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If you are that concerned about a hiring manager/boss giving a bad reference, then don't use them. .
That may be difficult. Most applications specifically ask for the name and number of your supervisor. You can get away with checking do not contact if you are currently employed there but elsewhere it sends a huge red flag.
Your only other option would be to omit the job from your resume and then you have a gap to explain and you lose out on all the accomplishments and experience.
"Not eligible for rehiring" is the legal answer that many employers provide since saying too much information could lead to defamation lawsuits. If you have doubts about what a former employer might be saying about you, just call them and ask if they would rehire you OR if they are willing to provide a reference.
It is also legal for employers to decline giving a reference. What is illegal is to defame. Depending on the answer you will know if it is good or bad to include this employer as a reference.
The question is...is it illegal for a previous employer to give a negative job reference-yes it is..you can sue for deflamation of character-how do I know because my ex-boss did just that-even though he was FIRED for sexual harrassment-someone in HR told the potential company-and let's just say he got a nice couple of years paid off. Now how companies get around that is a potential company will ask a question like "would you re hire Sally?" and if the company says "no comment" trust me that speaks volumes-employees on the other hand...well don't you have references that will give good recommendations?
"Not eligible for rehiring" is the legal answer that many employers provide since saying too much information could lead to defamation lawsuits. If you have doubts about what a former employer might be saying about you, just call them and ask if they would rehire you OR if they are willing to provide a reference.
It is also legal for employers to decline giving a reference. What is illegal is to defame. Depending on the answer you will know if it is good or bad to include this employer as a reference.
And in some ways that's worse. There can be vindictive middle management types who will punish employees who leave by putting them down as "no rehire".
Where I work, a previous mid-manager was so bad that she did this to a number of people - some who were rehired because they were needed and were good employees that other hirers in the same company were able to challenge the no-rehire. Personality differences alone with a poor quality supervisor or middle management type can get someone put down as a no rehire. Big company's HR departments often don't make the supervisor justify it in any way.
References aren't alway very useful because everyone can find someone who will write them a positive one.
Of course they can verify employment but....... is the former employer liable for defamation if they cause the former employee issues with obtaining employment based on their(former employer) negative "comments" regarding that former employee... In the past I verified employment dates but was prohibited from offering negative information regarding the reason for the ending of the employment relationship.
The truth is the ultimate defense. As long as what they say is the truth and objective, they can say it.
They can say, "Mary was let go after repeated warnings about tardiness."
They can't say, "Mary always came in late on Mondays, we think she was getting over her weekend bender every Monday morning."
They can say, "Mary didn't have the skillset that was required for her position."
They can't say, "Mary was a dinosaur who couldn't figure out basic word processing on the computer."
I've been reading all of this and find it sickening. I am a recently fired employee because I was looking for another job. I started looking for another job because of the way she treated me and other employees. I couldn't take the verbal and mental abuse any more. I was her supervisor so I got the brunt of it. When she first found out that I was looking she said to stop or she would fire me on the spot the next time. But when I filed for unemployment she made up all kinds of stuff like stealing hours, supplies and said that I had three other wright ups...(which I did not ). I worked with her for 11 1/2 years. I started with her when it was just me and her only and during that time the company crew to any where from 6 to 12 employees. I also have recent email from her before she fired me telling me what a great employee I was.
I know she is not giving me a good reference now or then, because I have had jobs fall through at the last minute with no explanation why ( They wouldn't tell me why). I know my fight in unemployment court is going to be a hard one because she is really good at lying. I know this because I have sat next to her in unemployment court before. Ohh...When I confronted her when she was being very disrespectful or being abusive to employees her favorite quote was....(This is my company and I will say or treat my employees any way I wont and know one is going to tell me I can't). So please when you call for a reference and they have nothing but bad things to say, Please remember there is always two sides. The employers side is not always the truth.
If you are that concerned about a hiring manager/boss giving a bad reference, then don't use them.
This. Plain and simple.
I frequently serve as a reference for former colleagues or people I have managed over the years. A year or so back, I received such a request from one individual that I had managed about 3 or so years ago at a previous employer. To be perfectly honest (without going into the details), I did not feel that I could give this person a good recommendation to a potential employer. As such, I politely declined to serve as a reference for them to begin with, which I thought was fair to both her and myself.
