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We visited one of the Dream Finders communities about a month and a half ago now and fell in love with the Avalon model. There was one particular lot at that community that my husband really liked. We did not want to make a decision on actually moving forward with building until mid-November and the salesperson said that was OK if we were willing to put a non-refundable $500 down to save that lot until then. He said if we decided to build at that time, we'd then put the $10K down and move forward. We spent many, many hours working out the architectural details, even though we felt that was a bit premature, but supposedly we had to do that at that point. Didn't feel comfortable that so many of the details were "Design Center details" (cabinets, counters, flooring, bathroom components, lighting, doors, etc.) for which we had no pricing, but that's the way they do it.
We were all set to put down our $500, but then we got the contract. Showed $500 down now, the serious down payment in mid-November, and the cost of the home with the architectural upgrades. There's wording in it that says that if any of the payments are not made that we're in default. That doesn't sound to me like we actually have a graceful out prior to the down payment as was indicated, but I'm no lawyer, and of course we were going to have our lawyer look at the contract prior to signing it anyhow. Well, two lawyers at the firm looked at it and both said, "Do not sign this contract." They confirmed that there was no out if we signed. Not only was the $500 non-refundable (which was OK with us), we were on the hook for the $10K down payment AND we were contracted to build the house. There were a number of other items in there that the lawyers said were not at all in our best interest. I would suggest that if you want to build with them (or heck, with anyone!) that you have your lawyer check the contract before you sign and make sure you're OK with all the conditions therein. You may find it all acceptable, but we and our lawyers didn't.
The Design Center stuff was also a bit of an issue for us. Don't know if it would have been a show stopper when we got to the point of the large down payment and moving forward or not. Seemed a bit odd at first and gnawed at us more and more as we thought about it. If your budget's not too tight, you may also be OK with contracting for a house that costs $xxx,xxx for the base house without knowing how much it will REALLY cost once you pick your flooring, cabinets, counters, doors, bathroom components, lighting, etc., but this made us uncomfortable. We would have been able to cover whatever we picked from the financial standpoint, but we didn't appreciate that we would have to make those decisions quickly, without the ability to carefully ponder our choices (which we'd have to live with for many years) and weigh them against the pricing in advance. We don't want to pay far more than we would to have someone come in and do some of these things afterwards, but with no pricing in advance there's no way to compare. And even though we'd be able to afford all the upgrades that we want, we don't want to be underwater on the finished home when compared to what it's worth on the market... we saw how badly that went for a number of people some years back. Between us, we've purchased many homes over the years, but have never had one built. Maybe this is the way all the builders do it?
The Design Center stuff was also a bit of an issue for us. Don't know if it would have been a show stopper when we got to the point of the large down payment and moving forward or not. Seemed a bit odd at first and gnawed at us more and more as we thought about it. If your budget's not too tight, you may also be OK with contracting for a house that costs $xxx,xxx for the base house without knowing how much it will REALLY cost once you pick your flooring, cabinets, counters, doors, bathroom components, lighting, etc., but this made us uncomfortable. We would have been able to cover whatever we picked from the financial standpoint, but we didn't appreciate that we would have to make those decisions quickly, without the ability to carefully ponder our choices (which we'd have to live with for many years) and weigh them against the pricing in advance. We don't want to pay far more than we would to have someone come in and do some of these things afterwards, but with no pricing in advance there's no way to compare. And even though we'd be able to afford all the upgrades that we want, we don't want to be underwater on the finished home when compared to what it's worth on the market... we saw how badly that went for a number of people some years back. Between us, we've purchased many homes over the years, but have never had one built. Maybe this is the way all the builders do it?
Your experience surprises me a bit. When we were thinking about building with Dream Finders we were able to get pricing out of them for design center stuff without signing a contract. I will say that their sales people can be hit or miss. Some are awesome and will get you anything you need (Like the girls at Amelia Concourse) and some are more like sharks(generally the more high end developments). Of course if you are looking to put a significant amount of upgrades beyond their standard, I am sure it would be difficult for them to get the pricing. We were able to get images of the first few levels of cabinets, tile, etc from them as well as costs for installing extra lights, patio screening, structural changes, fencing, etc.
As to the contracts, they are ALL in the builders favor and its a risk you take. Most do care about their reputation though, so you can strong arm them if things break down. We were able to get 50% of a non-refundable deposit with a builder for example after things went south. We ate $2500 on that one, while not great, my $1000 less a month mortgage on the house I built softened the blow.
We had the same experience with Riverside. After taking a $5k deposit to work up "structural" changes to their design such as wider door ways, they informed us that we would have to put down 10% ($40k) to meet with their designer to discuss upgrades and subsequently determine the final pricing. In the mean time they wanted me to get a commitment from our lender for the structural price then go back to them after we decided on any upgrades. When I could not get them to tell me the standard selections that were included in the base price I decided it was easier to walk away from $5k than learn what our final pricing would be several months down the road. After they denied my formal request to meet with their designer, (they said it would confuse people) the front office made a point of stating I had to make a decision and that my deposit was at risk. I told them I would not be proceeding and sent them a list of reasons why I was requesting my deposit back. Boy did my email and phone blow up. They were then willing to do anything to change my mind. I was done. I bought a slightly used, much better constructed home in San Savino that came standard with many features Riverside had outrageously priced. It was my second foray into buying new construction. I would buy used or go with a custom builder before I would deal with that type of situation again. Riverside did refund my deposit in the end.
