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While Springfield has a lot of really cool turn-of-the-century architecture, and might make a comeback, if I were a single female, no, I would not live there alone. There are a lot of drug addicts, derelicts, and desperate people roaming about in Springfield and the surrounding areas. The Northside of Jax is still pretty sketchy; this is where most of the violent crime occurs, including murder (and Jax is famous as the murder capital of FL). If you want something similar in terms of architecture but safe, convenient, and walkable, why not Riverside, Avondale, or San Marco?
Google "transitional/gentrifying neighborhood" and see that they are very normal and common in cities most everywhere.
To date, Jacksonville has had one example (Riverside, which used to be similar to the Springfield historic district) that started as relatively undesirbale due to urban decline, and is now very desirbale.This is standard in most big cities. If you knew what you were talking about, you'd know that Springfield and Murray Hill are established as the next examples of this gentrification/transitional process in Jacksonville. Hence, Riveside, Springfield, and Murray Hill are more popular now than anytime in thge last 50 years. Just look at the projected home value increases in North Florida by 2018 - the #2 zip code in Jax (and the 20th in the region) projected for home value growth is 32206, mainly based on the continued revitalization of the neighborhood.
If you want something similar in terms of architecture but safe, convenient, and walkable, why not Riverside, Avondale, or San Marco?
Riverside & Avondale historic dsitrict and San Marco are fantastic urban core neighborhoods. They are what the Springfield historic district (and Murray Hill to a lesser extent) are in the process of developing into. They work together and collaborate on a number of issues. They are not competitors, but compliment eachother. Where else can you be within a bicycle ride of 3 unique, fun neighborhoods than the urban core of Jacksonville? (plus Downtown amentities to boot).
To correct you, however: Riverside & Springfield have roughly the same crime rate, while Avondale and San Marco is significantly less. Of course, none of them are alarming, or no one would choose to live there. Convenient is subjective. Walkability is as well, but Walkscore, generally seen as great indactor of walkability (rank with population):
1. 73 Downtown Jacksonville - 6,373
2. 68 Springfield - 4,819
3. 68 San Marco - 2,698
4. 67 Riverside - 9,387
5. 67 Fairfax - 1,684
6. 63 Avondale - 5,543
7. 60 Hogans Creek - 3,242
8. 59 Murray Hill - 9,190
9. 57 Normandy - 587
10. 55 New Town - 1,832
And to answer you question, many are choosing to live in Murray Hill & Springfield historic dsitrict because they are being priced out of Riverside & Avondale historic dsitrict and San Marco. Just as Riversiders were originally priced out of Avondale. That's how gentrification works.
Or, because they want more bang for their buck. Or, because they want the highest upside on there investment. Murray Hill and Springfield historic district have much more room for value increase than the other more established neighborhoods.
How unsafe is Springfield, really? Would you live there alone as a female?
the smaller your street number the safer you are in my opinion. Id stay anywhere between Union & 8th Street, once you get to 9th, 10th 11th & 12 those areas may be iffy. Springfield ends after 13th street and I dont know what that neighborhood is called after that.
Hogans Creek on the south, which runs close to 1st Street. Railroad tracks to the East that run close to Ionia and Clark Streets. Railroads to the north that run close to 14th Street. And to the west Boulevard Street.
I think that is pretty close, it may vary a block or 2 one way or the other depending on the railroads.
I say to the south it starts at State Street and to the north 13th Street...not sure about these train tracks you speak of as official borders though.
Google "transitional/gentrifying neighborhood" and see that they are very normal and common in cities most everywhere.
To date, Jacksonville has had one example (Riverside, which used to be similar to the Springfield historic district) that started as relatively undesirbale due to urban decline, and is now very desirbale.This is standard in most big cities. If you knew what you were talking about, you'd know that Springfield and Murray Hill are established as the next examples of this gentrification/transitional process in Jacksonville. Hence, Riveside, Springfield, and Murray Hill are more popular now than anytime in thge last 50 years. Just look at the projected home value increases in North Florida by 2018 - the #2 zip code in Jax (and the 20th in the region) projected for home value growth is 32206, mainly based on the continued revitalization of the neighborhood.
