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Too bad the nation cannot avail itself to one of the most reliable sources of geothermal energy on the planet . . . Yellowstone. Would solve a lot of energy problems. Of course, it will never happen, seeing as Yellowstone is the first national park in the world, having been established 144 years ago.
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Besides which, drawing that much heat out potentially COULD cause the system to destabilize and erupt, and then where would be be? Global nuclear winter, at best.
I saw that Stargate SG-1 episode. It didn't end well.
Too bad the nation cannot avail itself to one of the most reliable sources of geothermal energy on the planet . . . Yellowstone. Would solve a lot of energy problems. Of course, it will never happen, seeing as Yellowstone is the first national park in the world, having been established 144 years ago.
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Yellowstone is too difficult geographically to ever be an efficient power producer.
It's not the generation that's the problem; it's getting the electricity to where its wanted.
The Idaho Falls area's wind turbines ran full tilt into that wall. The foothills to the east of I.F. turned out to be perfect for wind turbines, and there was an enormous rush by 3 or 4 competitors to get the best sites claimed and get the turbines up and operating before there were enough high-tension power lines were built to move the electricity to the power routing stations in the valley.
Cart before the horse. In this case, it was cart before the horse with a few canyons to jump and a big bunch of NIMBY to overcome. New high power lines would not only have to cross through parts of the city, they would also have to cross lots of high-priced country 'estates', and there's nothing like a power line to kill property values. There are so many wind turbines that to put them to full use (and effeciency), more transfer stations would have to be built, and they, too, ran into the same trouble as the power lines.
The last turbine company finally threw in the towel last summer and closed up the shop. I don't know what will become of the turbines, but right now, the blades on most of them are feathered so they're no longer spinning in the wind.
And all this is peanuts compared to the problems of getting the power out of Yellowstone.
The I.F. area will need the added power from the turbines, for sure; there are at least 2 very large projects that are both committed to go forth, and both are going through all the approval process now, but the power line probs are far from resolution, and they could really jam everything else up.
Universally, no Idahoan wants our state screwed up by industry. The old days of plunder and abandon left us with enough long-lasting trouble as it is, and we are still dealing with 100 year old problems that were left.
I tend to think that overcoming the difficulties here may become a blueprint for what could happen all over the country in the years to come. They are going to require completely new ways of thinking first, but once solutions are found, I can see Idaho becoming a real powerhouse in the energy sector of our national economy in the near future.
This is one of the rare places where it's all here. The time is ripening for forward thinking, not repeating the old ways of the past. Fossil fuel is a 19th century concept that took almost 200 years to grow, flower, and now decay as its problems have magnified.
America has always been the great innovator for the rest of the world. I hope the direction Idaho takes is not toward fossil fuels. More and better jobs, and a better continuation of the life in a magnificent unspoiled state lie in the developing new technologies that are still in their infancy, not in their old age.
Geothermal is awesome, but it's not portable, and it's very expensive. If you don't live in a mountain state, you have to look elsewhere.
The problem with energy sources like solar and wind is that they are not controllable. The electrical grids are not designed to store energy. So there's no capacity to handle the ebb and flow of wind and sun. Coal, natural gas, and other fuels, can be fed at a controlled rate, based on system loads which also vary during the day and year.
We've already dammed up everything in sight for hydro-electric. wind turbines kill all sorts of flying animals by the thousands every year, and solar farms aren't much better. So I kind of have the opinion that going green is evil in a different way. But since it's all relatively new and trendy, and doesn't have the track record of environmental catastrophes the way oil does, people give it the benefit of the doubt.
The honest truth is that we need cleaner nuclear technology. We need to crack nuclear fusion and ditch fission, and it seems that after all these decades of dancing around it, we are on the cusp of doing so. Fusion creates no long-term radioactive waste, has a small footprint relative to the size of fossil fuel plants and mega-acre wind / solar farms, and has a limitless fuel supply. And one of the nuclear facilities leading that research is Idaho National Labs in Idaho Falls.
EDIT: It was politely indicated to me that Volosong was responding to the map in his reply about geothermal energy. In which case yes, geothermal has a lot of potential. But from my perspective, region-specific energy technologies are a dead end. They require unique technological advancements, using localized environmental conditions as the fuel source. If humanity as a WHOLE is to move forward, we need to find a clean fuel source that everyone has in abundance. And I think Idaho is helping in that movement.
