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Old 12-03-2013, 02:18 AM
 
9,889 posts, read 10,239,731 times
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It is almost beyond belief that some people check references before you are given a personal interview or before being sent to a prospective employer is wrong.

They call the references first on applicants they are interested in interviewing or send on a job interview, to find out if you are as good as you claim. Getting people in for an interview costs time and money. Finding out in advance before the interview can save a lot of time and expense on people they will never hire after the references are called.

This is how it has always been done, and will be done in the future. If your references will not help you get a job, then don't put them down. It is just like lenders, that call references before they will offer you a loan.

If you don't want to get a job, don't give references in advance. If you refuse, that is a guarantee you will not get the job. Lets say that the company only gets 200 applications for the job of any quality. They eliminate say 160 of them, by using a computer that kicks out the ones that on first look do not look like suitable applicants. Then they take the next 40 and eliminate it down to say, 20. Then they check references, etc., and the 8 that pass this cut, will be phone interviewed.

Don't give references, and you will never get past the computer cut. No human will even see your application. If you don't give references that can be checked before an interview, you are out of luck even being considered for the job, as references are one of the first thing that the computer evaluates. Leave anything blank, and you are kicked out.
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Old 12-03-2013, 07:35 AM
 
24 posts, read 36,316 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtrader View Post
It is almost beyond belief that some people check references before you are given a personal interview or before being sent to a prospective employer is wrong.

They call the references first on applicants they are interested in interviewing or send on a job interview, to find out if you are as good as you claim. Getting people in for an interview costs time and money. Finding out in advance before the interview can save a lot of time and expense on people they will never hire after the references are called.

This is how it has always been done, and will be done in the future. If your references will not help you get a job, then don't put them down. It is just like lenders, that call references before they will offer you a loan.

If you don't want to get a job, don't give references in advance. If you refuse, that is a guarantee you will not get the job. Lets say that the company only gets 200 applications for the job of any quality. They eliminate say 160 of them, by using a computer that kicks out the ones that on first look do not look like suitable applicants. Then they take the next 40 and eliminate it down to say, 20. Then they check references, etc., and the 8 that pass this cut, will be phone interviewed.

Don't give references, and you will never get past the computer cut. No human will even see your application. If you don't give references that can be checked before an interview, you are out of luck even being considered for the job, as references are one of the first thing that the computer evaluates. Leave anything blank, and you are kicked out.
As someone who is changing careers and industries, can you tell me if this holds true for leaving references off of a resume? If I don't list references on my resume, should I assume I'll never get a call back? If there is a field on an online application that asks for references, then I will list them, as well as their contact information. Otherwise, I have not been listing references unless asked.
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Old 12-03-2013, 07:50 AM
 
Location: broke leftist craphole Illizuela
10,275 posts, read 15,857,849 times
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That is not how it is done. References are called right before an offer and often outsourced to a background check company. Can you imagine if references got called every time someone applied to a job. Managers would be on the phone all day long talking to people about former employees and not doing their jobs. That would be insane. usually only staffing agencies are that clueless and dysfunctional.
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Old 12-03-2013, 08:30 AM
 
Location: 60630
13,643 posts, read 20,479,982 times
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Apparently it is done. I guess not everything is like we think it should be.
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Old 12-03-2013, 08:41 AM
 
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
40,157 posts, read 31,745,351 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchemist80 View Post
That is not how it is done. References are called right before an offer and often outsourced to a background check company. Can you imagine if references got called every time someone applied to a job. Managers would be on the phone all day long talking to people about former employees and not doing their jobs. That would be insane. usually only staffing agencies are that clueless and dysfunctional.

Exactly
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Old 12-03-2013, 08:42 AM
 
Location: broke leftist craphole Illizuela
10,275 posts, read 15,857,849 times
Reputation: 19931
If a company or recruiter tried that with me I'd consider that a poor practice and breach of professional etiquette and be hesistant to proceed with them any further. It is almost as bad as demanding to talk to your current employer before an offer.
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Old 12-03-2013, 09:36 AM
 
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
40,157 posts, read 31,745,351 times
Reputation: 37809
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtrader View Post
If you don't want to get a job, don't give references in advance. If you refuse, that is a guarantee you will not get the job.

