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Indy's reputation for crime is unfortunately becoming known nationwide. When I travel to other states, meet people and tell them I am from the Indy area they nearly always bring up crime.
It used to be when I mentioned I was from Indianapolis people would ask about the Indy 500. Now they ask about crime.
I traveled for work with several of my coworkers recently and we spent two weeks working out west. As we were packing our equipment to come back home, the company owner that we had been working closely with said, "I worry about you girls going home to Indy." He said all he heard about Indy lately was violence and crime. We assured him that we all lived in the suburbs, not Indianapolis, and he was relieved.
Are "suburbanite fears" excessive? Perhaps. I work in Indy but choose not to live there. I feel more peace of mind when my kids are riding their bikes in my Hamilton county neighborhood than I would if they were in Indy.
I think you're exactly right. When I got the offer to move up here about five months ago, I wanted to live in an urban setting, but the more I read about the city, the more I didn't want to take that risk. Indy and my hometown are about neck and neck on crime, but why would I deliberately move from one high crime area to another? That's why I chose the suburbs, even though I'm fairly young, make decent money, and could afford the city. It's actually cheaper for me to live where I do in Carmel than to find an equivalent, safe place in the city. Living in a "safe" area of the city is just as expensive, as a renter, as the suburbs. I've yet to see one LEO needed at my admittedly modest apartment in five months here in Carmel.
Memphis is another case in point where its history gets overshadowed by crime. Memphis has a terrific history of BBQ, blues, and rock and roll, but that often gets forgotten about by people who aren't from TN. Some direct TV salesman asked where I was from yesterday at Costco and immediately went off on the crime in Memphis. He wasn't from TN, yet the reputation of Memphis was the first thing on his mind. Sadly, Indy doesn't have the culture/history of Memphis/Detroit (IMO), so the crime is going to be even quicker to come to mind.
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Originally Posted by wh15395
Well once again, enjoy using up our resources and taking our jobs so that you can contribute your tax dollars to a suburb whose main purpose is allowing people to have big city amenities without big-city diversity or big-city problems.
It must be nice to have the ability to act like the problems in Indianapolis aren't also problems for Fishers, but that thought process will eventually be the detriment of that, and many other suburbs. The future will most likely involve rich people choosing Center Township over Fishers once the poor start to move into all of those "nice" vinyl boxes that suburban people love so much.
I'd bet my bottom dollar the suburbanites are better educated and often holding a higher proportion of the better jobs in the city, on average, than city residents. The suburbanites aren't "taking your jobs" - they are filling many jobs that would probably otherwise go unfilled. If I had no choice but to live in the city of Indianapolis when I received the offer, I would have just declined it.
The suburbs absolutely do need to be worried about the core city being viable. Like I said previously, if Indy is not thought of as a viable option, Fishers/Carmel/Zionsville are going to be left in the dark. Look at what's happened to Detroit.
We absolutely do contribute sales tax revenue to the city. If any state level taxes are distributed to benefit the City of Indy, then all Hoosiers end up subsidizing Indy.
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Originally Posted by grmasterb
Suburban morons living in fear of all things below 96th Street and ridiculing the Indy crime wave are burying their heads in the sand. At the same time, urbanists who constantly point the finger at the suburbs, blaming whitey for moving, aren't part of the solution either.
Agreed. There are safe areas below 96th, but most people just don't have a pressing need to go there. I go below 96th and am never in fear, but there is nothing there I need.
Sadly, all this crime brings up uncomfortable thoughts and discussions about race.
The "city = danger" way of thinking has gotten that way because of the demonstrable crime in the city. The city of Indianapolis is far more dangerous both per capita and in absolute terms than many surrounding areas. The "suburbanite fears," while perhaps excessive, are grounded in reality.
I like to go down to Broad Ripple after work to have a drink or local meal, but the shootings this weekend are making me question the safety of that. I like shopping at the Exchange, but again, why should I put myself in harm's way by going down there? There is nothing I absolutely need in the city. I'm not saying I won't go back, but it does make me put the brakes on. In fairness, I have never felt unsafe in BR, but I'm not leaving there at 2:30 AM either. I certainly wouldn't live there.
Unless I'm going into BR, I only rarely go below 82nd Street, unless I'm going to Westfield YMCA. It's not based on fear - it's just that there is nothing I need there. I'm sure a lot of suburbanites are not "in fear" of the city, but why put yourself at risk when there is no need to be there? Virtually all day to day stuff can be done in the suburbs.
The suburbs will lose their luster if the city itself goes too far down. Detroit has good suburbs, but that's not what people think of when they hear Detroit. Indy is on its way to being thought of just for its crime.
