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The last 2-3 jobs I have had, in sales, the employer did not paint a clear picture what the culture and politics of the company/sales team are.
Why? You are just wasting your time and more importantly, mine. If I were given a clear picture of how dysfunctional my new employer is...............I probably would have declined. Now, it's too late to get my old job back and I am trying to learn to be the man on the island with almost no support which is going to lead to my failure or resigning.
I originally posted the on boarding was horrible, I have asked for support, and am not getting nearly enough. I haven't even spoken to my boss in 2 weeks, he canceled 2 1-1 meetings, and I am not even sure if I am doing what he would like me to do, no communication from him.
This is somewhat of a rhetorical question, because I believe they don't paint a clear picture, because no one would work for them if the did.
That's right, I have already started applying for new jobs. What a waste of the company's money when I bail in less than a year. They will upset with me, and I with them for being untruthful.
So why do this prospective employers? Why bring someone on, without being honest, and then get pissed when new employees bail and you aren't recouping your recruiting costs, why?
I so agree with you. Many companies completely misrepresent what the job is. My last employer stated full training etc etc, nothing. I started job hunting three weeks in.
I've never had that problem with new employers. I had one job where I don't think I properly understood the culture until after I joined the company but I could have made it work if I needed to but I got lucky and was asked by my previous company to reconsider and come back.
Do your coworkers tell you that this is normal operation for your boss? Have you taken the initiative to find out if there is a reason for the cancellations?
So maybe you have been unlucky or it is more industry specific and I am luckier than you are
This is a reason why I get annoyed with employers and hiring managers who love to preach about total honesty on the part of potential employees, when so many of them don't practice what they preach.
As veuvegirl says, they misrepresent jobs all the time. They do this either by lying outright or lying by omission. Years ago, not long out of college, I interviewed for a customer relations position. I asked them about the future stability of the company and long-term potential opportunity. Oh, yes, they assured me. There were lots of opportunities for advancement within the company.
Within a couple of weeks of starting, however, I learned that a couple of (once large) departments had, months earlier, moved to the corporate office hundreds of miles away, and that other departments were in the process of either being downsized or eliminated altogether. For that and other unrelated reasons, I left 10 months later. That particular location of the company closed within 18 months of my leaving.
I doubt they put much effort into recruiting. Throw up an ad, do a cursory interview, 2 hours of training and let the new hires sink or swim.
It's a terrible way to do things, but if a company is messed up in all other ways, do you really expect them to be honest when recruiting?
That's what it is. When a company is messed up, there's a reason they're messed up and that toxicity is going to ooze onto everything they do.
I have had two jobs in the past where I came on board, noticed that things "weren't quite right", and the boss I had in each job was fired within a year of me coming on. Sadly though, this doesn't always happen and you're stuck in a dysfunctional culture and at the mercy of it. The bright side is, you become very clear about the interview red flags that you simply refuse to overlook in the future.
That's what it is. When a company is messed up, there's a reason they're messed up and that toxicity is going to ooze onto everything they do.
I have had two jobs in the past where I came on board, noticed that things "weren't quite right", and the boss I had in each job was fired within a year of me coming on. Sadly though, this doesn't always happen and you're stuck in a dysfunctional culture and at the mercy of it. The bright side is, you become very clear about the interview red flags that you simply refuse to overlook in the future.
Exactly. This nonsense happens all the time, and if a place has cultural rot, it usually goes through to the core.
The last place I worked was completely dysfunctional. I sort of wondered a bit in the beginning, but it wasn't until I officially joined the CAM department that I saw just how badly run the place was:
- No documentation of anything, no standards, no processes, no control... nothing. My department was nothing but 2 angry, old guys who "have been doing it that way for 20 years," but they sure as heck aren't going to tell anyone else how things are done... that might threaten their job, so expect no guidance or documentation.
- Rage-filled, bigoted sociopath coworkers who all hate each other. Don't ask me how a company that at most employed 80 people can be full of so much inter-department warfare that one almost expects a fight to break out. And heaven help you if you're not a far-right wing, angry old white guy! That place was so bad they should have been flying the confederate flag out front... I "learned" there that using the "n-word" every day is apparently acceptable in backward places of business, and the KKK lynching black people is "just an example of a group expressing their 1st Amendment rights..." Yeah... sure...
- No communications other than screaming and threats - Watch as each manager screams something different at you, and then realize that not one of them is interested in the facts - they just like to scream and threaten people. Brilliant!
- No ability to keep current customers. Why? Because they grossly underbid all the jobs, then threaten their employees when they can't work miracles, and then lose money. In a sane world, they would bid the jobs honestly, but that would require the managers to be honest, and that simply wasn't possible.