We had the same experience with Riverside. After taking a $5k deposit to work up "structural" changes to their design such as wider door ways, they informed us that we would have to put down 10% ($40k) to meet with their designer to discuss upgrades and subsequently determine the final pricing. In the mean time they wanted me to get a commitment from our lender for the structural price then go back to them after we decided on any upgrades. When I could not get them to tell me the standard selections that were included in the base price I decided it was easier to walk away from $5k than learn what our final pricing would be several months down the road. After they denied my formal request to meet with their designer, (they said it would confuse people) the front office made a point of stating I had to make a decision and that my deposit was at risk. I told them I would not be proceeding and sent them a list of reasons why I was requesting my deposit back. Boy did my email and phone blow up. They were then willing to do anything to change my mind. I was done. I bought a slightly used, much better constructed home in San Savino that came standard with many features Riverside had outrageously priced. It was my second foray into buying new construction. I would buy used or go with a custom builder before I would deal with that type of situation again. Riverside did refund my deposit in the end.
It should be noted, Riverside does have a custom division, and a production division. However, rather than use different subs for each category as in the past, they now have the production subs doing the custom homes as well to save money. It's a sad thing to see the decline in quality among some of these builders that in the past were actually very high quality oriented. My list of 2021 Best Builders is going to be very short in January I'm afraid.
I'm in the process of building in Silver Leaf out in Saint Johns. I already had my Design Center appointment, but the paperwork isn't final yet as the designer is still auditing to make sure nothing got missed (and stuff definitely got missed). But one odd thing is this: In trying to estimate what I was going to need to spend in this phase, a sales agent gave me the contract addendum on another home, dated just a few weeks ago. And in the flooring upgrades for the downstairs, the square footage used seems to be slightly more than the actual square footage of the downstairs. But on my estimate from Design, the square footage is 20% over that figure. I asked my designer and she wrote that it had to do with extra costs associated with waste. But this doesn't seem right to me, given that both my unit and the other were both doing a similar upgrade (though I am going to a higher level laminate) for the entire downstairs. Any suggestions for my next move? I have also reached out to my buyer's agent, but I'm open to suggestions.
Sorry to bump an old thread....when you go to design appointment, do they give you the price specific to your floorplan for upgrades? Or just give you a $/sqft amount and you have to know what square footage you’re covering??
And does anyone have a recent estimate for level 1 LVP floors and level 1 quartz countertop upgrades and level 2 cabinets/white cabinets? Just trying to shop around before my appointment.
Thanks!
They don’t give you any kind of $ at the preview session. Your sales agent may be able to give you a contract from a recent spec home or something that might give you an idea.
For Floors it matters what you’re upgrading *from.*
I don’t how much depends on your designer, and your time frame, etc., but I went to design several weeks ago and still don’t have a signed addendum. My designer has been slow getting stuff back to me, and I have had the opportunity to make changes to get under my budget. You have to make sure you know what your fall back plan is, though — there’s a charge for going back in. But I took photos of several flooring options I liked at different price points.
As an update to my post, I went back to the model and measured and politely but firmly insisted they’d made a mistake, and they did fix the square footage.
They don’t give you any kind of $ at the preview session. Your sales agent may be able to give you a contract from a recent spec home or something that might give you an idea.
For Floors it matters what you’re upgrading *from.*
I don’t how much depends on your designer, and your time frame, etc., but I went to design several weeks ago and still don’t have a signed addendum. My designer has been slow getting stuff back to me, and I have had the opportunity to make changes to get under my budget. You have to make sure you know what your fall back plan is, though — there’s a charge for going back in. But I took photos of several flooring options I liked at different price points.
As an update to my post, I went back to the model and measured and politely but firmly insisted they’d made a mistake, and they did fix the square footage.
Ours is July 21st and they just sent an email cutting back our time from 4 hours to 3. Is that enough time?
FYI, I completed the design center appointment and an additional meeting with Tison who installs the electrical audio visual work.
If anyone has questions I am happy to answer them but it was so much information and so many choices that I do not know how to adequately summarize it right now. Overall, it was a good experience for us but I'll admit you really have to take a leap of faith to build like this. Moreover, I literally took all day and was lucky to get that time. I have no idea how it could have been finished in 3 hours or less. I also had time this last week to shop, compare and make changes.
The numbers were in line with what I imagined because I understood that everything would be at a premium working through the builder. The question really comes down to how much you want to complete as a convenience and what you would like to complete afterwards yourself.
Additionally, I was happy with many of our options but felt limited with the selection on some items. Even if you have an unlimited budget there are certain things you cannot choose and some items would be ridiculous to select.
I will have a better grasp on how successful the process is once the build is complete.
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