If you want something similar in terms of architecture but safe, convenient, and walkable, why not Riverside, Avondale, or San Marco?
Riverside & Avondale historic dsitrict and San Marco are fantastic urban core neighborhoods. They are what the Springfield historic district (and Murray Hill to a lesser extent) are in the process of developing into. They work together and collaborate on a number of issues. They are not competitors, but compliment eachother. Where else can you be within a bicycle ride of 3 unique, fun neighborhoods than the urban core of Jacksonville? (plus Downtown amentities to boot).
To correct you, however: Riverside & Springfield have roughly the same crime rate, while Avondale and San Marco is significantly less. Of course, none of them are alarming, or no one would choose to live there. Convenient is subjective. Walkability is as well, but Walkscore, generally seen as great indactor of walkability (rank with population):
1. 73 Downtown Jacksonville - 6,373
2. 68 Springfield - 4,819
3. 68 San Marco - 2,698
4. 67 Riverside - 9,387
5. 67 Fairfax - 1,684
6. 63 Avondale - 5,543
7. 60 Hogans Creek - 3,242
8. 59 Murray Hill - 9,190
9. 57 Normandy - 587
10. 55 New Town - 1,832
And to answer you question, many are choosing to live in Murray Hill & Springfield historic dsitrict because they are being priced out of Riverside & Avondale historic dsitrict and San Marco. Just as Riversiders were originally priced out of Avondale. That's how gentrification works.
Or, because they want more bang for their buck. Or, because they want the highest upside on there investment. Murray Hill and Springfield historic district have much more room for value increase than the other more established neighborhoods.
I suppose Springfield has improved a lot since I've been there. That's great news. The neighborhood has a convenient location and some beautiful architecture, so I'm glad it's turning around.
I suppose Springfield has improved a lot since I've been there. That's great news. The neighborhood has a convenient location and some beautiful architecture, so I'm glad it's turning around.
the problem for any neighborhood like Springfield(and this isn't unique to jville, but anywhere) is that there is only so much room for improvement as long as there are better neighborhoods of a certain type/location within the city.
And looking at the data of recent home sales(even ones in move in condition requiring no restoration), the 'more for your money' argument in places like springfield(and again not picking springfield...never been there just generalizing) really isn't valid because a neighborhood like Avondale is already so affordable for the middle class. Middle and upper middle class professionals already have more than enough money and then some to buy in Avondale if they want; so amongst this group that really only leaves investment properties, and you're not going to make a neighborhood out of such a thing.
The hardworking people who would benefit from the 'value' of buying a livable home in Springfield are people of limited financial means in general....not that these are bad people(many are great neighbors I'm sure), but they aren't going to turn your neighborhood into something like the Hilltop neighborhood in Denver.
Will springfield get better, worse, or stay the same over the next decade or two? Who the heck knows. But what is a safe bet is that the livability of places like springfield will be related to what happens in the other older residential neighborhoods in the area. And the better old residential areas in the area will always be......better. If housing prices remain affordable as they are now in the better parts of Avondale, then there isn't need for middle class people in large numbers to buy in springfield. What's the point? But if housing prices skyrocket....and instead of being able to buy a perfectly livable and nice house in Avondale for 400k it costs 1million, then that's going to price some middle class people out of the market and they will have to look elsewhere....don't really see any indication that is going to happen though in a city like jville.
the problem for any neighborhood like Springfield(and this isn't unique to jville, but anywhere) is that there is only so much room for improvement as long as there are better neighborhoods of a certain type/location within the city.
And looking at the data of recent home sales(even ones in move in condition requiring no restoration), the 'more for your money' argument in places like springfield(and again not picking springfield...never been there just generalizing) really isn't valid because a neighborhood like Avondale is already so affordable for the middle class. Middle and upper middle class professionals already have more than enough money and then some to buy in Avondale if they want; so amongst this group that really only leaves investment properties, and you're not going to make a neighborhood out of such a thing.
