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If you told me no, I would terminate any potential consideration immediately.
If you even formed your lips to even ask me to do something so trifling, you wouldn't have to worry about "terminating any potential consideration" with me. I would immediately give you an evil look for wasting my time, because I would see the "writing on the wall", so to speak, gather up my things, walk out of your cheap looking office (because it probably is) and then report you to every governmental agency I can think of for violating state and federal wage laws.
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I'm sorry, but 8 hours is not that much time.
We'll let the IRS, state tax department and both state and fed DOL departments decide if this is true.
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If you're that selfish that you monetize every single waking minute, any possible value you provide work-wise would be lost due to your toxic attitude.
Like the Alaskan dingbat said during the presidential race "You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a PIG.".
Because the goal is not to get a free day from an untrained worker.
The goal is to get someone to invest large amounts of time into an "interview" process, and then lowball their wage. Or in some even more insidious cases, use this sort of process to find workers willing to break wage laws and then continue to get those workers to work unpaid overtime, off the clock days, constantly change their exempt status, etc. Ever seen those cases were workers work weeks without getting a paycheck? It starts with "interview" processes like this.
Exactly. They can spot the desperate chumps a mile away.
Even answering the phones seems suspect. She's not going to know who anyone is to transfer calls or how to schedule appointments if she's not trained on whatever calendar software they use.
Oh please! How big do you think this company is? It will only take her an hour or hour and a half max to know how to answer the phone, put someone on hold, transfer a call to the person or voicemail, take a message, sign for packages, order food for whomever, etcetera. I'm sure she'll have a list next to the phone of everyone's name and number.
See pages 16 and 17 of the NYS DOL Unemployment Insurance Claimant's Handbook (dated January 2014) for "What is considered work?" and "What if I do volunteer work?":
Doing unpaid work is NOT automatically considered "volunteer work" by the NYS DOL and exempt from being claimed as a "day of work" on your weekly claim.
As for the "landscaping help you gave your dad" are you:
1. Located in New York?
And did you:
2. Report doing it while collecting unemployment insurance to the Department of Labor?
If he didn't, then he committed fraud which depending on how much he collected can be considered a FELONY or a low end misdemeanor.
New York and California has this question on their unemployment forms and I always wondered why.
After reading this thread and seeing the sheisty replies, I no longer do. The states obviously know of employers who will try to play slick with the "work for free to see how you fit in" jazz to not only get over wage and tax laws, but paying into the mandatory unemployment insurance program as well.
Hmmm, I will call the state unemployment office, in addition to the department of labor, and both fed and state tax agencies as well to make SURE they are aware of these shady practices.
Yes, the unemployed person might not put down they worked for free, because it's not like the company would tell the state unemployment office and they could still collect UI for that day. But...if the unemployed person was HONEST in what happened, then that employer would have to answer some questions to WHY they are skirting the labor laws of the state.
Scam artists like these need to be exposed EVERYWHERE, even on the internet and messageboards like this one.
Because they were NEVER an "employee". They owe the con artist employer NOTHING.
Yes, Marilyn it could be that New York State does not approve of "unpaid trial work," and instead just wants it to be reported on Unemployment Insurance claims so they can investigate.
Note that the new handbook also addresses "independent contractor" scams on page 33 of the handbook and encourages everybody to file for Unemployment, no matter if they are "independent contractors" or "off the books" workers. It states, "It is against the law for any employer to force you to give up your rights to file for Unemployment Insurance Benefits. No employer should tell you that you cannot claim benefits. Everyone has a right to file a claim. The Department of Labor alone will decide if you are eligible for benefits. It does not matter whether your employer considered you an independent contractor ..." and then they go on to explain employer fraud regarding independent contractors.
What do you think a temp does? Walks into an office and starts working. They answer phones, transfer calls(you know with a list of names/ phones numbers), and get quickly shown what they will be doing.
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Originally Posted by marilyn220
Oh please! How big do you think this company is? It will only take her an hour or hour and a half max to know how to answer the phone, put someone on hold, transfer a call to the person or voicemail, take a message, sign for packages, order food for whomever, etcetera. I'm sure she'll have a list next to the phone of everyone's name and number.
It's not and never has been brain surgery.
I have been a temp (not a clerical temp, but a contractor just the same) and was trained. I didn't walk in day 1 and know how to use their applications. I had to ask questions and be on someone's watch until I got the hang of it.
Sorry, I just do not understand how this can be a long term strategy a company is using for employment. The first day of work is always the most foreign. You guys are trying to sell the idea of first timers every single day; all year. And somehow that is supposed to help the company; make money for the company, because their higher paid, more seasoned staff, are spending time helping out the every day first timers who don't even know where the bathrooms are.
Yes, Marilyn it could be that New York State does not approve of "unpaid trial work," and instead just wants it to be reported on Unemployment Insurance claims so they can investigate.
I'm sure MANY states have this on their books, except maybe Texas or one of the poverty stricken states that are pro-employer and anti-employee.