This really doesn't prove anything of value. I rarely go north of 96th Street for any reason other than to go to work. Why? Because I don't live near there or have a reason too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grmasterb
Suburban morons living in fear of all things below 96th Street and ridiculing the Indy crime wave are burying their heads in the sand. At the same time, urbanists who constantly point the finger at the suburbs, blaming whitey for moving, aren't part of the solution either.
Like most things, the intelligent conversation is not going to happen here on the city data.
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Originally Posted by Emigrations
I think you're exactly right. When I got the offer to move up here about five months ago, I wanted to live in an urban setting, but the more I read about the city, the more I didn't want to take that risk. Indy and my hometown are about neck and neck on crime, but why would I deliberately move from one high crime area to another? That's why I chose the suburbs, even though I'm fairly young, make decent money, and could afford the city. It's actually cheaper for me to live where I do in Carmel than to find an equivalent, safe place in the city. Living in a "safe" area of the city is just as expensive, as a renter, as the suburbs. I've yet to see one LEO needed at my admittedly modest apartment in five months here in Carmel.
Memphis is another case in point where its history gets overshadowed by crime. Memphis has a terrific history of BBQ, blues, and rock and roll, but that often gets forgotten about by people who aren't from TN. Some direct TV salesman asked where I was from yesterday at Costco and immediately went off on the crime in Memphis. He wasn't from TN, yet the reputation of Memphis was the first thing on his mind. Sadly, Indy doesn't have the culture/history of Memphis/Detroit (IMO), so the crime is going to be even quicker to come to mind.
I don't think I have ever heard anyone talk about Memphis without first going to Beale Street, blues, or BBQ. In my travels, the people who pop off about crime, are the people I just don't enjoy.
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Originally Posted by Emigrations
I'd bet my bottom dollar the suburbanites are better educated and often holding a higher proportion of the better jobs in the city, on average, than city residents. The suburbanites aren't "taking your jobs" - they are filling many jobs that would probably otherwise go unfilled. If I had no choice but to live in the city of Indianapolis when I received the offer, I would have just declined it.
The suburbs absolutely do need to be worried about the core city being viable. Like I said previously, if Indy is not thought of as a viable option, Fishers/Carmel/Zionsville are going to be left in the dark. Look at what's happened to Detroit.
We absolutely do contribute sales tax revenue to the city. If any state level taxes are distributed to benefit the City of Indy, then all Hoosiers end up subsidizing Indy.
Agreed. There are safe areas below 96th, but most people just don't have a pressing need to go there. I go below 96th and am never in fear, but there is nothing there I need.
Sadly, all this crime brings up uncomfortable thoughts and discussions about race.
We can go round and round and round and round on the same rehashed drivel about suburbs vs city. Its all been done before, and nothing intelligent ever comes of it. Are suburbanites better educated? Some are. Are all people in the city poor high school drop outs? No.
But............perceptions are what fuel conversation on city data. Not reality.
Indianapolis as a region works better when there is a strong center, and counties working together to better the area. That isn't happening right now. We are all too busy arguing about whose life choices are better and fretting about things we see on the news that have no impact on us.
This really doesn't prove anything of value. I rarely go north of 96th Street for any reason other than to go to work. Why? Because I don't live near there or have a reason too.
We can go round and round and round and round on the same rehashed drivel about suburbs vs city. Its all been done before, and nothing intelligent ever comes of it. Are suburbanites better educated? Some are. Are all people in the city poor high school drop outs? No.
But............perceptions are what fuel conversation on city data. Not reality.
Indianapolis as a region works better when there is a strong center, and counties working together to better the area. That isn't happening right now. We are all too busy arguing about whose life choices are better and fretting about things we see on the news that have no impact on us.
The fact that a lot of suburbanites feel unsafe going below 96th does prove a valuable point - the city is viewed as unsafe, right or wrong, and it's impacting whether people choose to go there or not. The crime issues caused me to not live in the city. Crime in the city is usually disproportionately in certain areas, and committed by certain people. The truth is that most of the city is fine, most of the time, but what's bad is so bad it's running off people.
In plain English, a lot of people are going to lump Indy in with high black, high crime, declining Rust Belt cities like Cleveland, Detroit, and St. Louis. That might not be accurate, but that was my idea coming in, and the crime and demographics associated with the crime have largely confirmed that perception.
I went on a competing site to CD and you can tell where core neighborhoods are just by the crime rates. Downtown itself is safe, but it's surrounding by "light white" neighborhoods, designating high crime. Areas on the city periphery are generally much safer.
Though Indy has its high points, I can't see it competing with Raleigh, Seattle, Austin, Nashville, or most other hot cities, largely due to the crime. Nashville has high crime, but it is not the first thing you think of when you think of the city. In Indy, crime is what is known.
Let's see - probably the dullest topographical setting on the planet, state government seemingly stuck in Reefer Madness of 1930s, miles upon miles of cornfields turned into cookie cutter subdivisions, strip malls full of fast food chains and Walmarts at nearly every intersection, little night life, awful public transportation system, little diversity, little culture, almost no walkable neighborhoods, singles scene where almost everyone over 25 is married.