- Leadership that is dumber than a sack of bricks. Watch as the well-paid leaders run the place into the ground! Marvel as they throw out good customers and replace them with scam artists who never pay the company! Be amazed as they cut off ties with skilled sub-contractors and replace them with "cheaper" alternatives who cannot do their job! Then, don't be shocked at all as the place collapses financially.
So, yeah - the place was so badly run that they are on the edge of bankruptcy now and haven't made any money in over half a year or longer. Management's solution so far has been: to get into bed with crooked customers who won't pay us, double down on sub-contractors that can't do their job, and layoff the workers while keeping the company pets employed a little longer.
They are toast, and I honestly don't care... that place doesn't deserve to be in business, quite frankly.
Do your coworkers tell you that this is normal operation for your boss? Have you taken the initiative to find out if there is a reason for the cancellations?
1. Unfortunately my co-worker that is helping me, told me this is the norm, and it's in large part due to my boss taking on way too many responsibilities. Here is the worst part. My friend works there, diff co-worker, and I specifically said is this going to get better if I get hired, because the interview process was dysfunctional, and he said yes he has just been busy, it will be better once you are hired.
So when I do most likely leave soon, I am going to have a chat with my "friend" about his lack of honesty I don't believe he did it with malicious intent, but he gets a referral fee if I am there 6 months. I think our SM sold him some of the same BS too.
The cancellations are due to my SM taking way too much on his plate. He is way over committed. The company is run like a start up, spread way too thin. Maybe this is norm for company that claims to run like a start up but has been in business for some time?
Who knows maybe small biz's aren't for me. It seems it could be great to be at a start up, once you are up to speed, but I am wasting hours a day dealing with buggy software, laptops that are DOA, systems not configured correct. I can do some of these tasks, having prior IT support work exp, but it's taking so much time I will never hit my sales numbers. When I think about it, it seems they are using the term start up, to cover up a very dysfunctional environment.
You and I must have worked at the same start-up a few years ago!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambler123
Exactly. This nonsense happens all the time, and if a place has cultural rot, it usually goes through to the core.
The last place I worked was completely dysfunctional. I sort of wondered a bit in the beginning, but it wasn't until I officially joined the CAM department that I saw just how badly run the place was:
- No documentation of anything, no standards, no processes, no control... nothing. My department was nothing but 2 angry, old guys who "have been doing it that way for 20 years," but they sure as heck aren't going to tell anyone else how things are done... that might threaten their job, so expect no guidance or documentation.
- Rage-filled, bigoted sociopath coworkers who all hate each other. Don't ask me how a company that at most employed 80 people can be full of so much inter-department warfare that one almost expects a fight to break out. And heaven help you if you're not a far-right wing, angry old white guy! That place was so bad they should have been flying the confederate flag out front... I "learned" there that using the "n-word" every day is apparently acceptable in backward places of business, and the KKK lynching black people is "just an example of a group expressing their 1st Amendment rights..." Yeah... sure...
- No communications other than screaming and threats - Watch as each manager screams something different at you, and then realize that not one of them is interested in the facts - they just like to scream and threaten people. Brilliant!
- No ability to keep current customers. Why? Because they grossly underbid all the jobs, then threaten their employees when they can't work miracles, and then lose money. In a sane world, they would bid the jobs honestly, but that would require the managers to be honest, and that simply wasn't possible.
- Leadership that is dumber than a sack of bricks. Watch as the well-paid leaders run the place into the ground! Marvel as they throw out good customers and replace them with scam artists who never pay the company! Be amazed as they cut off ties with skilled sub-contractors and replace them with "cheaper" alternatives who cannot do their job! Then, don't be shocked at all as the place collapses financially.
So, yeah - the place was so badly run that they are on the edge of bankruptcy now and haven't made any money in over half a year or longer. Management's solution so far has been: to get into bed with crooked customers who won't pay us, double down on sub-contractors that can't do their job, and layoff the workers while keeping the company pets employed a little longer.
They are toast, and I honestly don't care... that place doesn't deserve to be in business, quite frankly.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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You really answered your own question when you said "If I were given a clear picture of how dysfunctional my new employer is...............I probably would have declined."
If they have any chance of straightening out a dysfunctional workplace, they need to get some better people in there. Telling candidates how bad it is won't help that, especially when the worst problem is the hiring supervisor/manager.
When I took over a job that had been very badly managed with several failures before me, rather than complain or quit, I managed to get it back on the right track, and when my boss was demoted took over that supervisory position. Within a year I had it back to a smoothly operting unit, with written procedures, an upgraded database management system, one new position that I filled and one new person that I hired and trained to replace one that transferred out.
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Why bring someone on, without being honest, and then get pissed when new employees bail and you aren't recouping your recruiting costs, why? 