The Center for Advanced Energy Studies (CAES), a part of INL looks at fuel alternatives. Click around and look at the different types of renewable or non carbon energy sources.
But like Aiden, what excites me the most is the multi-billion dollar project coming to a small area of INL. It's NuScale and it's much smaller modular reactors built with a different design. These small modular units will power cities first and later submarines. They require a fraction of the space. Click around here to see the plant design NuScale Power - SMR Nuclear Technology
or go to the Idaho Falls Forum and read about the last 5-10 pages in the INL thread.
NuScale will require 1,000 construction workers, with an expanded security clearance, to build. The Idaho Dept. of Labor anticipates 13,000+ new, sustainable jobs in E. Idaho due to NuScale alone.
Too bad the nation cannot avail itself to one of the most reliable sources of geothermal energy on the planet . . . Yellowstone. Would solve a lot of energy problems. Of course, it will never happen, seeing as Yellowstone is the first national park in the world, having been established 144 years ago.
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I know this was a response to someone else. The truth is, Volosong, DOE is looking at YNP and other geothermal areas for energy. That is part of why CAES had to add the University. of Wyoming to the core universities. Many experts say the #1 scientist on geothermal energy is working at CAES.
Check out the INL thread about this. There is a big project for geothermal coming down the road. INL got knocked out this year, leaving only OR and the Utah proposals to compete for the final award next year. Less than a week after INL was formally not a competitor any more, the University of Utah brought CAES in to help with the final Utah proposal.
Another extraction method is fracking and the leases recently sold throughout the state are also scary, especially when you note the increased earthquakes in Oklahoma from fracking.
Idaho is very vulnerable. We need to continue to support alternative sources of energy. Jobs, you say? I just read an article that green jobs have surpassed those in fossil energy. I will try to find it.
And I cannot imagine anyone becoming enraged or argumentative about this, other than it represents change.
I am not fond of the subsidies needed to make green energy economically viable. Or the loss to taxpayers from such dubious entities as Solyndra.
I am not fond of the subsidies needed to make green energy economically viable. Or the loss to taxpayers from such dubious entities as Solyndra.
Oil and coal are both heavily subsidized. Always have been, for decades. We all end up paying the taxes and other perks they've gotten one way or another.
Many of our major agricultural crops- sugar, dairy, wheat, rice, and corn production, and especially corn, which is now grown more for ethonol production than for food, have been subsidized for well over 70 years.
Heavy industries are also subsidized, like steel, aluminum, glass, and others. Many of them depended on it so much for so long that some will never become competitive again, because it costs so much to completely modernize. Rebuilding Bethlehem Steel, for example, would be so incredibly expensive that the costs make investment in green tech look like chump change in comparison.
Coal as an energy source is simply done for good. It costs too much for the energy it delivers. Trying to keep coal as a prime energy source only puts America behind in the race to find cheaper and more renewable energy. The more is is subsidized, the longer we lag behind and the more it will cost us all in the end.
The innovation that comes along with the developing green energy offers America many more opportunities for future national growth than anything, as America has always been a nation of great innovation. Creating new things is what we have always done the best, better than the rest of the world.
The new technologies will be a greater help to a state like Idaho than to a state in the Rust Belt like Pennsylvania. We had no heavy industry here to speak of, so there's little dependency on industries that have lost all ability to compete, while at the same time, Idaho has positioned itself on the leading edge of some of the very most essential elements that will be needed in the development of new technologies.
Really a lot of our great positioning was unplanned, but it happened. It's up to us now as to how much of the advantages we've been given to use to their greatest potential. Sitting in the catbird seat never lasts for long, and if we don't do it, another state will. Green technology doesn't depend so much on the natural resources of the past, so development doesn't need to happen where the natural materials are plentiful.
But in Idaho's case, the few extremely essential natural resources that are needed the very most are here, and only await the development of technology to extract them.
Rare earth minerals. They are extremely rare and hard to extract, but Idaho has more of them than the entire world has. Idaho could become the industrial titan of the 21st century.
