Young professional looking to move to Indy? (Indianapolis, Columbus: how much, employment)

[timothyaw]

Originally Posted by BU191433

Correct me if I am wrong. Wasn't the smoking ban for restaurants passed several years ago and they ban that just passed recently was for bars. So he is just plain wrong about that.


As to this

Not sure how you can quanify this, but maybe he just lived in the wrong neighborhoods. I recently moved into a brand new Carmel neighborhood (new section of Village of West Clay - homes around $400K) On my street of the 12 neigbors I have met 8 have never lived in Indiana before in their lifetimes. 2 grew up here, moved away at some point and moved back, and 2 have basically lived here their whole lives.

Well how snooty of you to mention you live in a $400k neighborhood, that information wasn't necessary to make your point .

Anyway, that's the problem with people here; you can't say anything bad about Naptown/Indiana. They think Indiana is Utopia, nothing better. That's the mindset of people that haven't broadened their horizons and explored other areas of the WORLD, not just the U.S. of A. The NYC's, LA's, Miami's have their cons as well. Any city I like, I acknowledge the pros AND CONS; I'm objective and keep an open mind. Not so in Indiana.

[msamhunter]

Originally Posted by timothyaw

Well how snooty of you to mention you live in a $400k neighborhood, that information wasn't necessary to make your point .

Anyway, that's the problem with people here; you can't say anything bad about Naptown/Indiana. They think Indiana is Utopia, nothing better. That's the mindset of people that haven't broadened their horizons and explored other areas of the WORLD, not just the U.S. of A. The NYC's, LA's, Miami's have their cons as well. Any city I like, I acknowledge the pros AND CONS; I'm objective and keep an open mind. Not so in Indiana.

and that's how everyone know you don't like Indiana since you will never say anything nice about it, glass half empty type mentality.

As far as the smoking ban, there are a lot of people do not want to be a nanny city like NYC is becoming. If you want to smoke, go to a bar that allows it. If you don't, go to a bar that doesn't. It's that simple and a lot of people including non-smokers here tend to think that's crossing the line with individual rights of the person and the business owner. Nothing wrong with that.

[jupiler]

I have a similar opinion as OP, though I don't think the harsh language was necessary.

Indy was ranked low in uniqueness/weirdness by a multi-dimensional city review. In the study, Indy deviated little from the national average preferences in TV, movies, consumer behavior, etc. It pretty much means Indy lacks character and creativity compared to certain other big cities. Young professionals (and others) who find Indy an oasis are likely people who conform to the national average. For example, I would characterize the average male here as either white or black, straight, not very liberal, settled down, have family and/or old friends around here, like sports and home improvement, and drink beer. If you don't fit several of the above, you're going to have a hard time fitting in. I do know non-conformists who have found their own circle here, but in general they're better off elsewhere where their diversity is more established and welcome (google and ask around the forums for suggestions).

Indy is a great place for the conservative to moderate "average joe" type. If you're more adventurous and/or weird, look elsewhere.

[timothyaw]

Originally Posted by timothyaw

Well how snooty of you to mention you live in a $400k neighborhood, that information wasn't necessary to make your point .

Anyway, that's the problem with people here; you can't say anything bad about Naptown/Indiana. They think Indiana is Utopia, nothing better. That's the mindset of people that haven't broadened their horizons and explored other areas of the WORLD, not just the U.S. of A. The NYC's, LA's, Miami's have their cons as well. Any city I like, I acknowledge the pros AND CONS; I'm objective and keep an open mind. Not so in Indiana.

Ha Ha, but I have said a couple of positive things about Naptown/Indiana. You just missed those comments.

[IndyBound75]

Originally Posted by jupiler

I have a similar opinion as OP, though I don't think the harsh language was necessary.

Indy was ranked low in uniqueness/weirdness by a multi-dimensional city review. In the study, Indy deviated little from the national average preferences in TV, movies, consumer behavior, etc. It pretty much means Indy lacks character and creativity compared to certain other big cities. Young professionals (and others) who find Indy an oasis are likely people who conform to the national average. For example, I would characterize the average male here as either white or black, straight, not very liberal, settled down, have family and/or old friends around here, like sports and home improvement, and drink beer. If you don't fit several of the above, you're going to have a hard time fitting in. I do know non-conformists who have found their own circle here, but in general they're better off elsewhere where their diversity is more established and welcome (google and ask around the forums for suggestions).

Indy is a great place for the conservative to moderate "average joe" type. If you're more adventurous and/or weird, look elsewhere.

