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Old 07-08-2020, 09:42 PM
 
1,017 posts, read 764,422 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
What better explains the data is that the southern states that everyone is s***ting on just hit their peaks later -- that's it.
Exactly. Very well said!
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Old 07-08-2020, 09:46 PM
 
3,193 posts, read 1,770,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
That's great that you think he should do more reading. But the question of why deaths continue to go down literally everywhere that got hit hard already remains unanswered.

When you start going through the states that have been hit, you realize that something is causing the deaths to go down everywhere -- saying a state "got their problem under control" is at best window dressing (and at worst, politics). MD, DC, DE, and Philadelphia have seen their deaths crater, I guess they did as well as NY, NJ, and CT? New Orleans and Albany, Ga., which got hit hard extremely early, are seeing almost no deaths now -- that's because New Orleanians are great at hygiene and social distancing? It all really strains credulity for me. What better explains the data is that the southern states that everyone is s***ting on just hit their peaks later -- that's it.
See, the problem with this theory is that we are still seeing nearly 1,000 covid deaths per day as a country. Europe, which as a whole has a far lower death rate than the US (our death rate is ~70% higher than theirs to date), is seeing about half the daily deaths we are despite having more than double the US population. How do you explain that? Why is our rate to date approx 70% higher than all of Europe and the gap between the two continuing to grow every day? Why are we clearly continuing/headed in the wrong direction while they are headed in the right direction (along with just about every other developed country in this world outside the US)?
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Old 07-08-2020, 09:52 PM
 
Location: Illinois USA
1,030 posts, read 602,668 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward59 View Post
https://www.thecentersquare.com/illi...0777f03d5.html

Illinois residents are hurting financially more than most other states.
Maybe JB should wise up and reopen the state.
sure open up rest of the state [why should they suffer ] just keep chicagoland closed like till november
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Old 07-08-2020, 09:54 PM
 
Location: Illinois USA
1,030 posts, read 602,668 times
Reputation: 785
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtcbnd03 View Post
Or look at our hypocritical governor banning large gatherings while standing shoulder to shoulder in a Juneteenth march. Sure as heck looks like more than 10 people to me...great social distancing governor.



https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2020/0...imenez-vpx.cnn
Calling a politician a hypocrite ? How dare you ?
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:03 PM
 
Location: Cleveland
4,250 posts, read 4,463,690 times
Reputation: 5480
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kind Of Town View Post
See, the problem with this theory is that we are still seeing nearly 1,000 covid deaths per day as a country. Europe, which as a whole has a far lower death rate than the US (our death rate is ~70% higher than theirs to date), is seeing about half the daily deaths we are despite having more than double the US population. How do you explain that? Why is our rate to date approx 70% higher than all of Europe and the gap between the two continuing to grow every day? Why are we clearly continuing/headed in the wrong direction while they are headed in the right direction (along with just about every other developed country in this world outside the US)?
That isn't even true, based on basic arithmetic. The average number of deaths reported (many of which are from several days back, but still, deaths reported can be a decent measure) over the last seven days in this country is 586, which in no universe qualifies as "almost 1,000." Let's not make numbers up, okay?

The US is seeing more deaths right now than European countries because we got hit later. Many U.S. states are doing better than comparable European countries, by the way. Sweden, Georgia, and Ohio all have about the same population. Sweden has about twice as many deaths as either Georgia or Ohio, and although Sweden's deaths are going down slightly more quickly and consistently than Georgia or Ohio, the latter two states have seen their average daily deaths drop from the 40s a couple months ago to the teens today, going by date of death. This is despite Georgia and Ohio largely being open for at least the last six weeks.
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:15 PM
 
3,193 posts, read 1,770,643 times
Reputation: 1707
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
That isn't even true, based on basic arithmetic. The average number of deaths reported (many of which are from several days back, but still, deaths reported can be a decent measure) over the last seven days in this country is 586, which in no universe qualifies as "almost 1,000." Let's not make numbers up, okay?

The US is seeing more deaths right now than European countries because we got hit later. Many U.S. states are doing better than comparable European countries, by the way. Sweden, Georgia, and Ohio all have about the same population. Sweden has about twice as many deaths as either Georgia or Ohio, and although Sweden's deaths are going down slightly more quickly and consistently than Georgia or Ohio, the latter two states have seen their average daily deaths drop from the 40s a couple months ago to the teens today, going by date of death. This is despite Georgia and Ohio largely being open for at least the last six weeks.
The last two days the US has reported 993 and 890 covid deaths. That’s nearly 1,000 deaths per day. And we are seemingly headed in the wrong direction again with increasing daily cases and hospitalizations in many states so I expect that number to look worse before it looks better over the next several weeks.

The US started seeing the initial impact of covid like two weeks after Italy got pummeled. It’s not like we lagged Europe by months so the “we got hit later” argument doesn’t stand up. We’re now 4 months into this pandemic (at least). Seeing the first wave rock the US two weeks after Italy got hit is negligible in terms of where we stand today. It does not explain why we are seeing more cases and deaths here in the US despite having less than half the population of Europe.

