More detailed mass transit plan (Indianapolis, Evansville: how much, construction, taxes)

[urbanologist]

Originally Posted by ischyros

I agree. So many people seem to have a problem with the rail aspect of the plan. The only way to get this passed may be to change the rail portion to bus rapid transit.

Removing the existing rail line would be more costly though.

[Parkrow160]

ischyros , mega thanks for the indyconnect.org link! I've become a bit skeptical of many of the recent stories found on indystar.com. After reading through the article, the overall transit plan presents huge opportunities for the region (IMHO)!

Clay

[ischyros]

Originally Posted by urbanologist

Removing the existing rail line would be more costly though.

Yes, it would. And I think if they went light rail, they'd have to replace most of the rail through their, anyway. But my point was it would still be cheaper than a whole brand new rail line from Noblesville to downtown.

[grmasterb]

Originally Posted by ischyros

Yes, it would. And I think if they went light rail, they'd have to replace most of the rail through their, anyway. But my point was it would still be cheaper than a whole brand new rail line from Noblesville to downtown.

I was told by a gentleman with the transportation museum that the entire track would have to be replaced to accommodate light rail. Then there would be the cost of double tracking.

[mwbshoener]

Have any of you been to Portland Oregon ? The transit there is what we need. A city of this size needs light rail, not bus routes.

[Born 2 Roll]

The backers of this mass transit plan are going about trying to get it enacted in the wrong way.

The backers of this mass transit should not be trying to get approval for a regional referendum to raise taxes from a tax increase-averse, transit-averse and government expansion-averse legislative body in the Indiana General Assembly.

Instead, the backers of this plan should be going about funding this plan WITHOUT the use of a new sales tax with the utilization of user fees (in the form of inflation-indexed distance-based fares that automatically rise with inflation so that farebox revenues always cover NO LESS THAN 70% of operating costs).

At a bare minimum, the backers of this plan should also be going about funding this plan with private financing in increments by first term-leasing the future passenger rail line on the Nickel Plate right-of-way, all revenue-generating transit-owned real estate assets along the line (the land around the future stations that could be used for the construction of mixed-use transit-oriented development) and selected connecting bus lines out to a private operating entity who would be responsible for all design, construction, operating and continuing maintenance costs during the life of the lease.

Ideally, in addition to funding the future mass transit line, the transit-owned real estate assets along the line and selected connecting bus lines by term-leasing them out to a private operating entity, the backers of this mass transit plan could take the transportation financing concept one step further by term-leasing the future passenger rail transit on the Nickel Plate right-of-way along with a tightly-constricted parkway-like future toll road converted out of the existing at-grade Binford Boulevard between Keystone Avenue and the I-465/I-69 Northeast interchange out to a private operating entity.

The private operating entity leasing the future passenger rail line on the Nickel Plate ROW and the future toll road converted out of Binford Blvd between Keystone and the I-465/I-69 NE interchange would be responsible for all design, construction, operating and maintenance costs of both the future passenger rail line (and selected connecting bus routes) and the future toll road converted out of Binford Blvd.

The future toll road would utilize congestion pricing during peak traffic hours (with tolls rising as congestion increases primarily during morning and evening rush hours, but also as needed before and after traffic-generating special events) to encourage motorists to use the passenger rail transit line on the parallel Nickel Plate ROW between Noblesville and Downtown Indy.

The backers of the mass transit plan could also take the transportation financing concept a step further and push to term-lease out to a private operating entity the future passenger rail line on the Nickel Plate ROW and a future toll road converted out of Binford Blvd along with the future improvements that the state has planned to S.R. 37 between I-69 in Fishers and S.R. 32/38 in Noblesville (...future improvements which involve converting S.R. 37 from a busy surface road with signalized at-grade intersections to an expressway with grade-separated junctions and traffic circle interchanges like Keystone Parkway through Carmel).

User fees in the form of distance-based tolls would be applied on S.R. 37 in Fishers and Noblesville to pay for the pending improvements to the road between I-69 and S.R. 32/38, while congestion pricing (with tolls rising during morning and evening rush hours) could be utilized to encourage drivers to use the passenger rail line on the parallel Nickel Plate ROW.

Term-leasing out to private operating entities the future passenger rail line on the Nickel Plate ROW (and transit-owned real estate assets along the line and selected connecting bus lines) together with future toll roads converted out of Binford Blvd in Northeast Indianapolis and S.R. 37 in Fishers and Noblesville eliminates all design, construction, operating and maintenance costs of the leased-out transportation infrastructure to the public during the life of the lease.

