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the Sino-British trade became dominated by high-value luxury items such as tea (from China to Britain) and silver (from Britain to China), to the extent that European specie metals became widely used in China. Britain had been on the gold standard since the 18th century, so it had to purchase silver from continental Europe to supply the Chinese appetite for silver, which was a costly process at a time before demonetization of silver by Germany in the 1870s.
since the early 20 century when the usa turn into a heavy manufacturing powerhouse it was like the chinese selling tea and only receiving silver for the goods like today america is selling high tech goods for minerals and
natural resources from other countries. "I hope I am not getting you confused with the semile"
sample 2
"In casting about for other possible commodities to reverse the flow of silver out of the country and into China, the British discovered opium."
illegal to the chinese as a product compare with illecet drugs or trafficing illegals, in modern america.
sample 3
Alarmed by the reverse in silver flow and the epidemic of addiction (an estimated 2 million Chinese were habitual users[1]), the Qing government attempted to end the opium trade, but its efforts were complicated by corrupt local officials (including the Viceroy of Canton).
that which is highlighted in red
prove that the most civilized nation on the face of this earth
great britain did not care and did not care to listen to the pleas of Lin Zexu saying that it was killing millions etc etc.
the problem that address any foreign problem
including illegal immigration, illega drugs is OUR corrupted officials
theres a quote that says
learn history so we do not make the same mistakes again.
I started reading more about the opium wars and how the western nations obligated china to open up by degesting all the opium to fix the trade inbalances proves that once youre officials are corrupted
the only thing you can do is try the best to benefit from it, or
truelly have a firm ideal and that your citezens are willing to fight for it
because if not. why repeat all the things that brought the decline of china?
So, illegal immigrants are addictive (to businesses and politicians), cheap (for businesses and politicians) and ultimately destructive to society? Yes, I think for once I agree with you!
the Sino-British trade became dominated by high-value luxury items such as tea (from China to Britain) and silver (from Britain to China), to the extent that European specie metals became widely used in China. Britain had been on the gold standard since the 18th century, so it had to purchase silver from continental Europe to supply the Chinese appetite for silver, which was a costly process at a time before demonetization of silver by Germany in the 1870s.
since the early 20 century when the usa turn into a heavy manufacturing powerhouse it was like the chinese selling tea and only receiving silver for the goods like today america is selling high tech goods for minerals and
natural resources from other countries. "I hope I am not getting you confused with the semile"
sample 2
"In casting about for other possible commodities to reverse the flow of silver out of the country and into China, the British discovered opium."
illegal to the chinese as a product compare with illecet drugs or trafficing illegals, in modern america.
sample 3
Alarmed by the reverse in silver flow and the epidemic of addiction (an estimated 2 million Chinese were habitual users[1]), the Qing government attempted to end the opium trade, but its efforts were complicated by corrupt local officials (including the Viceroy of Canton).
that which is highlighted in red
prove that the most civilized nation on the face of this earth
great britain did not care and did not care to listen to the pleas of Lin Zexu saying that it was killing millions etc etc.
the problem that address any foreign problem
including illegal immigration, illega drugs is OUR corrupted officials
theres a quote that says
learn history so we do not make the same mistakes again.
I started reading more about the opium wars and how the western nations obligated china to open up by degesting all the opium to fix the trade inbalances proves that once youre officials are corrupted
the only thing you can do is try the best to benefit from it, or
truelly have a firm ideal and that your citezens are willing to fight for it
because if not. why repeat all the things that brought the decline of china?
I think it is more complicated then that for several reasons. The first is that at the time Qing China was not a military power. They were out gunned severely by the British. At the moment no one has the military ability to forcibly open up the United States to either illegal drugs or illegal immigrants. Secondly China at the time was practicing mercantilism the problem with that was the all the world's silver was flowing to China and that created and unfavorable balance of trade. The US has the opposite problem. There is currently an unfavorable balance of trade against us. Meaning we buy a lot more stuff than we produce. Britain needed to use Opium or go bankrupt against China. All other countries need to do to drive the US bankrupt is make cheap plastic crap to sell at Walmart. As such if we were going to be as draconian about our trade imbalances as China was we would close every big box importer and flush all of the useless stuff that has created our trade imbalance into the mouth of the Mississippi river and ban imports on anything that could threaten domestic producers. Do I support this no because as with China it would ultimentely cause more problems than it solves. Unlike Qing China, essentially the problem that we have with drugs and illegal immigrants is largely independent and inconcequential to our trade imbalances. Drugs and illegal immigrants tend to reduce our domestic workforce's wages and productivity artificially, but do not have nearly the impact on our trade imbalances as excessive borrowing does. The problem we have currently is that we borrow too much and our government borrows too much. So if you want to fight the type of economic forces that cause our current imbalance in trade pay off your debts, live more simply, save money and encourage others and the government to do the same. Where as Opium was sucking the capital out of China and sending it back to Britain, reckless borrowing is sucking the capital out of America and directing it to foreign creditors.