Again, we’re doing something wrong and they’re doing something right or at least much better than we are. I’m guessing they aren’t idiots and actually wear masks in public settings and also haven’t decided to let er rip like some parts of this country have.
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Cleveland
4,250 posts, read 4,463,690 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kind Of Town View Post
The last two days the US has reported 993 and 890 covid deaths. That’s nearly 1,000 deaths per day. And we are seemingly headed in the wrong direction again with increasing daily cases and hospitalizations in many states so I expect that number to look worse before it looks better over the next several weeks.

The US started seeing the effects of covid like two weeks after Italy got pummeled. It’s not like we lagged Europe by months so the “we got hit later” argument doesn’t stand up. We’re now 4 months into this pandemic (at least). Seeing the first wave rock the US two weeks after Italy got hit is negligible in terms of where we stand today. It does not explain why we are seeing more cases and deaths here in the US despite having less than half the population of Europe.

Again, we’re doing something wrong and they’re doing something right or at least much better than we are. I’m guessing they aren’t idiots and actually wear masks in public settings and also haven’t decided to let er rip like some parts of this country have.
At least one of those was clearly influenced by backlog from a holiday weekend. It's been a month since we've actually broken 1,000 deaths in any day, and there were two days over the weekend that were below 300, but whatever, you know that "we are seemingly headed in the wrong direction," so I guess that last month of data means nothing.

If the time difference of our epidemic relative to theirs is negligible, and the U.S. is an irredeemable s*** show compared to the wise Europeans, then the U.S. should have way, way more cumulative deaths per capita than the total of the EU. Why don't you tally that up and see if that's true and get back to me?
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:24 PM
 
3,154 posts, read 1,683,975 times
Reputation: 9269
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kind Of Town View Post
The last two days the US has reported 993 and 890 covid deaths. That’s nearly 1,000 deaths per day. And we are seemingly headed in the wrong direction again with increasing daily cases and hospitalizations in many states so I expect that number to look worse before it looks better over the next several weeks.

The US started seeing the initial impact of covid like two weeks after Italy got pummeled. It’s not like we lagged Europe by months so the “we got hit later” argument doesn’t stand up. We’re now 4 months into this pandemic (at least). Seeing the first wave rock the US two weeks after Italy got hit is negligible in terms of where we stand today. It does not explain why we are seeing more cases and deaths here in the US despite having less than half the population of Europe.

Again, we’re doing something wrong and they’re doing something right or at least much better than we are. I’m guessing they aren’t idiots and actually wear masks in public settings and also haven’t decided to let er rip like some parts of this country have.
Maybe it's that their demographics are different than ours? Not sure about what percentage of their population vs. ours is over sixty, but they have much less of a problem with comorbidities than we have (especially obesity and diabetes), and they have WAY less people of African descent than we do, who are very much over-represented in those infected and dying of Covid-19. Part of this is they are also over-represented with comorbidities, but I believe there may be other factors than that at play - this damned disease just does not seem to like people of color very much.
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:44 PM
 
2,494 posts, read 1,858,422 times
Reputation: 1639
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribecavsbrowns View Post
That's great that you think he should do more reading. But the question of why deaths continue to go down literally everywhere that got hit hard already remains unanswered.

When you start going through the states that have been hit, you realize that something is causing the deaths to go down everywhere -- saying a state "got their problem under control" is at best window dressing (and at worst, politics). MD, DC, DE, and Philadelphia have seen their deaths crater, I guess they did as well as NY, NJ, and CT? New Orleans and Albany, Ga., which got hit hard extremely early, are seeing almost no deaths now -- that's because New Orleanians are great at hygiene and social distancing? It all really strains credulity for me. What better explains the data is that the southern states that everyone is s***ting on just hit their peaks later -- that's it.
So is your argument that because the southern states hit their peaks later (actually for most its their second peek), and thus they're not seeing the accumulated deaths yet?

There's nothing political about it. The southern states largely are not doing much about it. Florida is mainly ignoring the problem. Texas ignored the problem well beyond the point most states that were hit hard in March, waiting til they had like 5k cases a day to do a thing.
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:47 PM
 
2,494 posts, read 1,858,422 times
Reputation: 1639
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curly Q. Bobalink View Post
Maybe it's that their demographics are different than ours? Not sure about what percentage of their population vs. ours is over sixty, but they have much less of a problem with comorbidities than we have (especially obesity and diabetes), and they have WAY less people of African descent than we do, who are very much over-represented in those infected and dying of Covid-19. Part of this is they are also over-represented with comorbidities, but I believe there may be other factors than that at play - this damned disease just does not seem to like people of color very much.
What other countries did better is acknowledged there was a virus, got it under control and minimized cases to the point where contact tracing and masks were used regularly. The United States did not do that outside of a handful of locations.

It goes beyond deaths. Theres significantly fewer cases in most other countries hit around the same time as us. Please don't get started with comparing populations, because if you can do fractions, you'll know the argument is BS.
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