I lean on the boring side but weird in a good way. Will I automatically be shunned because of those 2 traits?

[mobyhead]

My advice: find the nearest cornfield a take a long, long stroll into it. You're better off as fertilizer for the corn.

Oh Snap!

[chalcedony]

Originally Posted by PotIHC

So you mean that your sample of size of 1 leads you to this conclusion? Good luck with that education.

Besides statistics, you may want to focus on reading comprehension as well. The author is referring to young professionals. Being 23 and still getting an education hardly makes you a professional.

Your simple, small town Kansas mindset is precisely the problem the author is alluding too. If I moved from the cornfields to an inhabited village, I might be impressed too. Guess we cannot expect you to relate.

For the real young professionals with class, taste, culture, ambition, and intelligence thinking about moving to Indy, I would heed the author's advice.

IHC

Isn't the original poster ALSO a "small sample of size of 1" or whatever you're trying to say?

And does anyone else have the sneaking suspicion that PotIHC and IndyTruth are one and the same person?

Oh, and Kentucky hasn't yet passed a smoking ban...not in the least. Maybe some of their cities have (all two of them), but definitely not the state as a whole.

[chalcedony]

Originally Posted by jupiler

I have a similar opinion as OP, though I don't think the harsh language was necessary.

Indy was ranked low in uniqueness/weirdness by a multi-dimensional city review. In the study, Indy deviated little from the national average preferences in TV, movies, consumer behavior, etc. It pretty much means Indy lacks character and creativity compared to certain other big cities. Young professionals (and others) who find Indy an oasis are likely people who conform to the national average. For example, I would characterize the average male here as either white or black, straight, not very liberal, settled down, have family and/or old friends around here, like sports and home improvement, and drink beer. If you don't fit several of the above, you're going to have a hard time fitting in. I do know non-conformists who have found their own circle here, but in general they're better off elsewhere where their diversity is more established and welcome (google and ask around the forums for suggestions).

Indy is a great place for the conservative to moderate "average joe" type. If you're more adventurous and/or weird, look elsewhere.

Hey, that uniqueness/weirdness study sounds really interesting and SUPER hard to implement. After all, wouldn't it be subject to the biases of the implementor, in terms of what he or she determines to be "national average"? I'd agree that Indy clearly has something people see as "test market material"--reflective of certain norms that explains why national chains try their luck here, etc. It's the same characteristic as Columbus (OH), Kansas City, and several other of the "new-wave" fast growing Midwestern cities.

But I had to write because you are an Indy naysayer who seems far more mature and level-headed than others, and you offer a good contrast because you don't automatically assume that everyone else who writes for the forum is parochial and completely untravelled. Many people on the forum are from somewhere else; many others may have grown there, come back, and returned. Some of us have had our own frustrations with what we saw lacking in Indy but have either overcome those frustrations or have witnessed a city that has transcended them in some way. It'll be that way anywhere though, wouldn't it?

Either way, the standard of creating norms for a region through stereotyping could be done just as easily elsewhere as in Indy. I noticed you do a lot of posting in the SF/Bay Area, which, I'd imagine, most in the US could probably describe an "average male" there more accurately than they could in Indy (not only because of its higher national profile). I mean, who defines statistical averages, and wouldn't a lifestyle that is deviant in one place seem normative elsewhere...and thus could hardly be defined as weird?!

I can't help but think of a very urban college town directly touching a much bigger city that I used to live in, not all that different, I'd imagine, from Berkeley (but not Berkeley, I promise). This urban college town had all the alternative shops, walkable storefronts, university-driven diversity, political leftism--much of it was very exhilarating, at the time. But then I felt like these people were walking clichés after awhile, the smugness got on my nerves, and the cost of living was impossible (which was so bad that folks with Masters degrees who could live comfortably anywhere in the Midwest were paying big bucks for apartments on the verge of collapse). I eventually learned that the "diversity" was only among the renters, many of whom were either students (the Asians) or folks in public housing (the blacks and Hispanics); the few people who owned homes in this urban college town were all blue-blooded whites. The obliviousness of the population to this "progressive" mix of policy-driven segregation seemed hypocritcal to me, and the "average joe" type that you describe was completely pushed out...they would have been rejected completely by the "open-minded" population who really only endorse "their" version of diversity. And all those edgy local shops were out of reach because I was spending so much &*#* money on housing!!!!

In the end, after living in 6 or 7 other cities and states (US and abroad) Indy seems to me more diverse than that urban college town and a whole lot more adaptable because life is easier. Sure, the neighborhood culture still isn't great, but it's certainly improving light years over what it was even a decade ago, and it's easier to leave a big mark b/c the bigger fish can stand out in a smaller pond.

