Most Illegal Aliens are Mexican Indian, not Spanish (American, cities, Latinos)

[ArizonaBear]

Originally Posted by Paleoroundtable

I'm part native american from a federally recognized tribe in the USA. I have no right to saunter across the border and claim Mexican land as my birthrate as a mestizo. The reason is because if I am using a race based argument for land than I have to restrict that to the land via the tribe I come from. Mexican (70% of whom are meztiso) demanding land be seceded to Mexico away from whites and the USA because of a connection via a tribe in Mexico NOT the USA are very confused people. I don't think you should let them confuse you too. Especially given the level of animosity that existed into antiquity between the Mexica (and later the Mexicans) and the tribes in this country. I mean in California alone the Spanish-Mexican invasion resulted in the deaths of up to 70% of the entire state's amer-indian population.

Excellent point there.

Besides; prior to 1492 the Aztecs (I am using that group of Indians as a proxy for today's Mexicans) did not range that far north into what is our American Southwest.

Yes; 'Aztlan' is a fraud, pure and simple.

[Paleoroundtable]

Originally Posted by ArizonaBear

Excellent point there.

Originally Posted by ArizonaBear

Besides; prior to 1492 the Aztecs (I am using that group of Indians as a proxy for today's Mexicans) did not range that far north into what is our American Southwest.

Yes; 'Aztlan' is a fraud, pure and simple.

You are correct. There was some minor trade ambassadorship; however, the tribes in the SouthWest USA repelled any attempts to take their land by the Mexica tribes. It wasn't until later, using Spanish weapons and tactics, that Mexicans were able to finally conquer their historical enemies and when they did they did so with devasting results for the Ameri-Indian tribes this side of the border.

Actually, the reason there were so few Mexicans here even after they overcame the Native Americans whom had been their historical enemies was due to the Spanish custom (inherited from when the Umayyad ruled Spain [Read about the Muslim invasion and their subsequent loss of southern Europe]) of granting large tracts of land to mostly absent landowners. And Mexico mismanaged things so badly under that system that many of the few Mexicans here during that time actually left before California became a state.

The only ancestral claims on land via the tribes here in the USA (for those so uneducated as to limit property rights to merely who got where first), then that honor goes to the many Europeans that mix(ed) with the Amero-Indian tribes here. As mentioned, the tribes here warred into antiquity with the pre-Columbian tribes there, and the post-Columbian mestizos to the point that the languages, cultures, etc.. are different. The warrior Aztecs/Mexicas of which you speak buried each male's child umbilical cord as a pledge they would live the life of a warrior dedicated to killing and enslaving other tribes and whom were the predominant pre-Columbian indigenous people dominating northern Mexico at the time of the Spanish conquest led by Hernan CORTES in the early 16th century never got a foothold here due to the fierce resistance of the northerly tribes here in what we call today the United States of America. As a result, you don't find a history of Federally Recognized tribes in the USA adding Aztec/Mexica or meztizo Mexicans to their tribal rolls.

Everyone knows how it ended. Mexico initiated an action that led to the Mexican-American War by attacking a 63-man US patrol in contested territory with a 2,000 man Mexican calvary killing 11 of them. The Thorton affair, as it became known, prompted President Polk to declare that Mexico had "invaded our territory and shed American blood upon the American soil" and war was declared. Mexico lost that war and the land they had once taken by force from the Native American tribes here.

But not all was lost for them. Interpretations of the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution ratified in 1868 to assure citizenship to freed slaves and their descendants was expanded to offer anyone born in the United States automatic citizenship. The Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 (proposed by Emanuel Celler and heavily supported by many Democrat politicians for ideological and political power-building reasons and many Republican politicians so they could exploit cheap labor) abolished the national-origin quotas that had been in place here since the Immigration Act of 1924 which limited the number of immigrants who could be admitted from any country to 2% of the number of people from that country who were already living in the United States in 1890.

And tens of millions upon tens of millions of legal and illegal Latino immigrants rushed into the United States within a single generation. The results have not been good. In the SouthWestern United States today gone is much of the fields, groves, orchards, and farms that once helped define the American dream as well as provide relief within growing urban centers. In their place are sprawling concrete urban barrios held down by La Raza gangs preaching a political ideology of Reconquesta riddled with falsehoods.

In Los Angeles County (1 of 58 counties in California), white non-Latinos represent about one third of the population now. Consider that Los Angeles County has an official population of over 10,000,000 people which is more than the entire population of any single state except for seven. Some of the cities in Los Angeles now have very small white non-Latino populations falling from over 90% to as low as 1.65%. Los Angeles County must rely on aid from the State of California to survive even as their deficit continues to grow at an alarming rate. Many of those cities with low white non-Latino populations are in fiscal trouble as well. Unless something is done, this will become the blueprint for the nation. Especially after the 77 million aging baby-boomers pass into their retirement years and eventually out of the picture.

[LOGIC]

Really, these people crossing illegally could be green. Color doesn't matter they are illegal. That is what people are mad about. Not color or where they come from. Just that they are illegal and just keep coming. Race has nothing to do with it.

[Paleoroundtable]

Agreed. But when the illegal aliens, whomever they are, come up with racist arguments to justify their presence: they need to be understood and then refuted.

Originally Posted by LOGIC

Really, these people crossing illegally could be green. Color doesn't matter they are illegal. That is what people are mad about. Not color or where they come from. Just that they are illegal and just keep coming. Race has nothing to do with it.

