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Old 11-16-2008, 05:49 PM
 
Location: Chi-Town soon to be NYC and eventually Ireland
291 posts, read 1,036,981 times
Reputation: 367

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Quote:
Originally Posted by zxcv View Post
Final conclusion: We can leave without them ! Tough times, we have to eliminate extra-costs.
I'm not trying to be rude, but is English your second language?
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Old 11-16-2008, 05:55 PM
 
Location: Chi-Town soon to be NYC and eventually Ireland
291 posts, read 1,036,981 times
Reputation: 367
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta Belle View Post
If you have a vacancy at any given firm, why not ask the candidate if they're interested before presenting their resume to the client? If the candidate's already applied to that firm, they'll probably tell you then or just say no.

A resume shouldn't be presented to a prospective employer without the candidate's consent, anyway. A firm that interviewed but didn't hire me, passed my resume to another firm I'd never heard of. So when Firm #2 called me, I had no idea who they were.
Well no kidding that resumes shouldn't be presented without candidate approval . I *always* ask where they've applied and let them know exactly where their resume is going and make sure they are in fact interested in that particular firm. The problem is that you would not believe the disorganized way that many people run a job search. They will tell you they're not working with anyone else and/or that they've given you an exhaustive list of where they've submitted their resume over the past year, and then you hear back from the client that they have the resume on file already, and when you go back to the candidate to see what the heck is going on, they'll say "Oh! I must have forgotten I sent my resume there!" Or "Oh, my other recruiter must have sent mine over already!" It makes them look terrible. So it's not a matter of us (or at least not me) doing my job improperly, it's a matter of people having either a terrible memory or being entirely reckless in where their resume is being sent.
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Old 11-16-2008, 08:57 PM
 
Location: Somewhere over the Rainbow
625 posts, read 3,508,939 times
Reputation: 445
As someone who has been unemployed almost the entire year I can honestly say that I have met my fair share of shameful recruiters. Those that advertise for positions that they no longer have available (if it ever was available), have you fill out a long application, and ramble on about a position they are "working" on that would be perfect for you. One person said they try to get as much info out of the recruiter as possible about a particular job or company and then google the company to pursue on their own. I think that is a good idea but how often does it work? Recruiters are very mum about who the company is that they are recruiting for. Another said recruiters use their jobseekers for fishing purposes. I agree with that 100%. Case and point I have a company that I have worked with for years. They got me my first temp to hire job in which i stayed on with the company for a few years. I also used them last year as well for a crappy temp job. A few weeks ago I contacted my recruiter to see if they had anything available while I wait for a response from a great company I interviewed with. Instead of responding to my request, the first thing she said was " So what is the name company you are interviewing with?" Needless to say I never responded back. Only an idiot would do that because I don't need her contacting the company trying to pitch anymore candidates. She's good at what she does and because of that I KNOW she would look into the company I was meeting with. In this market she hasn't had any real available positions (I have been in contact with her all year...NOTHING AVAILABLE) beginning and middle of last year she had quite a bit available for me to fill. Most agencies are hurting I have been in contact with a few this year and to say I was pissed wasting my gas and time is an understatement.

But...not all recruiters are shady individuals. I have worked with a couple of good ones and have found it's nice to keep in contact with the good ones because trust me they keep a file on you and if you are good to them they will continue to notify you when a great position comes along.

Last edited by neekah18; 11-16-2008 at 09:18 PM..
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Old 11-17-2008, 10:27 PM
 
5 posts, read 11,407 times
Reputation: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojo Riley View Post
Well no kidding that resumes shouldn't be presented without candidate approval . I *always* ask where they've applied and let them know exactly where their resume is going and make sure they are in fact interested in that particular firm. The problem is that you would not believe the disorganized way that many people run a job search. They will tell you they're not working with anyone else and/or that they've given you an exhaustive list of where they've submitted their resume over the past year, and then you hear back from the client that they have the resume on file already, and when you go back to the candidate to see what the heck is going on, they'll say "Oh! I must have forgotten I sent my resume there!" Or "Oh, my other recruiter must have sent mine over already!" It makes them look terrible. So it's not a matter of us (or at least not me) doing my job improperly, it's a matter of people having either a terrible memory or being entirely reckless in where their resume is being sent.
Point taken. Thanks for the insight.

A few years ago, a recruiter I was working with cautioned me about posting my resume online. She had presented a candidate to a couple of clients, and was told they already had her resume on file. However, the candidate hadn't applied to those clients.

The candidate had also posted her resume on a career Website. Eventually they figured out that another recruiting firm had pulled her resume from the site, and was shopping her around without her knowledge or consent. If a client expressed interest, the other recruiter was going to contact the candidate then.