Obviously this could have been a PM, but this is a broader message because it addresses on the myopic generalizations from the OP, who is no better than the mindless cheerleading we see here among other posters. Maybe my experience is unique, but I came back to Indy because I felt like it could be what I made out of it--far more than the larger cities I've lived in. Sure, others might disagree, but the fact that it's the fastest growing major metro in the Midwest (and faster growing than most of the metros on the coast) would suggest there are others who feel the same way.

[jupiler]

For anyone interested in the multidimensional review of cities that I mentioned, which ranks cities/metro areas in 20 categories including weirdness, you can find it here: City Vitals I (2006) |*CEOs for Cities

It is from 2006. There is a 2012 version, but not freely accessible.

I wrote some code to calculate the average rank of each metro area. Here is the result. Sadly, Indy ranks 47 out of 50.



1. SanFrancisco|Oakland|SanJose. *Average rank: 7.2/50 (based on 20 rankings - [5, 1, 3, 1, 3, 1, 1, 10, 16, 40, 17, 1, 4, 1, 6, 18, 1, 1, 1, 13])
2. Seattle. *Average rank: 8.75/50 (based on 20 rankings - [8, 7, 10, 13, 12, 7, 11, 9, 5, 12, 13, 6, 6, 7, 16, 3, 5, 12, 5, 8])
3. Portland. *Average rank: 12.2/50 (based on 20 rankings - [20, 21, 22, 18, 22, 7, 12, 6, 6, 7, 7, 3, 8, 15, 40, 4, 11, 8, 4, 3])
4. Boston. *Average rank: 12.9/50 (based on 20 rankings - [4, 6, 4, 5, 13, 9, 2, 19, 40, 21, 28, 3, 2, 8, 4, 43, 10, 23, 3, 11])
5. Raleigh|Durham. *Average rank: 13.05/50 (based on 19 rankings - [1, 2, 1, 2, 21, 6, 5, 23, 20, 18, 5, 13, 27, 3, 12, 27, 17, 24, 21])
6. Denver. *Average rank: 13.5/50 (based on 20 rankings - [6, 5, 6, 9, 27, 6, 12, 11, 17, 19, 6, 47, 14, 10, 29, 10, 3, 2, 21, 10])
7. Washington|Baltimore. *Average rank: 13.8/50 (based on 20 rankings - [2, 3, 7, 3, 8, 30, 17, 29, 10, 26, 14, 34, 7, 5, 8, 37, 6, 4, 7, 19])
8. Austin. *Average rank: 13.89/50 (based on 19 rankings - [3, 4, 2, 4, 17, 3, 3, 24, 15, 41, 4, 49, 11, 1, 1, 17, 7, 28, 30])
9. SanDiego. *Average rank: 14.8/50 (based on 20 rankings - [16, 8, 15, 20, 5, 4, 4, 4, 9, 42, 25, 30, 11, 3, 18, 6, 7, 19, 16, 34])
10. Minneapolis|StPaul. *Average rank: 16.55/50 (based on 20 rankings - [7, 9, 8, 7, 37, 8, 40, 26, 13, 1, 2, 18, 21, 22, 25, 5, 9, 13, 38, 22])
11. NewYork. *Average rank: 16.7/50 (based on 20 rankings - [6, 10, 14, 10, 4, 22, 16, 4, 11, 43, 49, 36, 1, 4, 11, 50, 14, 11, 2, 16])
12. Atlanta. *Average rank: 21.45/50 (based on 20 rankings - [9, 5, 12, 8, 19, 31, 45, 49, 14, 38, 26, 23, 20, 14, 19, 21, 15, 15, 26, 20])
13. Sacramento. *Average rank: 21.65/50 (based on 20 rankings - [25, 30, 43, 10, 11, 5, 8, 29, 8, 37, 18, 21, 24, 20, 22, 20, 16, 20, 17, 49])
14. SaltLakeCity. *Average rank: 21.7/50 (based on 20 rankings - [32, 35, 32, 26, 29, 8, 22, 22, 25, 28, 1, 29, 22, 16, 26, 35, 2, 21, 22, 1])
15. Miami|FortLauderdale. *Average rank: 21.7/50 (based on 20 rankings - [38, 39, 46, 41, 1, 32, 2, 19, 2, 44, 48, 27, 10, 2, 10, 36, 8, 3, 9, 17])
16. WestPalmBeach. *Average rank: 21.84/50 (based on 19 rankings - [21, 22, 48, 37, 9, 32, 1, 34, 1, 32, 32, 36, 9, 49, 25, 4, 10, 6, 7])
