 48, he was the oldest jock in the race, and he handled his horse perfectly. He said afterward that Pharoah's stride was so smooth he felt like the horse was running slow.
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 06-10-2015, 06:23 PM
Location: So Florida
265 posts, read 659,219 times
Reputation: 215
Hmm I believe Gary Stevens was a jockey in the race making him the oldest. I also believe your spelling 'American Pharoah' the actual correct way instead of the incorrect way they are spelling it due to an error at registration I believe. They spell it Pharoah not Pharaoh as in the correct way. But great post by the way.
Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Old 06-11-2015, 11:25 PM
8,440 posts, read 12,836,134 times
Reputation: 6283
This could be long, tedious and circular. No one thinks this is theirs to resolve.

I still don't understand how the Cd'A Tribe can demand things when they were sued by Gov. Otter in 2014. There is no shortage of problems and legal issues due to the Legislature and Governor Otter. But the C'd'A Tribe seems to think if they hit enough people hard enough they will all forget the Tribe has to defend their actions when the Otter lawsuit is heard.

Idaho AG Responds to Instant Horse Racing Legal Fight

Rate this post positively Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.

Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Idaho
View detailed profiles of:

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2023, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top