Term-leasing out to private operating entities the future passenger rail line on the Nickel Plate ROW (and transit-owned real estate assets along the line and selected connecting bus lines) together with future toll roads converted out of Binford Blvd in Northeast Indianapolis and S.R. 37 in Fishers and Noblesville also brings in hundreds-of-millions, if not billions of dollars in profit to the public that can be applied as start-up costs for non-revenue generating (and revenue-generating) transportation infrastructure projects elsewhere (...non-revenue generating projects bus lines, bike lanes, recreational trails, etc).

[ischyros]

Tolls on Binford or SR 37 would just increase traffic on 2-lane parallel roads like Allisonville.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by ischyros

Tolls on Binford or SR 37 would just increase traffic on 2-lane parallel roads like Allisonville.

Tolls would also pay for the improvements, upgrades and continuing maintenance to Binford and SR 37.

Tolls on Binford and SR 37 would also increase ridership on the passenger rail line that runs parallel to Binford/I-69/SR 37 on the Nickel Plate ROW.

[Born 2 Roll]

We could also take the transportation financing concept even further and get much-needed improvements and upgrades to I-69, US 31 North, I-65 and affected nearby/parallel future transit lines (bus and rail) by eliminating the fuel tax funding of those 3 major roads and replacing it with user fee-funding in the form of inflation-indexed distance-based tolls that rise with inflation so that 100% of all maintenance costs are always covered by the user fees.

The portions of the roads that were closest to Indianapolis would also feature variable tolls that increase with the amount of congestion on the roadway during peak hours (primarily during morning and evening rush hours) so as to encourage drivers to use transit.

After eliminating fuel tax funding on I-69, US 31 North and I-65 and replacing that fuel tax funding with tolls on the three major roads, the public would term-lease the roads for a profit out to one or more private operating entities who would be responsible for paying all design, construction, operating and continuing maintenance costs of the improvements and upgrades to the 3 major roads and any accompanying transit lines.

In return for implementing user fees on the 3 major roads and leasing them along with accompanying transit lines out to private operating entities, the public would get:

...Cash rebates on the portion of fuel tax they paid that no longer funds the maintenance of the 3 term-leased major roads.

...The elimination of all design, construction and maintenance costs to the public of the term-leased infrastructure (the 3 major roads and accompanying transit lines) during the life of the lease.

...Multiple billions of dollars in profit from the leases that can be applied towards other transportation infrastructure projects elsewhere on non-revenue producing transportation infrastructure (untolled roads, non-profit producing transit lines, etc).

...Improved night lightning where needed, a variable speed limit on electronic signs that increases to as high as 85 mph (80-85 mph on rural segments and 60-70 on urban segments) when driving conditions are perfect and decreases when needed to as low as needed when driving conditions are not perfect (heavy traffic, accidents, bad weather, etc).

...The widening of I-69 at least 6 lanes between Indianapolis and the Indiana-Michigan State Line, and the completion of I-69 between Evansville and Indianapolis.

...The completion of the full conversion of US 31 North from a 4-lane highway with at-grade intersections to a multi-lane superhighway with grade-separated intersections and interchanges between Indianapolis and South Bend.

...The widening of I-65 to at least 6 lanes between Indianapolis and Chicago (Gary) to the north and between Indianapolis and the Louisville area to the south.

...Congestion pricing on the segments of the 3 major roads (I-69, US 31 and I-65) closest to Indianapolis in the form of variable tolls that would be priced as needed to keep traffic on the road moving at an average of at least 45-50 mph during peak traffic times to encourage drivers to use transit and carpool.

...High-capacity passenger rail transit service on existing abandoned and near-abandoned rail right-of-ways between Indianapolis and Kokomo (via the Nickel Plate right-of-way) and between Indianapolis and Anderson and Muncie.

...Bus service upgrades between Downtown Indianapolis and Carmel and Westfield.

...Full funding of current operations and future upgrades to the Hoosier State passenger rail service between Indianapolis and Chicago.

...Funding of design, construction, operation and maintenance costs of future passenger rail service between Indianapolis and Louisville.

...Funding of selected current and future connecting and intersecting bus lines in the term-leased transportation corridors.

[ColdAilment]

So will this new "mass transit" line be an expanded and improved bus line or is it going to be a light and urban rail line?

I really think a rail line would serve Indianapolis well.