17. Chicago. *Average rank: 22.8/50 (based on 20 rankings - [12, 13, 12, 23, 10, 27, 25, 36, 26, 34, 36, 23, 3, 12, 28, 42, 34, 9, 14, 37])
18. Rochester. *Average rank: 22.9/50 (based on 20 rankings - [19, 28, 13, 17, 34, 2, 43, 37, 34, 16, 10, 11, 30, 33, 12, 45, 38, 18, 13, 5])
19. LosAngeles. *Average rank: 22.95/50 (based on 20 rankings - [40, 36, 42, 20, 2, 18, 3, 18, 12, 50, 41, 32, 9, 6, 14, 47, 13, 5, 11, 40])
20. Dallas|FortWorth. *Average rank: 25/50 (based on 20 rankings - [11, 17, 15, 18, 15, 17, 11, 47, 21, 45, 44, 44, 29, 17, 9, 38, 21, 6, 29, 46])
21. Philadelphia. *Average rank: 25.1/50 (based on 20 rankings - [19, 18, 21, 21, 24, 19, 15, 16, 31, 13, 40, 39, 5, 18, 21, 48, 42, 34, 20, 38])
22. Houston. *Average rank: 25.9/50 (based on 20 rankings - [31, 20, 30, 19, 6, 16, 34, 14, 24, 48, 38, 46, 25, 13, 15, 39, 22, 16, 34, 28])
23. Hartford. *Average rank: 26/50 (based on 20 rankings - [12, 19, 16, 11, 20, 14, 30, 50, 36, 20, 15, 17, 28, 21, 46, 22, 37, 33, 25, 48])
24. Phoenix. *Average rank: 26.35/50 (based on 20 rankings - [33, 29, 33, 25, 23, 13, 44, 12, 25, 46, 35, 43, 23, 25, 23, 9, 23, 14, 18, 31])
25. Orlando. *Average rank: 27/50 (based on 19 rankings - [34, 33, 29, 14, 29, 32, 41, 10, 27, 31, 42, 10, 23, 37, 2, 36, 27, 15, 41])
26. Detroit. *Average rank: 27.15/50 (based on 20 rankings - [32, 25, 11, 36, 16, 10, 18, 37, 33, 11, 24, 22, 36, 28, 17, 49, 33, 26, 44, 35])
27. Richmond. *Average rank: 27.26/50 (based on 19 rankings - [14, 16, 16, 22, 36, 37, 31, 27, 40, 22, 27, 42, 34, 36, 26, 39, 25, 19, 9])
28. Columbus. *Average rank: 27.45/50 (based on 20 rankings - [9, 17, 13, 14, 31, 32, 41, 48, 41, 8, 8, 45, 31, 42, 7, 8, 46, 31, 32, 45])
29. Pittsburgh. *Average rank: 29.05/50 (based on 20 rankings - [27, 26, 34, 27, 49, 22, 21, 38, 20, 14, 31, 7, 15, 48, 13, 34, 44, 49, 33, 29])
30. Charlotte. *Average rank: 29.2/50 (based on 20 rankings - [23, 11, 35, 26, 38, 42, 21, 38, 23, 39, 12, 15, 37, 35, 47, 11, 30, 41, 42, 18])
31. Jacksonville. *Average rank: 29.84/50 (based on 19 rankings - [47, 46, 47, 28, 40, 9, 46, 36, 13, 9, 21, 8, 30, 50, 24, 26, 45, 30, 12])
32. StLouis. *Average rank: 30.2/50 (based on 20 rankings - [24, 28, 27, 28, 41, 29, 32, 29, 35, 6, 11, 20, 27, 36, 30, 40, 50, 29, 43, 39])
33. NewOrleans. *Average rank: 30.25/50 (based on 20 rankings - [44, 44, 43, 49, 33, 49, 13, 18, 45, 23, 29, 19, 13, 37, 24, 19, 28, 37, 36, 2])
34. Nashville. *Average rank: 30.58/50 (based on 19 rankings - [22, 26, 14, 31, 44, 48, 7, 22, 46, 25, 47, 12, 44, 41, 15, 25, 50, 35, 27])
35. Milwaukee. *Average rank: 30.65/50 (based on 20 rankings - [23, 31, 23, 30, 45, 25, 32, 46, 42, 2, 16, 40, 12, 31, 42, 27, 31, 24, 41, 50])
36. Providence. *Average rank: 30.7/50 (based on 20 rankings - [43, 43, 40, 26, 38, 26, 3, 47, 28, 36, 50, 9, 26, 26, 20, 33, 40, 43, 23, 14])
37. Tampa|StPetersburg. *Average rank: 30.85/50 (based on 20 rankings - [45, 49, 18, 39, 46, 38, 5, 39, 28, 24, 45, 13, 33, 24, 32, 31, 29, 28, 8, 43])
38. Cincinnati. *Average rank: 31/50 (based on 20 rankings - [29, 24, 27, 25, 42, 14, 44, 43, 44, 5, 19, 26, 17, 38, 31, 30, 48, 39, 50, 25])