I've been reading all of this and find it sickening. I am a recently fired employee because I was looking for another job. I started looking for another job because of the way she treated me and other employees. I couldn't take the verbal and mental abuse any more. I was her supervisor so I got the brunt of it. When she first found out that I was looking she said to stop or she would fire me on the spot the next time. But when I filed for unemployment she made up all kinds of stuff like stealing hours, supplies and said that I had three other wright ups...(which I did not ). I worked with her for 11 1/2 years. I started with her when it was just me and her only and during that time the company crew to any where from 6 to 12 employees. I also have recent email from her before she fired me telling me what a great employee I was.
I know she is not giving me a good reference now or then, because I have had jobs fall through at the last minute with no explanation why ( They wouldn't tell me why). I know my fight in unemployment court is going to be a hard one because she is really good at lying. I know this because I have sat next to her in unemployment court before. Ohh...When I confronted her when she was being very disrespectful or being abusive to employees her favorite quote was....(This is my company and I will say or treat my employees any way I wont and know one is going to tell me I can't). So please when you call for a reference and they have nothing but bad things to say, Please remember there is always two sides. The employers side is not always the truth.
In the real world...nobody cares about YOUR side when you're looking for work. They are not going to spend the time to figure out "who is right and who is not." Are you for real? In this economy they have sooooo many people looking for work...THEY DON'T GIVE A _____.
Don't use her as a reference. Use another coworker or a client.
this is way too much drama by the way. If any employer smells this. ...you out of the running.
move on.
Short answer: no, it isn't. I'll quote from my employment law textbook.
"To prevail in a defamation claim, the plaintiff must show that:
1. A statement is made that purports to be 'factual' in nature.
2. The statement is false or substantially false.
3. The statement challenges the integrity, character, or ability of the plaintiff.
4. The statement is published either orally or in writing.
5. There is harm to the reputation of the plaintiff."
Two is the real kicker. You have a decent claim if your previous boss says, "She showed up drunk all of the time," or "Her numbers were 25% below those of her peers." But more vague, subjective statements easily slink by that. "We had problems with her tardiness." Were you late twice in a year? Then that isn't really false. "She was disorganized." Did you ever lose a paper or two that were considered important? Not false. "She didn't work well with some of her colleagues." Even if your colleague was a raging you-know-what, it isn't false.
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Originally Posted by Mystique13
If you are that concerned about a hiring manager/boss giving a bad reference, then don't use them.
Depends on the company. Both of the companies I worked for used an outside firm to verify employment with all previous employers and you had to disclose all previous employers.
Quote:
The question is...is it illegal for a previous employer to give a negative job reference-yes it is..you can sue for deflamation of character-how do I know because my ex-boss did just that-even though he was FIRED for sexual harrassment-someone in HR told the potential company-and let's just say he got a nice couple of years paid off.
See above.
Quote:
And in some ways that's worse. There can be vindictive middle management types who will punish employees who leave by putting them down as "no rehire".
Generally, "eligible for internal rehire" means you weren't fired. So let's say you're an awful employee and your boss tells you you can either quit or be fired and you choose to quit. You're probably eligible for internal rehire because you weren't fired. Of course, you won't be, because as soon as they open your old personnel file your application is going in the trash. But, according to company policy, you're still theoretically able to be rehired.
I was fired from a job, my boss said "use me as a reference." I said okay.
Then I kept going on interviews and not getting the job. Great interviews, but no job, and HR would act really curt with me afterwards.
I got suspicious, gave a friend her number and questions to ask, and found out she was saying TERRIBLE things about me that weren't true. That I was a "know it all," that I talked so much people stayed away from me, etc. I was like OMG! My recruiter called the company and demanded to speak to HR and told them how inappropriate my boss was acting.
Long story short HR was stunned, said that my old boss violated company policy, and an email was sent out to the entire company saying that references ONLY go through HR and ALL that HR would say is hire date, end date (never termination, only end), and if a company wanted to verify income they must fax in the request and it would be mailed to them. I don't know what ever happened to my old boss though, probably nothing.
After that I got a job right away.
I'm sure if I pursued it I could have gotten some compensation, but I'm just glad to be out of there!
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