But, hey, look on the bright side - you're way more likely to get mugged or shot here than Boston, NYC or LA
I'm sure some won't appreciate this and I completely understand. When I lived here, I couldn't stand people that could turn any topic of conversation to how much they hate Indy. I try to be positive and remember good things about my former city - cost of living, decent downtown, etc... but news like these can be really discouraging at times.
Indianapolis has more people living in poverty than Fishers has as a total population. Maybe that has something to do with the crime problem?
It also doesn't help that ignorant people decided a long time ago that Fishers and the rest of the suburbs had to exist because they couldn't bare to live next to blacks moving into Indianapolis.
What does diversity have to do with being violent and committing crimes? No one race has a predisposition to commit crimes, so there is no justification for why crime in any area should be as bad as it is getting. This isn't just for Indy, but for many metro areas. Also, if poor people are committing crime it is because they are greedy. We are a country that provides healthcare, food, shelter, education, etc. to poor individuals. I'm sick of that being used as an excuse. Back in the day, prior to many of these safety nets, my grandfather and his three siblings had to be taken and placed in the Knightstown home because his mom and dad were so poor, they couldn't afford to feed the kids. Thankfully one of them found a job and the kids were returned within a very short time frame. They still were never rich, but none of them found it necessary to go on shooting rampages, steal, shoot heroin, etc.. All four went on to be successful in life, some better than others. Our government and big business has painted this idea that the American lifestyle should be about accumulating wealth and things and that one can only be successful if they accumulate at lot of wealth. At the same time, the same entities want people out and about, spending money in our retail/service based banana republic of an economy. I mean look, you see see the poverty issue, but how can we have poverty when the gov and some business leaders say everything is great. The DOW is hitting record levels! The realty is that the US is no longer a first world nation. We have slipped to second world status, and we are only still standing because every other country in this world pretty much as the same economy formula: Print, print, and print some more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wh15395
Well once again, enjoy using up our resources and taking our jobs so that you can contribute your tax dollars to a suburb whose main purpose is allowing people to have big city amenities without big-city diversity or big-city problems.
Yes. How dare someone use their brain and take steps to reduce the probability of being victims of a home invasion robbery and rape, like what happened up on the north side not so long ago. What a sad world it would be if people were forced to live next to known violent criminals just so people of a certain political beliefs could have their desires for diversity satisfied. Of course those who make enough money of such a political class would be able to lives in much safer areas, with armed guards, etc.. And I can't believe parents would want to live somewhere where the taxes and fees might be a bit lower than an area with costly big-city problems. I mean how dare such parents think about taking that money not paid in taxes/fees and saving for their kids college.
Yeah people are so terrified of the city that downtown apartment development is at an all time high. There is more demand today for urban living in Indy than there has been in 50 plus years.
But thanks for the small town Tennessee transplant that's been here three months for educating us all. Very beneficial to have your knowledge of what's going on here. SMH.
The fact that a lot of suburbanites feel unsafe going below 96th does prove a valuable point - the city is viewed as unsafe, right or wrong, and it's impacting whether people choose to go there or not. The crime issues caused me to not live in the city. Crime in the city is usually disproportionately in certain areas, and committed by certain people. The truth is that most of the city is fine, most of the time, but what's bad is so bad it's running off people.
Though Indy has its high points, I can't see it competing with Raleigh, Seattle, Austin, Nashville, or most other hot cities, largely due to the crime. Nashville has high crime, but it is not the first thing you think of when you think of the city. In Indy, crime is what is known.
You've been here three months..........and now you are some kind of expert? Never mind the fact that downtown is on fire and property values on the near east side have increased 20% or more in the last couple of years. But yes, anecdotes from frightened suburbanites who are scared to go south of 96th Street carry more value than real life. Seriously? This is what the city data is now?
I would love to live downtown. I've always dreamed of living in the city and walking to places I need to go. But my job is in Carmel. I could reverse commute but that would keep me away from my kids more than I already am. I also chose Fishers because my parents, mother-in-law/babysitter, sister/brother-in-law/nieces/nephew, all live in Fishers. The idea of being close to them and close to my job swayed me to be in Fishers. Before I had kids, I was in Indianapolis all the time. Downtown doing stuff, at the IMA, Beef & Boards, whatever. I am rarely south of 96th Street now not because of fear but I just simply don't have time or money to do all the stuff we used to do. We may move in the next year or two and I've found some nice houses on the northeast side in the 62nd Street/71st Street areas, close to my daughter's daycare. We can get much more house for the money than in Fishers and a heck of a lot more than in Carmel. But my wife doesn't trust Lawrence Township schools and I've yet to convince her on private or charter schools. We will see what happens.
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