Avondale/San Marco vs. Mandarin (Jacksonville, Tampa: houses, neighborhoods, to buy)

[jax4me?]

Hi all! I've read many of the posts about places to live in Jacksonville and learned so much. I think I have a few more questions based on the information I've read.

We (me, husband, and 1 year old son) are contemplating a move from Tampa to Jacksonville. For any familiar with Tampa, we live in South Tampa and really love it. We love the historic houses, being close to downtown (we'll both work downtown) and restaurants, and not being so crowded as the suburbs (at least here). We're also in a neighborhood with a lot of young-ish couples with small children.

I've done a lot of research and it seems that the Avondale/San Marco areas sound similar to where we live now. The main thing that seems different, and this is a big one for us, is that it seems the school districts in these areas are not very good. With that, we turned to Mandarin and found great schools and beautiful homes with so much land at great prices. But, I was wondering if Mandarin is very cookie cutter and crowded as so many suburbs seem to be.

Any information about these areas and how they compare to each other would be so helpful. The main things we're looking for (in no order) are great schools, a decent-sized fenced yard (2 dogs), close-ish to downtown, close to restaurants, nightlife, etc., safe and child friendly, and not super crowded. Thanks!

[kort677]

Originally Posted by jax4me?

Hi all! I've read many of the posts about places to live in Jacksonville and learned so much. I think I have a few more questions based on the information I've read.

We (me, husband, and 1 year old son) are contemplating a move from Tampa to Jacksonville. For any familiar with Tampa, we live in South Tampa and really love it. We love the historic houses, being close to downtown (we'll both work downtown) and restaurants, and not being so crowded as the suburbs (at least here). We're also in a neighborhood with a lot of young-ish couples with small children.

I've done a lot of research and it seems that the Avondale/San Marco areas sound similar to where we live now. The main thing that seems different, and this is a big one for us, is that it seems the school districts in these areas are not very good. With that, we turned to Mandarin and found great schools and beautiful homes with so much land at great prices. But, I was wondering if Mandarin is very cookie cutter and crowded as so many suburbs seem to be.

Any information about these areas and how they compare to each other would be so helpful. The main things we're looking for (in no order) are great schools, a decent-sized fenced yard (2 dogs), close-ish to downtown, close to restaurants, nightlife, etc., safe and child friendly, and not super crowded. Thanks!

since both places are in the same school district the schools shouldn't be all that different, especially as your kids progress through the grades, consider private schooling and moving to the san marco area, be aware that prices for a house can be steeper there than mandarin, but mandarin is slightly more suburban and san marco sounds more like what you are accustomed to

[Lawstudent]

Mandarin is a nice compromise. Not way out Suburbia. Still within a 20-30 minute ride of Downtown. Congested? I would say yes. The main N-S thouroughfare through Mandarin is San Jose blve which is 4 lanes each side and sometimes it can get very congested. We are also a young (ish) couple without children and really like San Marco. It is a little enclave in the midst of the city. Or as a friend of mine called it, "An island of hope in a sea of despair." I would say that given your love of the urban area San Marco would suit you well. But as Kort has said it is much more money for less sq/ft. Good Luck

[riveree]

If you want a true historic home or historic neighborhood, there are only 3, Avondale, Riverside & Springfield:

Avondale & Riverside:
http://riverside-avondale.com//

Springfield:
http://sparcouncil.org/Mambo/component/option,com_frontpage/Itemid,1/ (broken link)


San Marco, while not a historically designated neighborhood, is just as charming:
http://www.sanmarcopreservationsociety.com/index.htm

Considering the 3 choices you mentioned, Avondale, San Marco or Mandarin, I think one of the first considerations is which side of the river do you want to live on? Avondale is on the Westside, San Marco and Mandarin on the Southside.

Avondale and San Marco may look close on a map, but they have all of downtown between them, so there's a disconnect of sorts. If you live in Avondale, you're likely to do all of your basic shopping on the Westside (personally, this rules out Avondale for me). Also keep in mind, Avondale's core is very small - it's just a tiny strip with a few restaurants and shops. San Marco Square, in comparison, is significantly larger, and about to grow even more with the addition of East San Marco:
http://www.eastsanmarco.com/

Whether you go with Avondale or San Marco, expect the yards to be small, that's just how they sliced them up back then. You might luck out and find a bigger lot, but there's usually quite a premium on the bigger lots in these parts of town. So if your dogs are big, that might pose an issue for you.

Mandarin is nice, and you could be happy there. You're likely to end up with a larger home and a larger lot in Mandarin. But if it's urban life you want, that's not Mandarin. Mandarin is the epitome of the burbs.

Have you considered the areas in between San Marco and Mandarin? There is a large expanse between the two. There's Lakewood, Dupont, San Jose, Beauclerc - these are all very nice and the ones closer to downtown still have a bit of that urban feel (bigger lots too).

Of course, budget can often be a deciding factor and you haven't mentioned yet what your budget is .