I've not found this to be the case. Of course, I don't apply to jobs with monolithic organizations that use computer screening.
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Old 12-03-2013, 10:28 AM
 
7,087 posts, read 6,215,257 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742 View Post
I've not found this to be the case. Of course, I don't apply to jobs with monolithic organizations that use computer screening.
But the problem is pretty much most applications these days are online.

If you want to become a teacher the majority of school districts in the nation use schoolspring.com It doesn't matter if the school district budget is 1 million or 500 million. I've seen both use it

It makes it faster and easier for an employer to call up data from applicants to compare person xyz and person abc. Search functions also make it easier rather than trying to hunt down what specifically is on a resume. Certainly not everything on a resume is going to be on a online application but there are real reasons why those are used.

If it was just applications and say over say 100 applicants it would be a pain for people to sort though them all check the formatting and so on. What can be crystal clear in one resume is not always a given in another.
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Old 12-03-2013, 10:33 AM
 
2 posts, read 2,411 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AverageGuy2006 View Post
As the subject says, I have one recruiter that called and spoke with at least one of my two references prior to lining up an interview for me.

Is this the new trend?
For the most part in the past, I believed references were only contacted in case an actual employer was serious about hiring me.

My reference spend 30 minutes of time on the phone with a recruiter. Will a future potential employer also call him and expect an extended phone conversation ?

I almost wonder if I should tell any future recruiters that ask for a reference that I will provide references once a potential job opportunity is lined up.
I don't imagine that will go over well with the recruiter though.

FWIW, I called my recruiter and left a voicemail to follow up and try to establish some communication once I found out my reference was contacted.
I have yet to receive a return phone call from my recruiter. It has only been a few business days.

There is absolutely no interview even lined up at this point.

Anyone have similar experiences?
Some headhunters do it this way yes.

The idea is that they establish your character and suitability through references before they even attempt to sell you to their clients.

It's like a company policy type of thing.
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Old 12-03-2013, 10:20 PM
 
9,889 posts, read 10,239,731 times
Reputation: 21970
Quote:
That is not how it is done. References are called right before an offer and often outsourced to a background check company. Can you imagine if references got called every time someone applied to a job. Managers would be on the phone all day long talking to people about former employees and not doing their jobs. That would be insane. usually only staffing agencies are that clueless and dysfunctional.
You are wrong. Most applications are kicked out by a computer, and the ones that pass are gone over by humans and more are rejected. The only ones that have the references called (not the current employer) before the interview are the ones that are being considered for interview. The company Hiring Manager for that department, wants to find out who would be kicked out after an interview, and does not want to waste their time even interviewing those people. Today they even have a program, that checks your Facebook and Twitter postings, to evaluate you as a person they want to consider hiring, before your interview.

They check references, Facebook, Twitter, etc., prior to calling you in for an interview. If your references, Facebook, and Twitter as an example are going to get you kicked out of a possibility of getting a job, they want to do it before the interview due to the time and expense involved. They want to know if you are the type of person they want to hire, and if your references say you are good enough to do the job, prior to the interview.

Quote:
I've not found this to be the case. Of course, I don't apply to jobs with monolithic organizations that use computer screening.
If you are applying on line, and with a company of any size at all, and it is for a good job, the first sort of applications is a computer sort, which will reject most applications as they are not what the company wants. My daughter is the head of IT, and I know that she set up the program for her international company to use. The Hiring Manager for the department, gives a list of what they want, and what they do not want and it is programmed into the computer. As an application comes in, it is screened by the computer. If it is rejected the applicant gets a rejection email. Maybe 2% of the applications get beyond the computer screening. If you are applying to a company of any size, your application will be screened by a computer--Period.
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