So, illegal immigrants are addictive (to businesses and politicians), cheap (for businesses and politicians) and ultimately destructive to society? Yes, I think for once I agree with you!
thanks for agreing with me, so it is proven that its addictive so again
whenever we come up with anologies and all kinds of comparison about illegals coming into my home etc etc.
do you agree that the elites have a say and do not address it? and since they do then isnt it a point also that since they control the country and pay most of the taxes have a bigger say? I agree that every individual vote counts and has a say
but have you seen what happen in the elections? the republicans making a fuss about raising taxes to the ones making above 220,000?
again IF WE the small taxpayers would happen to get our say in this
"illegal immigration" what I keep saying is that is inhumane why because once the problem is solved, the same thing is going to occur
why? because where addictive to the easy live not us the poor the middle but the rich. so to solve this we need to stop waging small wars to foreigner who is exploited, and truthfully doesnt have a say, and go to the source of the venom dont you think?
I think it is more complicated then that for several reasons. The first is that at the time Qing China was not a military power.it wasnt but it was a commercial power it just did not have the technology like right now were losing our edge not military but economically and to the rule of having a strong army is to have a strong economy do you agree? so it is similiar just a little more fuzzy thats all. They were out gunned severely by the British. At the moment no one has the military ability to forcibly open up the United States to either illegal drugs or illegal immigrants.again china was outgunned military but not in the markets. china did not require any goods from the europeans because there markets were satisfied with the products but eventually corruption created the vaccum for the deterioring of the state. Secondly China at the time was practicing mercantilism the problem with that was the all the world's silver was flowing to China and that created and unfavorable balance of trade. The US has the opposite problem. There is currently an unfavorable balance of trade against us. Meaning we buy a lot more stuff than we produce. Britain needed to use Opium or go bankrupt against China?again why do you think were printing dollars? and we scare the markets when we announce about devaluating the dollar same thing the diffrence is that the usa instead of fighting its imbalances with real dollars "like what the foreigners have" it wants to pay for less with its freshly printed dollars. All other countries need to do to drive the US bankrupt is make cheap plastic crap to sell at Walmart. As such if we were going to be as draconian about our trade imbalances as China was we would close every big box importer and flush all of the useless stuff that has created our trade imbalance into the mouth of the Mississippi river and ban imports on anything that could threaten domestic producers. Do I support this no because as with China it would ultimentely cause more problems than it solves draconian again to you its cheap plastic crap but china is becoming more competiteve in coming up with satisfactory products for american consumers, my blender, my iron, my computer, my tv is from china I am going to dump it in the missisipi river ? no! Unlike Qing China, essentially the problem that we have with drugs and illegal immigrants is largely independent and inconcequential to our trade imbalances. Drugs and illegal immigrants tend to reduce our domestic workforce's wages and productivity artificially, but do not have nearly the impact on our trade imbalances as excessive borrowing does. The problem we have currently is that we borrow too much and our government borrows too much. So if you want to fight the type of economic forces that cause our current imbalance in trade pay off your debts, live more simply, save money and encourage others and the government to do the same. Where as Opium was sucking the capital out of China and sending it back to Britain, reckless borrowing is sucking the capital out of America and directing it to foreign creditors.
to the last four sentences
what do you think buying exterior products do? we do have a sucking sound of imbalances and do you think we buy because we dont like america? its the same thing just look.
"Where as Opium was sucking the capital out of China and sending it back to Britain, reckless borrowing is sucking the capital out of America and directing it to foreign creditors.[/quote]"
the issue is that they "the british created something to imbalance their trading gap with the chinese"
and this is what I been saying ILLEGALS is our rich people solution
to keep SALES TAXES PROPERTY TAXES AND KEEP MONEY FROM GOING OUTSIDE AMERICAS JURIDISTICION. were outclass in the product world, and we owed it to
our military machine.
it wasnt but it was a commercial power it just did not have the technology like right now were losing our edge not military but economically and to the rule of having a strong army is to have a strong economy do you agree? so it is similiar just a little more fuzzy thats all.
First, as you should know the treaty ending the opium war did not even mention Opium. The importance of the military was that it forced China to open up to trade. China did not have an option in that. What I am saying is no one can force us to do anything because of our military.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iturbide1981
again china was outgunned military but not in the markets. china did not require any goods from the europeans because there markets were satisfied with the products but eventually corruption created the vaccum for the deterioring of the state.
