Moving to Saint Augustine/Saint Johns....Maybe. Help (St. Augustine, St. Augustine Beach: sale, for rent)

[Zaba]

Originally Posted by EricBoyd

LOL! Not sure if this is even worth responding to. Haha!

That's because there is no 'response' that negates it.
It's completely true.

In the information age, realtors are just as obsolete as newspapers.
The fact that old habits die hard and people still read newspapers, use realtors, doesn't change the fact that their services aren't needed for anyone but the dumbest possible buyers.

It's also a profession that will take any hobo off the street, put them through a 40 hour 'course' and imply that they're credentialed to assist you with making huge decisions that they happen to make a commission on when the reality is, two weeks earlier, they were screwing up your order at Taco Bell.

Lawyers and used car salesmen provide superior service to society than realtors.

[Robyn55]

WRT realtors - the simple fact of the matter is that - at least in this geographical area - most people in the price range I'm most familiar with list their houses through realtors. No FSBOs.* So the sales commission *is* going to be paid. And - although the buyer can "house hunt"/research on his/her own - it's not going to save the buyer a dime.

It's kind of like saying we're now in the technology age when it comes to airlines. Which has pretty much resulted in our becoming our own personal travel agents. We have to find the tickets - buy the tickets - print the boarding passes - check ourselves in - while not saving a dime either .

But back to realtors. A good one can absolutely make a buyer's life easier by filtering all the results a potential buyer might find on line/narrowing things down. In terms of the buyer's preferences for everything ranging from prices to schools. Also - you need a realtor most of the time to get into gated communities - and to unlock "lock boxes" for you. Sure - a prospective buyer can spend a few days setting up appointments with sellers' realtors or FSBO sellers on his/her own. But - again - it usually won't save the buyer a dime.

FWIW - I don't recommend buying on the basis of short scouting trips unless a move is mandatory for something like a job. I recommend renting and poking around before deciding whether to stay and where to buy. But people in this thread are talking about short "scouting trips". And I think realtors are especially useful for those. Robyn

*Even when I see an occasional FSBO - there are usually words to the effect that the seller will pay half the normal commission to a realtor who procures a sale. Which makes sense for a seller who doesn't have access to the "advertising" available on the MLS.

[EricBoyd]

Originally Posted by Zaba

Lawyers and used car salesmen provide superior service to society than realtors.

Oh, that argument. You're right. I forgot all about that one...

[SaintCabbage]

He has a point in that it is the information age, but that is likely an extraneous tool of many when working with a realtor. It helps you and the realtor as you can hunt down homes that strike you and gives the realtor a better idea of what you are looking for and can expedite scheduling showings for you. You still need them to guide most people through the process and do all the behind the scenes legwork for you, that's what they get paid to do. I find that often homes are being sold/showen before they officially are posted for sale as all these realtors are working with each other outside the official process.

[EricBoyd]

Originally Posted by SaintCabbage

... You still need them to guide most people through the process and do all the behind the scenes legwork for you, that's what they get paid to do...

This is the main part where many buyers/sellers would get lost, if it weren't for an experienced agent (and their network of other professionals involved in the purchasing process).

OP, I would also like to correct you on the required hours for licensure. It's 63 hours for pre-license education and 45 hours for post-license education. There is also a broker who's overseeing that agent, who has an additional 72 hours of pre-license education and 60 hours of post-license education, and years of experience on top of that. If a home buyer or seller wants to go it alone, that's certainly their prerogative. But, for such a big life decision that they are making once maybe every 5-7 years, why would they want to risk trying to learn about the entire home buying/selling process and possibly miss some key details, which would cost thousands? So, yeah, go ahead and sit anonymously behind a keyboard and fling boogers at us. You're not the customer we're seeking.

[Robyn55]

I don't think a realtor is the best person to handle all the steps involved in buying/selling real estate. A realtor isn't a substitute for a lawyer.