39. Buffalo. *Average rank: 31.35/50 (based on 20 rankings - [35, 40, 37, 48, 39, 20, 20, 43, 50, 17, 37, 16, 16, 46, 2, 28, 41, 32, 27, 33])
40. KansasCity. *Average rank: 31.45/50 (based on 20 rankings - [15, 17, 15, 24, 47, 38, 35, 28, 23, 10, 34, 38, 35, 39, 44, 17, 49, 38, 39, 44])
41. OklahomaCity. *Average rank: 31.95/50 (based on 20 rankings - [30, 39, 41, 41, 32, 50, 7, 24, 38, 29, 33, 35, 39, 46, 5, 23, 20, 36, 47, 24])
42. Cleveland. *Average rank: 32.35/50 (based on 20 rankings - [38, 37, 31, 36, 35, 21, 14, 32, 31, 4, 30, 28, 18, 45, 27, 44, 47, 42, 40, 47])
43. Norfolk|VirginiaBeach. *Average rank: 32.95/50 (based on 20 rankings - [47, 45, 33, 42, 30, 41, 15, 33, 47, 35, 46, 33, 34, 31, 35, 32, 32, 30, 12, 6])
44. GrandRapids. *Average rank: 33.42/50 (based on 19 rankings - [42, 35, 42, 39, 50, 42, 26, 42, 49, 3, 3, 2, 41, 48, 41, 18, 35, 45, 32])
45. Greensboro. *Average rank: 33.68/50 (based on 19 rankings - [48, 34, 49, 45, 48, 36, 27, 22, 48, 30, 9, 3, 40, 39, 46, 24, 46, 31, 15])
46. SanAntonio. *Average rank: 33.85/50 (based on 20 rankings - [49, 46, 44, 48, 25, 40, 30, 39, 19, 47, 23, 48, 19, 29, 38, 16, 35, 22, 37, 23])
47. Indianapolis. *Average rank: 34.1/50 (based on 20 rankings - [18, 32, 28, 24, 46, 27, 42, 30, 35, 33, 20, 31, 38, 42, 45, 14, 45, 44, 46, 42])
48. LasVegas. *Average rank: 34.32/50 (based on 19 rankings - [50, 50, 50, 50, 7, 46, 17, 49, 45, 49, 43, 40, 18, 33, 7, 12, 40, 10, 36])
49. Louisville. *Average rank: 37.26/50 (based on 19 rankings - [41, 38, 45, 44, 43, 45, 33, 39, 46, 15, 22, 25, 50, 43, 13, 43, 48, 49, 26])
50. Memphis. *Average rank: 37.5/50 (based on 20 rankings - [34, 36, 47, 37, 40, 44, 50, 48, 37, 27, 39, 50, 32, 48, 34, 29, 19, 47, 48, 4])

[ischyros]

Originally Posted by jupiler

I have a similar opinion as OP, though I don't think the harsh language was necessary.

Indy was ranked low in uniqueness/weirdness by a multi-dimensional city review. In the study, Indy deviated little from the national average preferences in TV, movies, consumer behavior, etc. It pretty much means Indy lacks character and creativity compared to certain other big cities. Young professionals (and others) who find Indy an oasis are likely people who conform to the national average. For example, I would characterize the average male here as either white or black, straight, not very liberal, settled down, have family and/or old friends around here, like sports and home improvement, and drink beer. If you don't fit several of the above, you're going to have a hard time fitting in. I do know non-conformists who have found their own circle here, but in general they're better off elsewhere where their diversity is more established and welcome (google and ask around the forums for suggestions).

Indy is a great place for the conservative to moderate "average joe" type. If you're more adventurous and/or weird, look elsewhere.

This is good and bad. Indy is often used as a trial for new products and services for companies because of the fact that Indy is so set on the straight and narrow. Companies know that if something works in Indy, it will work for the majority of the country. Like I said, that can be good and bad depending on how you view it.