[Exedous]

This thread brings up a valid point. Today, the recent tide of immigrants from Mexico are the darker folk in the southern states such as Oaxaca. I believe a lot of them speak dialect. The immigration from the past (including the early 90's) came from the northern Mexican states which the spanish seed has been spread around more. Ever seen a dark 3rd Generation Mexican? They pretty much look like Gringos

[Exedous]

Originally Posted by bigtallredhead

There are a lot Of pure blooded Indians coming from Mexico to the U.S., but most of them are CULTURALY Mestizo, speak Spanish and are not tribal. There are also a lot of Mestizos who are of mostly European decent coming over as well, both many from the urban middle class, which is struggling, and many from poor pheasant backgrounds in the north. Northern Mexico has a lot of very poor Mestizos of mostly European decent, including Irish. There are also some very wealthy mestizos in Mexico.

But on average, yes, The more Indian, the worse treated and the poorer, -and those of pure European decent are generally doing quite well. But actually, a lot of them are foreign born, especially American. Most of the "White" elite in Mexico actually do have some Indian blood, but are of mostly European decent, and are classified as "White".

Vicente fox is actually mestizo, BTW. He is tall and light skinned (but still tan), and has light hair. But look at his facial features. He has squint eyes, a somewhat hooked nose and high cheekbones. He is also part Irish, -who mostly came to Mexico as poor migrant workers and blended into the mestizo majority over time.

Seriously, if Fox were short and wore work cloths instead of a suit and Tie, but were otherwise the same, he would be called mestizo instead of white. Goes to show how socioeconomic class on it's own can influence racial classification.

All I have to say is, dude you have no idea what you're talking about. For starters, Vicente Fox's father is an American of Irish ancestry so that debunks your claim that his father was a poor migrant worker and blended into mestizo majority over time. Do you know what the meaning mestizo means? Clothes has nothing to do with it! I believe anyone who has white skin is thrusted into the white section. I know a couple which are Mexican and Guatemalan. The Mexican mother is whiter with Hazel eyes and the father looks straight up Mestizo. The kid turned out to have Blue eyes, white skin and RED hair.

Also, I think you might find this interesting

Aguascalientes, Mexico

The racial make-up of the state of Aguascalientes is as follows:

• 53% white/European descent (Mostly Spanish. But also Italian, Russian, Polish, German, Swedish, Greek, and Romanian)
• 44% mestizo (mixed Amerindian-European)
• 2% Asian (mostly Filipino, Japanese (Thanks to the biggest Nissan plant in Mexico) and Korean)
• 1% Amerindian, and small communities of Anglo Americans, and Anglo Canadians.

[ArizonaBear]

Originally Posted by Exedous

All I have to say is, dude you have no idea what you're talking about. For starters, Vicente Fox's father is an American of Irish ancestry so that debunks your claim that his father was a poor migrant worker and blended into mestizo majority over time. Do you know what the meaning mestizo means? Clothes has nothing to do with it! I believe anyone who has white skin is thrusted into the white section. I know a couple which are Mexican and Guatemalan. The Mexican mother is whiter with Hazel eyes and the father looks straight up Mestizo. The kid turned out to have Blue eyes, white skin and RED hair.

Also, I think you might find this interesting

Aguascalientes, Mexico

The racial make-up of the state of Aguascalientes is as follows:

• 53% white/European descent (Mostly Spanish. But also Italian, Russian, Polish, German, Swedish, Greek, and Romanian)
• 44% mestizo (mixed Amerindian-European)
• 2% Asian (mostly Filipino, Japanese (Thanks to the biggest Nissan plant in Mexico) and Korean)
• 1% Amerindian, and small communities of Anglo Americans, and Anglo Canadians.

To run with your ball further; Argentina is the 'Whitest' country in the New World.......97% White and 100% 'Hispanic'.

Hell; I just read a piece on MSN about today's Ireland being maybe 5% 'people of color'.

For that matter, London England is 25% people of color.......yet to you or I------they would all be Brits.

PS: Vicente Fox's father was of German heritage originally, his surname name was Fuchs-------which means 'Fox' in English. The mother was Quezeda (sp) from Spain.

[rpeinado]

``As a Cherokee Native I am deeply offended by the original poster. If the mexicans are mixed with native americans (mexico is also in north america by the way) is because they are also part our family, they share our indian blood!!``

I share your message above!

[Warrior87]

Vicente Fox's father was of german descent and his mom was mexican which descends from native americans not europeans (spanish/portuguese are european in case you didnt know) Looks can be decieving there are some latinos who are borderline white because of all the european blood that runs through their veins. Latinos are just like filipinos(asian/european)ancestry theyre mestizo(native american/european) ancestry

[Warrior87]

How can you prove that? just because they have lighter skin than the others. The conquistadores occupied latin america for over 300 years gunning down native warriors and raping the women, How do you think theyre going to look having european fathers? You have no idea what youre talking about as an argentinean(south american,italian,spanish,german) Argentina is like that because german and italian criminals were sent to argentina not to mention the conquistadores or the minority groups such as russians, jews, etc. Argentineans just like any other latino country descend from native americans(south american indians) but have the blood of spaniards,italians, germans, etc just like brazilians come from the same background but have angolan and portuguese blood in them.