[dizliz0925]

We live in Riverside and Riverside/Avondale is very similar to South Tampa. My wife and I grew up in Mandarin and our families live there, but we wouldn't live anywhere else in Jacksonville. Great community feel, great shops, restaurants. Parks EVERYWHERE! easy access to the river (more so than in San Marco). We would be sending our kids to private school anywhere we live in Jax, because public school really doesn't meet our standards (and are we in no way rich. Private school is a sacrifice we are willing to make for our kids (i.e. no new cars for us).

I say we would send them to private school because we are leaving Jax for Richmond VA. My wife and I have always wanted to be in that area (change of seasons, closer to the mountains). If Jacksonville had a true fall and maybe one or two snows a year, i think it would be perfect, and we wouldn't leave at all.

If you have any more questions (or want to buy a house ) let me know!

[Floridian]

I live in Mandarin area.. and yes, there is traffic esp. on school/work days. However, I never face them since my work schedule begins at 7:30 am. I drop my daughter to Mandarin high school (the only A high school in DUVAL county) and straight to work (downtown). I take the greenland rd, then old st. augustine rd, then san jose rd all the way to downtown (20 min).

Several new communities have opened in our neighborhood along Greenland Rd. They start at 300K > with others having bigger lot. There are 2 A schools -Greenland pines Elem. and Mandarin High school in this street so avoid them during rush hour (7 am - 9 am).

[mocando]

Riverside is a great option. I have my daughter at Central Riverside Elementary and am very happy and I am a product of the private school system. Central Riverside is a feeder school that will eventually lead your children to Stanton Prep, currently the number 3 public high school in America.

I have a historic home with a nice sized yard. It is on a lot and a half. There are others in the area that are similar sized lots. There are plenty of sidewalks and more than enough great parks for your kids and your dogs.

I grew up in Mandarin and got tired of the congestion. Yes, the shopping is better out there but if you work downtown, like me, the trade off is a no-brainer.

Good luck!

[Magnolia Bloom]

I live in Mandarin and, from what you are looking for, I would suggest San Marco. Check the school districts of the addresses that you are looking at, as Hendricks Elementary has en excellent reputation, I know several families that are very happy with it.

Mandarin is suburban, it's clean, good for kids. I chose it for extended family reasons, but I would be in San Marco in a heartbeat if it was an option.

Avondale, although nice, IMO, has some rougher areas around it, whereas, other than the eastern fringes of San Marco, it tends to stay nice going south and you would be bordered by the river to the north and west.

Nothing wrong with Mandarin at all, and it's just 12 miles straight down San Jose Blvd. to the downtown, all neighborhoods aren't cookie cutter, especially west mandarin around San Jose. But the charm that you like will be found in San Marco.

[maryarm21]

Hey there,

Just saw your post...we moved to avondale a year ago from Alexandria, VA. We lived in the historic area and really enjoy that lifestyle - as it seems you do. We have a nine month old and avondale is packed with young families. I really like that, strollers everywhere, moms clubs, etc. I will say, I have also heard that the schools are not that good in avondale. I think a lot of people use private schools...not sure how expensive they are...maybe less than in other places if they have a lot of them??? We are Army and will be gone before William is school age (and will probably home school anyway).

My husband works downtown and his commute is ten minutes tops. He comes home often for lunch. We are pretty close to the avondale shops and river and walk over there all the time. Also, just walking around the neighborhood is fun because the architecture is pleasing.

Oh, fenced yards abound. We have a large dog, as do our next door neighbors. The yard sizes do vary though, and probably are not as large as in Mandarin.

Mandarin IS beautiful, and I don't think it's a cookie-cutter as some of the newer subdivisions...Oakleaf, Fleming Island, etc. However, it is TERRIBLY crowded and the commute is horrendous. It's pretty far from downtown, definitely like a different city. We have friends in Fruit Cove and every time we go down there (not often) we just shake our heads. We couldn't do that drive every day. And the times I've had to go down there on weekends...the weekend traffic is just as bad.

Hope that helps! Just thought you'd want an opinion from someone who had to make the same decision.
Mary

[mocando]

I'd like to followup on what HIF said. I would have to disagree about Avondale having the rougher areas surrounding. While all of the inner city neighborhoods have a rougher edge to them with Springfield leading the way, I lived in St. Nicholas for 16 years before moving to Riverside and saw many more police choppers while living there than I do now in Riverside. Granted, I lived on the "wrong" side of Atlantic Blvd but the neighborhood just to the east of San Marco for the entire run is very rough. The corridor between Phillips Hwy and St. Augistine is particularly rough, but do not forget the neighborhood that is part of San Marcoi that includes Bistro Aix. It is as bad if not worse than anything you would find in Riverside and almost as bad as the sketchier places in Springfield. I know because I owned a design agency down there for almost 10 years.

If San Marco is your choice, as long as you stay south of the square (and west of Hendricks, if possible) the neighborhood is amazing.