Second China was out gunned in the military and though they may not have needed anygoods Britain put a bayonet to them and said you will trade with us on our terms otherwise we will conquer you. Economic power is no good if you get colonized. As evidence of this India was a manufacturing giant and one of the richest areas in the world, but since it was dis-unified Britain conquered it and bleed its riches away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iturbide1981
again why do you think were printing dollars? and we scare the markets when we announce about devaluating the dollar same thing the diffrence is that the usa instead of fighting its imbalances with real dollars "like what the foreigners have" it wants to pay for less with its freshly printed dollars.
Third I agree with you on this though I think you may mean treasury bonds instead of dollars. Additionally it is not illegal aliens and drugs that cause this problem so much as it is US citizens and the government borrowing all sorts of money to get things they have not earned and cannot afford.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iturbide1981
draconian again to you its cheap plastic crap but china is becoming more competiteve in coming up with satisfactory products for american consumers, my blender, my iron, my computer, my tv is from china I am going to dump it in the missisipi river ? no!
Fourth with dumping stuff into the Mississippi, I was referencing the flushing of Lin Zexu's seized Opium into the Pearl river delta. China did this as a protectionist reaction against the threat they faced from foreign trade and it was a poor one, which ultimentely spelled their doom.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iturbide1981
to the last four sentences
what do you think buying exterior products do? we do have a sucking sound of imbalances and do you think we buy because we dont like america? its the same thing just look.
"Where as Opium was sucking the capital out of China and sending it back to Britain, reckless borrowing is sucking the capital out of America and directing it to foreign creditors."
the issue is that they "the british created something to imbalance their trading gap with the chinese"
and this is what I been saying ILLEGALS is our rich people solution
to keep SALES TAXES PROPERTY TAXES AND KEEP MONEY FROM GOING OUTSIDE AMERICAS JURIDISTICION. were outclass in the product world, and we owed it to
our military machine.
Buying exterior products is part of the problem, but at the same time protectionism will not work because it makes everything less efficient. Free trade works well on the condition that people and government live within their means.
As to illegals they are not a solution remitences keep money flowing out of the country. Additionally while we may be out classed in some areas we are not in others. America has a lot of capital and a lot of skilled laborers. As such while foreign nations may out class us in labor intensive, low skill, low capital manufacturing we out class them in high capital, skill intensive industries. That is comparative advantage and that is why we must focus on lowing our collective borrowing both as consumers and in our government and focus our economy on the industries at which we have an advantage.
As to illegals they are not a solution remitences keep money flowing out of the country. Additionally while we may be out classed in some areas we are not in others. America has a lot of capital and a lot of skilled laborers. As such while foreign nations may out class us in labor intensive, low skill, low capital manufacturing we out class them in high capital, skill intensive industries. That is comparative advantage and that is why we must focus on lowing our collective borrowing both as consumers and in our government and focus our economy on the industries at which we have an advantage.
And to buttress your argument: when NAFTA went into effect back in 1995; Ford quickly found out it was cheaper to build Mexican spec Thunderbird cars in 'high wage' Lorain Ohio vs. so-called 'low wage Hermasillo, Mx.
In most if not all true Third World countries: outside of labor; the cost of business is usually no bargain factoring in poor physical infrastructure, corrupt local governments, etc.
And to buttress your argument: when NAFTA went into effect back in 1995; Ford quickly found out it was cheaper to build Mexican spec Thunderbird cars in 'high wage' Lorain Ohio vs. so-called 'low wage Hermasillo, Mx.
In most if not all true Third World countries: outside of labor; the cost of business is usually no bargain factoring in poor physical infrastructure, corrupt local governments, etc.
So long as Blago's aren't involved.
As to OP, an appropriate analogy IMO. The system in place is not managing illegal immigration IAW law, and I believe the american people need to insist the law get enforced 100%.
And to buttress your argument: when NAFTA went into effect back in 1995; Ford quickly found out it was cheaper to build Mexican spec Thunderbird cars in 'high wage' Lorain Ohio vs. so-called 'low wage Hermasillo, Mx.
In most if not all true Third World countries: outside of labor; the cost of business is usually no bargain factoring in poor physical infrastructure, corrupt local governments, etc.
Exactly the only reason it looked profitable in the first place was because the first areas companies tried this in Japan, Singapore, South Korea, and Taiwan all had a skilled workforce at a cheaper price, good infrastructure (by the 1970s) and a quasi religious Confucian-based opposition to corruption. That was an anomaly that does not exist in the rest of the world and is evidenced by the fact the cost of doing business in these countries rose rapidly in only a few years. Latin America, Africa and Mainland Asia are not like those areas and while they may be very good at mass producing T-Shirts, TVs, plastic toys, and blenders. They cannot keep up with the US and Europe in high technology/capital intensive goods.
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