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I agree that most Americans are not going to pick fruit and other crops, even if the pay was very good. The hard work, the long hours, the heat, etc all mean that most people are not interested in that sort of work.
Most people are not interested in that type of work because it's seasonal. You have to eat year round.
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That said, the Democrats should put their money where their mouths are. If they truly believe that people should not be exploited, then they should be against using illegal labor, as people who are illegal or not permitted to work legally are the easiest exploited.
Is your argument here that Republican's plainly have no problem exploiting people?
I think the statistics and article cited in the original post are a bit misrepresented in terms of 'proving' that native American citizens are willing to do the grunt work of farming, the actual physical picking of crops. Just because a significant number of American citizens work in the farming industry as a whole, doesn't mean that a significant number of them necessarily work the fields.
And this is exactly where farmers are having a hard time finding help.
Farmers from across the country have related problems with trying to recruit American citizens to pick their crops. They've talked to people on the streets, they've even enlisted the help of state employment agencies, and there's hardly any takers.
Some people will give the reasoning that as long as you treat the employees with 'respect' and decent wages, they will work the fields. Again, not true based on what many farmers have personally experienced in their attempts to recruit American citizens to work the fields.
Besides, what exactly is a 'respectable' wage for field workers? $25 dollars an hour? Get real, at that rate might as well use machinery to gather crops (which some farmers have done). In Stockton, field workers get $19 dollars an hour and are one of the highest paid field laborers in the country. And farmers still have problems there recruiting American citizens to work the fields.
I don't get how some people think raising the minimum wage for jobs like fast food/restaurant industry is bad, yet think raising the minimum wage for picking crops to some ridiculously out of touch figure to be 'good.' Throwing around unrealistic dollar figures solves nothing in life.
Besides, I don't care how high the pay is, there's no darned way I'm going to spend 12 hours a day under the hot sun picking crops, brutal, back breaking, monotonous, soul sucking work. My body just cannot handle it.
Why are we even having this discussion when there are unlimited visas for legal, foreign workers to work on farms and pick crops? How does that equate to a shortage of workers for those jobs?
Most people are not interested in that type of work because it's seasonal. You have to eat year round.
Is your argument here that Republican's plainly have no problem exploiting people?
No, but Republicans do not pretend they want to 'help' illegal people as Democrats do. If the Democrats are truly interested in preventing exploitation as they say, then they should be against bringing people in illegally, who are the easiest to exploit.
This, along with the fact that it harms American workers in other sectors as well, is one of the fundamental reasons why allowing illegal immigration to continue is a morally corrupt system.
No, but Republicans do not pretend they want to 'help' illegal people as Democrats do. If the Democrats are truly interested in preventing exploitation as they say, then they should be against bringing people in illegally, who are the easiest to exploit.
This, along with the fact that it harms American workers in other sectors as well, is one of the fundamental reasons why allowing illegal immigration to continue is a morally corrupt system.
They can't fix that on their own and I don't disagree. I've argued that we need a strong, highly enforced e-verify system. It is also the Republicans that argue for them to not come here but they have no desire to actually do anything about that either.
They can't fix that on their own and I don't disagree. I've argued that we need a strong, highly enforced e-verify system. It is also the Republicans that argue for them to not come here but they have no desire to actually do anything about that either.
No "the wall" is not going to stop them.
The fact is that both parties have been consumed by neo-liberal ideas of globalization and cheap labor which benefit the wealthy.
This is the reason why the populism of Trump and Sanders, whereby American workers are put first is popular. Sanders has in the past, been opposed to 'open borders' because he correctly understands that that harms American workers. That has also been essentially, the central message of Trump's rhetoric.
If we want to stop the exploitation of illegal aliens and to protect the jobs and wages of American working class workers, we need to end illegal immigration.
Whether the wall or whatever works, something needs to be done now. Yes, mandatory e-verify is an essential ingredient of that, but it won't stop it altogether, since most illegals work for cash anyway. It makes absolutely no sense that American citizens must get permission from the government to be able to work, via being forced to sign paperwork for taxation purposes, yet people who shouldn't even be here can work wherever they want.
It's really not hard to figure out. You need your welfare check? Great - we'll help you! But in return, you will spend 15 hours a week picking crops and keeping the farms running. No work = no eat.
There are very few men receiving welfare, so I'm guessing you think that women and children can do this work? How will they get to the farms which could be hours away from their homes and since harvest isn't usually more than 8-10 weeks what do they do when they are done, follow the crops around the US? Oh and by the way, why should farmers get farm labor paid for by taxpayers?
Maybe you who should do your part to ensure that the US doesn't need illegal immigrants and spend your weekends and vacation picking crops, that's what a real patriot would do
We should look at how other countries handle this. When I was in Australia on a Working Holiday Visa, I worked on what is called the Harvest Trail, harvesting melons along with thousands of other people who do this work. I also know that in South Korea, where I lived for a long while, students and the army are used to assist farmers to harvest their crops when the time comes.
We could put in place some sort of national service, whereby young people spend their summers traveling around helping on farms.
The fact is that both parties have been consumed by neo-liberal ideas of globalization and cheap labor which benefit the wealthy.
No argument from me.
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This is the reason why the populism of Trump and Sanders, whereby American workers are put first is popular. Sanders has in the past, been opposed to 'open borders' because he correctly understands that that harms American workers. That has also been essentially, the central message of Trump's rhetoric.
If we want to stop the exploitation of illegal aliens and to protect the jobs and wages of American working class workers, we need to end illegal immigration.
Whether the wall or whatever works, something needs to be done now. Yes, mandatory e-verify is an essential ingredient of that, but it won't stop it altogether, since most illegals work for cash anyway. It makes absolutely no sense that American citizens must get permission from the government to be able to work, via being forced to sign paperwork for taxation purposes, yet people who shouldn't even be here can work wherever they want.
Legal citizens work for cash also. That said, I've covered this many times. Remove the ability to claim wages as an expense if you are unable to prove those receiving it are here legally.
We should look at how other countries handle this. When I was in Australia on a Working Holiday Visa, I worked on what is called the Harvest Trail, harvesting melons along with thousands of other people who do this work. I also know that in South Korea, where I lived for a long while, students and the army are used to assist farmers to harvest their crops when the time comes.
We could put in place some sort of national service, whereby young people spend their summers traveling around helping on farms.
25 million acres of farmland are owned by foreign investors. 30% of farms are owned by non-owner operators who rent or lease the land to farmers. Do you really want to make our young people spend their summers "helping out" on these farms? https://newfoodeconomy.org/who-reall...ican-farmland/
It is called circular migration, not illegal entry ... well, at least that use to be the case until the current administration with its policies (not law) enacted our militarized border. Migrant workers came to the u.s. from Mexico, work the farms, then at the end of the season would return to Mexico. Now, they can not return to Mexico ... not if they want to continue to work, because any type of migration is deemed illegal (through policy, not law) entry in the u.s. today.
"In this article, we explain how and why the unprecedented militarization of the Mexico-U.S. border not only failed in its attempt to reduce undocumented migration, but backfired by increasing the rate of undocumented population growth and turning what had been a circular flow of male workers going to three states into a settled population of families living in 50 states."
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People are not really caring about the consequences their actions have on a particular situation and that's okay, because I'm thinking sooner or later they will figure it out. If it is more later than sooner, that's what experience teaching is all about.
Pres Bush spoke out saying, 'spoiled Americans', imo, more right than wrong in that statement.
The current administration wasn't around in the 60, 70 and 80s.
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