The hardworking people who would benefit from the 'value' of buying a livable home in Springfield are people of limited financial means in general....not that these are bad people(many are great neighbors I'm sure), but they aren't going to turn your neighborhood into something like the Hilltop neighborhood in Denver.
Will springfield get better, worse, or stay the same over the next decade or two? Who the heck knows. But what is a safe bet is that the livability of places like springfield will be related to what happens in the other older residential neighborhoods in the area. And the better old residential areas in the area will always be......better. If housing prices remain affordable as they are now in the better parts of Avondale, then there isn't need for middle class people in large numbers to buy in springfield. What's the point? But if housing prices skyrocket....and instead of being able to buy a perfectly livable and nice house in Avondale for 400k it costs 1million, then that's going to price some middle class people out of the market and they will have to look elsewhere....don't really see any indication that is going to happen though in a city like jville.
I think both of you have very valid points. On the one hand, Springfield may gentrify because people will be priced out of Riverside and Avondale. Conversely, Riverside and Avondale are still somewhat affordable, so Springfield might have trouble attracting a lot of middle class people. I don't know what will happen, but I'm really hoping Springfield improves significantly. The area has some great historic housing stock--and that's pretty rare in Jax!
This is my take: Even now, Riverside, and especially Avondale, are pretty pricey. You cited $400,000 for a typical Avondale house. Well, I'm afraid $400,000 is all ready beyond the means of the typical middle class family in Jacksonville (When I think of a typical family in Jax, or in most cities for that matter, I think of them owning a $150,000 house.). Therefore, most people--save the upper middle class and wealthy--are currently priced out of Avondale. Riverside is more affordable, to be sure, but prices are climbing there as well--it's not exactly affordable these days. Now the economy is improving, housing prices are rising, and since Riverside is a very popular neighborhood in Jax, I expect housing prices will rise there to a greater degree than in other Jacksonville neighborhoods. This will price more people out of Riverside, particularly young people or first-time home buyers. Now a lot of younger people and urban-oriented people like historic architecture in dense city settings, but don't have a lot of money--so they'll be priced out of such places as Riverside, Avondale, or San Marco. So, they may very well head to Springfield in search of inexpensive, historic housing. They may save the neighborhood.
Your argument us flawed - a $400k home is not "middle class" in Jacksonville. That's far above.
In Jacksonville, your typical middle class home will be between $75-$145 per square foot.
That's well under $400k for your typical house.
Right now, those home buyers interested in unique, walkable, bikeable neighborhoods (which are the trend now, in demand) have very few options: Riverside & Avondale historic district, San Marco, Springfield historic district......and Murray Hill & Miramar to a lesser extent (the last two are more suburban, less walkable, further out, etc).
Of these, the majority of Avondale and San Marco, the more desirable parts, have been well above middle class reach for a long time. The less desirable parts are not, but you get less for your dollar, both in size & renovation. Ie, you can find a crappy bungalow in Avondale, away from what most think of as Avondale, but it'll cost you around $200k. Same for San Marco, though it's a much smaller area & inventory than Avondale.
Riverside is rapidly rising to this level - in 5 years it will be very similar regarding home values & availability. Try to find a nice 2000 square/ft house in Riverside for under $250k.....it's very rare.
In Murray Hill & Springfield historic district, however, $250k could purchase a very nice, large house. Of course, they cost less because the neighborhoods aren't as revitalized. Ie, there's 5 popular restaurants in the neighborhood instead of 50, there's 3 vacant houses on the block in need of full renovation instead 0 or 1, there's a big community social event every month instead of weekly, etc.
In short, gentrifying neighborhoods in Jax are appealing for the same reasons they're appealing elsewhere - they have some kind of intrinsic value (location, architecture, etc) and offer a similar QOL as more expensive areas, but at a lower price point. It's not rocket science.
Looking long-term, after Murray Hill & the Springfield historic district are nearing the end of gentrification in 20 years, as Riverside is nearing the end of it's gentrification cycle now, look for the Eastside, Lackawanna, and New Town neighborhoods to be the "next".
Cheerio.
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