Yes, but in the case of oil, subsidies are not needed for the business to remain relevant and profitable. Most, if not all "oil subsidies" are in place to benefit the consumers of the product.
Tax benefits available to all large businesses , meant to keep that business in the country, are used by oil companies. Other subsidies exist to help low income consumers afford heating utilities. Some are farming exemptions to lower costs for those in agriculture and even some for the governments "strategic oil reserve".
Oil subsidies aren't there for the oil companies, they are there for the consumer.
Add to that, the immeasurable tax revenue that the industry creates, and there is no question about the net value of the industry to our country.
Yes, but in the case of oil, subsidies are not needed for the business to remain relevant and profitable. Most, if not all "oil subsidies" are in place to benefit the consumers of the product.
Tax benefits available to all large businesses , meant to keep that business in the country, are used by oil companies. Other subsidies exist to help low income consumers afford heating utilities. Some are farming exemptions to lower costs for those in agriculture and even some for the governments "strategic oil reserve".
Oil subsidies aren't there for the oil companies, they are there for the consumer.
Add to that, the immeasurable tax revenue that the industry creates, and there is no question about the net value of the industry to our country.
For sure. The United States is almost totally dependent on oil, and I don't expect that to change suddenly at all. But gradually, I'm sure that change will come; oil is old technology, and it too, took a long time to reach its high level of dependency in the 20th century.
Oil is like the railroads- for 100 years, no one ever believed oil would overcome rail transportation in moving people around, but it did.
Now that oil has reached the same 100 year old mark, its only a matter of time before even more efficient methods of using energy will supplant it.
People will naturally gravitate to whatever is the cheapest and most efficient ways to get around. Mass transport has always been the cheapest, but oil offered flexibility; a car allowed anyone to go exactly where they wanted, when they wanted, and for how long they wanted to stay.
There are now alternatives that allow this same flexibility, and without the inherent problems that come with transporting gallons of explosive fuel around with you everywhere you go.
There are always going to be remote places where only fuel like oil can work, so it will always be around, but our dependence on it won't be as complete as it is now.
Agreed. I think the best approach is to allow a healthy amount of varied sources of energy production. You know, moderation and all that. That approach seems to lead to the most beneficial results for most.
IDAHO WATER IS LIFE! FORCED POOLING IS DEATH! On Friday, November 25, hardworking, tax-paying, Payette County private property owners received information packets via certified mail, with notice of a December 14 “due process” hearing for them to attend if they object to the Alta Mesa oil and gas drillers and the Idaho Oil and Gas Conservation Commission “forced pooling” them into industry-favoring contracts and extorting their subsurface mineral resources and rights (https://www.idl.idaho.gov/oil-gas/re...ngs/index.html). In March 2016, the Idaho Legislature passed SB1339 to rush the “integration” process benefiting the oil and gas industry. Alta Mesa and other toxic intruders can drill, frack, and chemically “treat” wells only 200 feet from homes and other structures like schools and hospitals, risking air and water quality and quantity.
Although routinely dismissed by Idaho government and dirty energy industry co-participants, Idaho citizens invested plenty of time, energy, and knowledge since May 2016, in negotiating Idaho oil and gas rules that better protect public and environmental health and safety than previous versions. Should not Idahoans be allowed additional input during January 2017, before the Idaho Legislature finalizes these rules that will impact forced pooling procedures and practices? Or is that the reason (besides justifiable, year-end, Alta Mesa investor worries) behind this industry rush to force pool? Alta Mesa and other developers have already purchased oil and gas leases on most of the state-owned lands under the Boise, Payette, and Snake rivers and state and federal highways in the Treasure Valley, for as little as 25 cents per acre.
Payette County citizens need Idahoans to stand together and support them confronting this injustice, while they have only a few weeks to understand and challenge these oil and gas industry intrusions that could inevitably contaminate ground and surface water, wells, and agricultural lands, jeopardize property rights, values, mortgages, and insurance, and ultimately degrade Treasure Valley sustainability and quality of life. Regional residents of Ada, Canyon, Cassia, Gem, Owyhee, Payette, Twin Falls, Washington, and other Idaho counties will eventually endure the ravages of these same integration rules. In honor of Standing Rock, it is time for us to rise up on Idaho’s own fossil fuel frontlines... ~Helen
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