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Note that the new handbook also addresses "independent contractor" scams on page 33 of the handbook and encourages everybody to file for Unemployment, no matter if they are "independent contractors" or "off the books" workers. It states, "It is against the law for any employer to force you to give up your rights to file for Unemployment Insurance Benefits. No employer should tell you that you cannot claim benefits. Everyone has a right to file a claim. The Department of Labor alone will decide if you are eligible for benefits. It does not matter whether your employer considered you an independent contractor ..." and then they go on to explain employer fraud regarding independent contractors.
I will edit my previous post.
I_Love_LI_but, the highlighted confuses me a bit. I always believed an IC was someone who signed on for a project, worked their own hours, used their own equipment, got paid in the beginning, middle and end of the project. The company would then file a 1099 and the contractor would handle their own taxes.
Are they referring to temps? Or people who by definition of the tax laws are EMPLOYEES, but the company is calling them independent contractors? <<I read stories like this one all the time on here and as usual, there are people trying to to justify how being TOLD WHAT TO DO by the boss is not necessarily traditional employee work.
I'm sure MANY states have this on their books, except maybe Texas or one of the poverty stricken states that are pro-employer and anti-employee.
I_Love_LI_but, the highlighted confuses me a bit. I always believed an IC was someone who signed on for a project, worked their own hours, used their own equipment, got paid in the beginning, middle and end of the project. The company would then file a 1099 and the contractor would handle their own taxes.
Are they referring to temps? Or people who by definition of the tax laws are EMPLOYEES, but the company is calling them independent contractors? <<I read stories like this one all the time on here and as usual, there are people trying to to justify how being TOLD WHAT TO DO by the boss is not necessarily traditional employee work.
They are referring to the bolded. If you go to the handbook I linked to in post #303 and go to page 33, the NYS Department of Labor gives a brief overview of companies who illegally call employees independent contractors AND encourages people to apply for unemployment benefits anyway, even if the employee is on a 1099, because the fraud in this classification is so rampant and the DOL wants to address it and also wants to give people unemployment benefits if they deserve them because they were improperly classified as an independent contractor. They even post a phone number for an Employer Fraud Hotline for people to report this.
Oh please! How big do you think this company is? It will only take her an hour or hour and a half max to know how to answer the phone, put someone on hold, transfer a call to the person or voicemail, take a message, sign for packages, order food for whomever, etcetera. I'm sure she'll have a list next to the phone of everyone's name and number.
It's not and never has been brain surgery.
Exactly. Which is why I made the temp comment, because that is what temp does. Besides the OP said it was a fairly small company.
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Originally Posted by Braunwyn
I have been a temp (not a clerical temp, but a contractor just the same) and was trained. I didn't walk in day 1 and know how to use their applications. I had to ask questions and be on someone's watch until I got the hang of it.
Sorry, I just do not understand how this can be a long term strategy a company is using for employment. The first day of work is always the most foreign. You guys are trying to sell the idea of first timers every single day; all year. And somehow that is supposed to help the company; make money for the company, because their higher paid, more seasoned staff, are spending time helping out the every day first timers who don't even know where the bathrooms are.
You honestly believe this? Really?
You're talking apples and oranges when you compare clerical temp work vs. contract work.
Someone going in on to a temp assignment will more than likely be given minimal training, if they don't catch on quick enough, out they go.
I don't think this CEO has someone new every day come in to answer phones for months on end.
What he is doing is going to try several people out and than lowball them.
If you can't make a hiring decision based on the interview, reference checks, work history, than perhaps you shouldn't be making hiring decisions.
I posted earlier on this thread earlier that after an interview I was asked if I had the time to stay and sit with the woman(who was getting a promotion) job I would be filling, I did have the time and stayed a couple of hours, and I was later offered and accepted the job and remained for 5 yrs.
That's different than being asked to come in for 8 hours and work for free.
I also wander what is the liability factor involved if these people get injured while working for free?
Exactly. Which is why I made the temp comment, because that is what temp does. Besides the OP said it was a fairly small company.
You're talking apples and oranges when you compare clerical temp work vs. contract work.
Someone going in on to a temp assignment will more than likely be given minimal training, if they don't catch on quick enough, out they go.
I don't think this CEO has someone new every day come in to answer phones for months on end.
What he is doing is going to try several people out and than lowball them.
If you can't make a hiring decision based on the interview, reference checks, work history, than perhaps you shouldn't be making hiring decisions.
I posted earlier on this thread earlier that after an interview I was asked if I had the time to stay and sit with the woman(who was getting a promotion) job I would be filling, I did have the time and stayed a couple of hours, and I was later offered and accepted the job and remained for 5 yrs.
That's different than being asked to come in for 8 hours and work for free.
I also wander what is the liability factor involved if these people get injured while working for free?
Exactly! Especially with a 4-hour interview, as the OP posted that's how long the interview was!
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, than perhaps you shouldn't be making hiring decisions.