Amnesty for illegal aliens

[Yac]

Everybody please calm down and discuss the topic, not each other.
Yac.

[goldengrain]

Originally Posted by makossa

I love that!!! (In Bold) Isn't it sad that it takes millions of us angry taxpayers to get pushed in to a corner and still, those fools in DC still don't get it. Obama filing a lawsuit against AZ Don't jump all over me people, I actually voted for this non-starter socialist - Won't make that mistake twice!!!

Oh, Makossa, I was also such a fool.
He had such momentum behind him. He could have accomplished great things and he was such a sell out to the interests of big corporations. After his health care bill passed the stock of health insurers shot up.
We were going to get all those green jobs, and he started pushing for offshore drilling (prior to BP). He obviously had not done his homework on drill-baby-drill, either. And his solution to so much is just to fire the guy or gal that seems to be in charge to deflect his own responsibility.
What a whoos.

He even stated that Americans would not feel so badly about illegals if we were all happily employed. Has he done that? He knows we are all suffering, yet he persists on favoring this cheap source of help for business rather than allow the salaries rise so that poor Americans can support their families.

He wonders why there are so many on public assistance? It's because the jobs they used to take to pull themselves up are filled by illegals.

I don't know who I will back in the next election. Both parties back illegals. Both parties, no matter what they SAY, seem to betray their own people for commercial interests. Libertarians are no better.

I think our only hope is to keep demanding of politicians, when they are running, that they reflect our will on this issue. There is no party that represents us.

[goldengrain]

Originally Posted by knowledgeiskey

ERs pay for tons of uninsured Americans daily. I have been to the ER uninsured on occasions.



If they have a false SS, they are paying taxes, but they aren't getting anything in return.

What is your problem?

I've debunked all of your rants.

The first thing many do when they come here is to make babies so they can get all these services.
And, even if they paid taxes they could not possibly pay for the education of all their kids, which (when I was a kid)was about $5k per year.

THese days we cannot afford the salaries of teachers so we are laying them off and expanding class size, making a bad learning situation for our own kids.
Add to that their increasing numbers - so much so that the Hispanic population is now this country's biggest minority - not that this is exclusively a Hispanic issue, and not that all Hispanics are in favor of illegals, because they are NOT.

Hospitals are closing all around the country because they are forced to treat these people and end up passing the bill to their paying customers. Hospitals in poor neighborhoods end up closing because they don't have enough paying customers to support the illegals.
This leaves our own poor with even less medical assistance.

How many illegals are in drug pushing gangs in the U.S?
LOTS.
And what is their number in our penal system?
At what, 30 or 40 or 50 thousand dollars a head per year?
When they DO make money they send it back home and don't spend it in our economy.
If it were not for drugs and this money sent home some South American economies would collapse, so I read somewhere.

Both shocking and disgusting.

I don't fault people for wanting to better their lives, but not when it is at the expense of our own people.

So many black startup businesses had to close because of these illegals pulling salaries down. My own parents, years back, did migrant farming work. They did whatever it took to survive, and little by little worked their way up to the middle class. Now the poor in this country have no hope, stuck in a welfare system because those low level jobs pay so little.

These people have to leave. You don't give a hand to others with your own people hurting.
It's just sick to do something like that.

[goldengrain]

Originally Posted by BronxCambo193rd

Well I have mixed opinions on the subject. I don't think illegals should get anymore then a workers visa, and they should make that more open to other nationalites then just Mexicans, like South-East Asians. I also agree with deporting known gang members, like in California they have deported many Mexican and Central American gang members, but also tens of thousands of Cambodians and Vietnamese gang members as well. I am not biased at all being Cambodian, gang members and criminals are all scum of the earth and I think that America should do what England did and send all of their convicted felons to an island like Australia and let them kill eachother over there. Instead of killing innocent people, they are all animals and deserve treatment no better.

The problem is, they are lowering the wages for all Americans. We don't need foreign workers. We need market forces to produce a livable wage for our own people. That cannot happen if we import foreign workers who are willing to work on the cheap.

The concept of a worker's visa is an attempt to move them towards citizenship, but in a manner that will make it less obvious to Americans, like the spoon full of sugar along with the medicine.

The only solution is to close all jobs to them by inspecting places of employment regularly. They will go home on their own. Then overhaul the anchor child issue because the intent of that law was never to encourage unlawful immigration through pregnancy. The law must be rewritten to reflect it's true intent.

[goldengrain]

Originally Posted by proroc

Borders are only imaginary when you have sellouts in the gov't who refuse to enforce the law.

