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Old 08-18-2007, 01:15 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
646 posts, read 2,685,071 times
Reputation: 470

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I'm getting tired of the "Nation of Immigrants (TM)" canard, as if every generation of immigrants is indistiguishable from the last. The pioneers of the past came here to build a new nation. They saw a vast, almost unoccupied continent, and wanted to build a new nation in their own image -- a "New Europa".

New migrants, however, are not building a new nation from scratch. They're not homesteaders, rather they're simply replacing Americans and taking over an infrastructure already in place. In contrast, they're actually very different from the immigrants of the past. Ironically, they're almost the exact opposite, in the sense that they're not building a nation -- they're doing quite the opposite -- though immigration cheerleaders from the liberally minded social marxist Democrats to the dittoheaded corporatist Republicans almost NEVER make such a distinction.
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Old 08-18-2007, 01:22 AM
 
Location: Tuxedo Park, NY
419 posts, read 2,124,706 times
Reputation: 271
Good post, I think that needed to be said. People will still disagree and probably come down on you, but don't worry, I've got your back.
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Old 08-18-2007, 02:31 AM
 
2,433 posts, read 6,332,498 times
Reputation: 1061
Quote:
Originally Posted by James T View Post
I'm getting tired of the "Nation of Immigrants (TM)" canard, as if every generation of immigrants is indistiguishable from the last. The pioneers of the past came here to build a new nation. They saw a vast, almost unoccupied continent, and wanted to build a new nation in their own image -- a "New Europa".

New migrants, however, are not building a new nation from scratch. They're not homesteaders, rather they're simply replacing Americans and taking over an infrastructure already in place. In contrast, they're actually very different from the immigrants of the past. Ironically, they're almost the exact opposite, in the sense that they're not building a nation -- they're doing quite the opposite -- though immigration cheerleaders from the liberally minded social marxist Democrats to the dittoheaded corporatist Republicans almost NEVER make such a distinction.

Great Post! We certainly are not a nation of immigrants. Most American citizens are native born to this country.
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Old 08-18-2007, 10:03 AM
 
8,973 posts, read 15,625,359 times
Reputation: 3013
Quote:
Originally Posted by James T View Post
I'm getting tired of the "Nation of Immigrants (TM)" canard, as if every generation of immigrants is indistiguishable from the last. The pioneers of the past came here to build a new nation. They saw a vast, almost unoccupied continent, and wanted to build a new nation in their own image -- a "New Europa".

New migrants, however, are not building a new nation from scratch. They're not homesteaders, rather they're simply replacing Americans and taking over an infrastructure already in place. In contrast, they're actually very different from the immigrants of the past. Ironically, they're almost the exact opposite, in the sense that they're not building a nation -- they're doing quite the opposite -- though immigration cheerleaders from the liberally minded social marxist Democrats to the dittoheaded corporatist Republicans almost NEVER make such a distinction.
Unpopular perhaps, but all this is true---and indicative of our new "kinder, gentler" society. Defend illegal immigration if you will; that's your privilege and your right; but don't stoop to comparing it with past immigration into a much tougher and less accomodating society; that's just not a fair argument...
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Old 08-18-2007, 11:45 AM
 
1,266 posts, read 2,363,073 times
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Not to mention they are coming here ILLEGALLY! Our forefathers would be sick.
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Old 08-18-2007, 04:36 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
646 posts, read 2,685,071 times
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Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
but don't stoop to comparing it with past immigration into a much tougher and less accomodating society; that's just not a fair argument...
Why is it not fair?
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Old 08-18-2007, 08:12 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 15,625,359 times
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Originally Posted by James T View Post
Why is it not fair?
It's not a fair comparison because conditions now aren't the same as conditions in the past---didn't you START this thread? Isn't that what YOU YOURSELF said? I would think you, more than anyone, would see why comparing today's situation with the past is like comparing apples with oranges---unless I'm missing something here, or there are, in fact, two "James T's"?....perhaps the "Good James T" and the "Bad James T"....I thought the forum didn't allow for duplication of names.......
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Old 08-18-2007, 11:04 PM
 
8 posts, read 34,894 times
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I'm all for legal immigration...I just hate that this situation is basically making our citizenship worthless!
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Old 08-19-2007, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
646 posts, read 2,685,071 times
Reputation: 470
Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
It's not a fair comparison because conditions now aren't the same as conditions in the past---didn't you START this thread? Isn't that what YOU YOURSELF said? I would think you, more than anyone, would see why comparing today's situation with the past is like comparing apples with oranges---unless I'm missing something here, or there are, in fact, two "James T's"?....perhaps the "Good James T" and the "Bad James T"....I thought the forum didn't allow for duplication of names.......
You still haven't shown what's not fair about my comparison. There are still vast undeveloped areas in the U.S. where land can be purchased, yet modern immigrants just want to crowd into our already overcrowded cities, all the while organizing into ethnically based socio-economic organizations in order to advance the life quality of their specific enclave. Now, show me how I'm not assesing modern immigrants fairly.
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Old 08-19-2007, 04:19 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 15,625,359 times
Reputation: 3013
Quote:
Originally Posted by James T View Post
You still haven't shown what's not fair about my comparison. There are still vast undeveloped areas in the U.S. where land can be purchased, yet modern immigrants just want to crowd into our already overcrowded cities, all the while organizing into ethnically based socio-economic organizations in order to advance the life quality of their specific enclave. Now, show me how I'm not assesing modern immigrants fairly.
I see the confusion here--my rebuttal was not directed at YOU, I now realize, but to those of your opponents (notice I said "defend illegal immigration if you will", etc.) who are insisting that all immigration, at all periods in history, was carried out under equal conditions. To THOSE people, I was saying "you can't compare what happened then with what's happening now"......too many "third person" references, I guess....
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