Again, this was a few years ago, when career Websites may still have been fine-tuning access to their databases because of this sort of thing.
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Old 11-18-2008, 07:20 AM
 
Location: City, State
364 posts, read 1,504,963 times
Reputation: 156
^^^

I've never understood why some companies submit resumes of candidates without the candidate knowing about it. What happens when the company wants to interview that candidate, and the staffing firm can't get ahold of them? Or the person doesn't want to interview with that company? They look like complete idiots. I'm sure they lie and say "oh he just took a job, sorry we're a day late" or something like that.
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Old 11-18-2008, 01:41 PM
 
29 posts, read 165,280 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojo Riley View Post
I'm not trying to be rude, but is English your second language?
Nooo, you're not rude at all... English is my 4th language, what about you?
Because you encountered difficulties in understanding my posting, I can rewrite it correctly: << We can LIVE without them (recruiters and real estates agents) >>.
Any other thoughts now?
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Old 01-13-2009, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Chi-Town soon to be NYC and eventually Ireland
291 posts, read 1,036,981 times
Reputation: 367
Quote:
Originally Posted by zxcv View Post
Nooo, you're not rude at all... English is my 4th language, what about you?
Because you encountered difficulties in understanding my posting, I can rewrite it correctly: << We can LIVE without them (recruiters and real estates agents) >>.
Any other thoughts now?
Yikes, persnickety much?

My dear, sweet child- I did not have any trouble "understanding" your post. Seven years of higher education has given me nothing if not extraordinary reading comprehension skills.

I asked because in my experience, having worked with candidates for whom English was a second language, your (clear and undeniable) difficulty with expressing yourself in written English could pose a serious problem in your job search. In fact, it could easily be mistaken for illiteracy or sheer laziness. Thus, a good recruiter who can package you the right way, and work with you on your written materials, would be worth their weight in gold.

Though I've gotta say, I cannot imagine a good recruiter putting up with your attitude for even 5 seconds. You're defensive, unpleasant, and have an unjustifiably inflated sense of self.

Dismissed.
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Old 01-14-2009, 02:02 PM
 
1,525 posts, read 3,593,408 times
Reputation: 743
So let me ask all the recruiters herein. Suppose you get a bad reference... do you ever hear out the potential recruit's side of the story?

Seems to me this whole game is a little one sided.
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Old 01-14-2009, 02:10 PM
 
25,161 posts, read 51,311,130 times
Reputation: 7018
Yes. They are crazy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zxcv View Post
It seems ridiculous, but in the last 2 weeks I was contacted for several recruiters saying thet they have job opportunities for me, but before they could set up a technical interview wiht the company, they need to check my references and the references has to be the manager!!!

I provided to some of them my references but not the manager one, and they checked my references and did not setup any interview because I did not provide them the manager( I have to mention that they tested my techinical knowleadge - programming field- on a phone screening and said that was OK).
I think that that's a really a big SCAM here: they want to get managers cell phones so they can contact them and ask for jobs.

Is anybody here experiencing the same issue?

Isn't this consider an abuse on the people trying to find a job in these bad days ? Can't they be punished in a way for taking advantage on that?
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Old 01-14-2009, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Seattle
1,369 posts, read 3,131,433 times
Reputation: 1499
Disclaimer: worked for a recruiting company several years ago right after I finished college.

Recruiters add a lot of value and can streamline the hiring process in many ways. The major reason a recruiter can justify a 15-20k fee is because they target currently working top performers who aren't browsing job boards or advertisements. Many of these people will be open to jobs that make sense and can be persuaded to interview for a position they aren't necessarily looking for. Recruiters can target very specific companies that a hiring manager wants to find a candidate from and are a key asset for positions that are very key to a company's success.

Danny Cahill is one of the famous trainers in the recruiting industry. He suggests you check references for the simple reason that it's one of the easiest ways to get new business. In his own words at a seminar, "you should be looking for an excuse to check references!" Recruiters check references because they want to validate a candidates background sure, but the fundamental benefit for a recruiter to check references is to generate new contacts. It is a very easy way to get a VP level person on the phone and they usually call back. Much easier than pitching consulting services for sure. Most clients really don't care nor do they expect a candidates references to be checked prior to submitting a resume. Checking references can also be useful to "sell" a candidate to a company.

Look the recruiting business is not really a dishonest one. There are some bad apples like any other business. It's really competitive and recruiters tend to be type A and fairly cutthroat. The business is about networking and the driving reason why recruiters check references is to talk to people and build their network. Yes it helps to validate a candidates background and yes recruiters tell clients they will do it, but those reasons are tertiary. Recruiters check references because talking to people IS their business. They want to sell services to VPs, CEOs and managers and those references might also be looking for a job.
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