Yes, tell the people of Santo Domingo that their border with Haiti is imaginary. These are essentially the same people, but with two very different cultures. One has schools and hospitals and an infrastructure and the other, corruption and chaos.

It is both tricky and difficult to build a progressive culture and much easier to tear it down. This is why we have borders in the first place.
Dropping borders would be more likely to turn civilization backward rather than elevate the downtrodden.

[jonaos]

Originally Posted by RUBIES77

Our present and prior government has done very little to solve the problem. About 10 to 15 years' ago, when the Illegals began coming here en mass, our government began building a wall on the California side.

Illegals have been coming over since the 1920's, so your information is wrong. Past administrations handled it in a logical fashion unlike today.

In the 30's Roosevelt authorized a massive sweep of illegals in the S.West and deported nearly all of them.

In the 50's Eisenhower authorized a illegal immigration sweep [with help from state and local authorities] in the S.West. That program took 1 year to complete, but it removed 1 to 2 million illegals.

After the 50s our country has become unwilling to do anything about illegal immigration. So we do nothing about it. I guess our national culture has changed since the 50's [liberals/hippy culture took over], since I highly doubt Roosevelt was considered a racist for wanting to remove illegals in his time [which he would be called today if he tried to remove the 20 million illegals in the country]. I think the way presidents in the 50's handled it was better btw...It fixed the issue for a decade or two.


Anyways, fast forward from 1950 to 1986, we had 9 million illegals in the country at that year. Reagan gave them all amnesty. 9 million illegals made citizens right there...You would think the border would be secured in that year right ? Well its obvious that never happened.

We have 12-30 million illegals in the country today. Obama wants to give amnesty. He seems to not want to secure the border...So imo, if we give amnesty we are fools. I am sure that as soon as amnesty is given it will only take 10 - 20 years for us to have another illegal population wanting amnesty.

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by jonaos

Illegals have been coming over since the 1920's, so your information is wrong. Past administrations handled it in a logical fashion unlike today.

In the 30's Roosevelt authorized a massive sweep of illegals in the S.West and deported nearly all of them.

In the 50's Eisenhower authorized a illegal immigration sweep [with help from state and local authorities] in the S.West. That program took 1 year to complete, but it removed 1 to 2 million illegals.

After the 50s our country has become unwilling to do anything about illegal immigration. So we do nothing about it. I guess our national culture has changed since the 50's [liberals/hippy culture took over], since I highly doubt Roosevelt was considered a racist for wanting to remove illegals in his time [which he would be called today if he tried to remove the 20 million illegals in the country]. I think the way presidents in the 50's handled it was better btw...It fixed the issue for a decade or two.


Anyways, fast forward from 1950 to 1986, we had 9 million illegals in the country at that year. Reagan gave them all amnesty. 9 million illegals made citizens right there...You would think the border would be secured in that year right ? Well its obvious that never happened.

We have 12-30 million illegals in the country today. Obama wants to give amnesty. He seems to not want to secure the border...So imo, if we give amnesty we are fools. I am sure that as soon as amnesty is given it will only take 10 - 20 years for us to have another illegal population wanting amnesty.

It's turned into chain-illegal immigration w/amnesty. Legalized cheating.

How many more years before we have more people living here bilking the system than paying for it?

[goldengrain]

There are many European nations going through similar problems, some having their people complaining about all the people being allowed in legally. Why should so many politicians of Western nations be moving in blatant defiance of what their people want?

I realize that the U.S. caves to corporate interests. Our system seems built to do that, but it's not the same elsewhere and yet the problem persists there, as well.

[carolac]

Of course they are, and they receive them when American citizens cannot get them. This quote is from a 2004 study by the Center for Immigration Studies. I am sure the cost is much higher now.

"•Households headed by illegal aliens imposed more than $26.3 billion in costs on the federal government in 2002 and paid only $16 billion in taxes, creating a net fiscal deficit of almost $10.4 billion, or $2,700 per illegal household.


•Among the largest costs are Medicaid ($2.5 billion); treatment for the uninsured ($2.2 billion); food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches ($1.9 billion); the federal prison and court systems ($1.6 billion); and federal aid to schools ($1.4 billion)."


The High Cost of Cheap Labor: Illegal Immigration and the Federal Budget | Center for Immigration Studies - The study is entitled, "The High Cost of Cheap Labor: Illegal Immigration and the Federal Budget.

Originally Posted by knowledgeiskey

What are you talking about?

Illegals aren't even qualified for those services you've mentioned.