Also - I wouldn't necessarily rely on a seller or a seller's agent to be totally forthcoming about a property. I've seen too many cases where sellers didn't disclose known issues with a property (like termites or leaks) to buyers. This doesn't happen all the time - but it does happen more often than it should (since Florida law requires these things to be disclosed).

Of course - you're not going to find information like this on realtor.com either. Wouldn't it be nice if we had a database on houses like the one for cars? Robyn

[SaintCabbage]

Originally Posted by Robyn55

I don't think a realtor is the best person to handle all the steps involved in buying/selling real estate. A realtor isn't a substitute for a lawyer.

Also - I wouldn't necessarily rely on a seller or a seller's agent to be totally forthcoming about a property. I've seen too many cases where sellers didn't disclose known issues with a property (like termites or leaks) to buyers. This doesn't happen all the time - but it does happen more often than it should (since Florida law requires these things to be disclosed).

Of course - you're not going to find information like this on realtor.com either. Wouldn't it be nice if we had a database on houses like the one for cars? Robyn

Bah, that's just the grumpy old lady in you talkin'! You dont need a realtor and a lawyer unless you are getting into something really suspect I guess. I didnt use a realtor at all when we bought, so it's ironic for me to be defending them, but I'm a damn genius so...

[EricBoyd]

Originally Posted by Robyn55

I don't think a realtor is the best person to handle all the steps involved in buying/selling real estate. A realtor isn't a substitute for a lawyer.

Who said they are supposed to be? I didn't.

[Robyn55]

Originally Posted by SaintCabbage

Bah, that's just the grumpy old lady in you talkin'! You dont need a realtor and a lawyer unless you are getting into something really suspect I guess. I didnt use a realtor at all when we bought, so it's ironic for me to be defending them, but I'm a damn genius so...

I may be a grumpy old lady but I'm a Florida lawyer too . People buy stuff all the time and find out about liens/other clouds on their title/property after the fact. Things that were noted in their title insurance policies - but which the title insurance agent - who might be the seller's realtor in another corporate capacity - never mentioned to them. Listen - Florida is a title insurance state. Someone is going to get the title insurance commission. Would you rather that the person getting the commission on the title insurance be the seller's realtor - or *your* lawyer (a lot of lawyers here will do a closing for something like 500 bucks plus the title insurance commission).*

And are you telling me that you bought a 100% FSBO (no realtor for seller or buyer)? Very unusual here. FWIW - even developers here in new places use realtors (often in house realtors). Robyn

*There are some potential conflicts of interest between a lawyer who's a title agent both for the title insurance company and you - but fewer than there are between a seller's realtor who's acting as a title agent and you. And any decent lawyer will explain the conflicts of interest to you. Since I'm a lawyer - I know how to read the disclosures - the title policies too. Perhaps people who lack this expertise should get themselves a real lawyer without any possible conflicts. There was a piece in the paper recently about a new planned road somewhere in some community on the 210 corridor. People who thought they were buying property with a nature preserve in their back yards are now looking at a possible road/highway in their back yards. You gotta read all the fine print (and - if you can't do it yourself - you have to hire someone to do it for you).

[Zaba]

Originally Posted by EricBoyd

OP, I would also like to correct you on the required hours for licensure. It's 63 hours for pre-license education and 45 hours for post-license education. There is also a broker who's overseeing that agent, who has an additional 72 hours of pre-license education and 60 hours of post-license education

About par with what one receives at McDonalds Hamburger University, but considerably less thorough than the training offered by any given Clown College.

Pretty sure there's no profession where the perceived weight of the credential-to-actual professional ability ratio is any more off kilter than in 'realtors'. Seriously. Standing bet. Lets go down to any given park where the homeless congregate, pick the drunkest one there and I bet he can pass every requirement involved with being a Realtor in Florida.

I can maybe kinda-sorta see very inexperienced buyers using Realtor services for their first buy but after that, if you can't manage the process of a real property transaction on your own, then its just Economic Darwinism in action.