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Old 05-28-2015, 10:09 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguydownsouth View Post
When someone has a word for "everyone thats not us" its offensive.
oh.....like "Americans" ?
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Old 05-28-2015, 12:43 PM
 
Location: No
467 posts, read 350,564 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JB from NC View Post
Yes, bizarre. And I clearly stated that I think location has much to do with it.

While TFF has stated several times that he thinks they're our biggest ally, where I come from they're the ones who call us "Christ killers", vandalize our synagogues, and try to make Christianity a state religion.
Very interesting. Where in the Tarheel State do you come from? I was partly raised in W-S, and that was NOT my experience. Of course, the fact that I was still in grade school may have affected my experience. But there were churches everywhere. Cub Scout troops were all church-sponsored. My best friend in school sat out dancing because his religion didn't do that. His mother ran Bible classes after school, which I attended two or three times. I was LESS comfortable then than I am now, because I was an atheist whose family belonged to a Reform "temple." Now that I am not an atheist, and am more or less Orthodox in observance, I am MORE comfortable around Bible-believing Christians than I was then. I do not find theflipflop's observations on this subject odd at all. They are pretty much the same as mine.

My experience in the Bible Belt has been mostly positive, yet I don't doubt yours at all. Hence my interest in your location. And, of course, sometimes things change over time.

?
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Old 05-28-2015, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Long Island
1,790 posts, read 1,857,894 times
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Fayetteville/Fort Bragg area.
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Old 05-28-2015, 12:57 PM
 
Location: No
467 posts, read 350,564 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguydownsouth View Post
Goyim and gentile is offensive for the obvious reason, it sets barriers. When someone has a word for "everyone thats not us" its offensive. Christians are just as offensive when they refer to me as "unsaved" for being an agnostic.
"Goyim" is Hebrew for "nations." You probably already knew that. Obviously, "gentile" means the same thing. But whether one should be offended by it is a whole 'nother thing. As Tzaphkiel points out, "American" also sets barriers. In general, that's what words with definitions do. "thatguydownsouth" sets a barrier between you and all the other posters here. That's mostly good. I do not find it offensive at all.

I do not find Christians offensive in using the word "unsaved." Its use does imply a whole way of looking at things that I consider (politely) invalid and (realistically) ridiculous. But most of them do not hold it to be offensive. They, I think, actually see it as an opportunity to "save" me or some other "unsaved" soul. Nonsense, but not malice.

Likewise, some Jews, particularly orthodox, mean no offense in using the word "goy" or its plural in referring to one or more non-Jews, if there is some reason to do so.

I don't agree with S. I. Hayakawa in everything, but there is at least something to be learned from "Words don't mean; people mean."
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Old 05-28-2015, 01:05 PM
 
Location: No
467 posts, read 350,564 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JB from NC View Post
Fayetteville/Fort Bragg area.
Interesting. Do you think that that crowd is all local, or maybe fairly strongly affected by the military?

FWIW, I spent 25 years in the USN, where I perceived almost no negative reaction to the fact that I was Jewish. Maybe none at all. However, over twenty of those years were during the time that I was completely non-observant. Atheists have it easy in the armed forces, I believe.
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Old 05-28-2015, 01:22 PM
 
Location: Long Island
1,790 posts, read 1,857,894 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Call View Post
Interesting. Do you think that that crowd is all local, or maybe fairly strongly affected by the military?
I've seen it in both.
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Old 05-28-2015, 02:54 PM
 
22,009 posts, read 19,112,807 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JB from NC View Post
I've seen it in both.
I grew up in Asheville in a very liberal secular family surrounded by hellfire and brimstone Baptists.
It was hard to say which horrified the neighbors more, that we did not go to church, that we did not eat okra and collard greens, or that I had a black doll (my grandmother wisely sent me a different doll every year from a different country / nationality, and I looooooooooved my dolls). at any rate i was allowed to go to their homes, but their children were not allowed in our house. When immigration came to public schools, they all moved to a different part of town, as in all-white.
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Old 05-29-2015, 02:08 AM
 
Location: New Zealand
1,422 posts, read 948,167 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Why?...
Here is why.
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Old 05-29-2015, 05:35 AM
 
Location: Florida
4,103 posts, read 5,409,165 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Call View Post
"Goyim" is Hebrew for "nations." You probably already knew that. Obviously, "gentile" means the same thing. But whether one should be offended by it is a whole 'nother thing. As Tzaphkiel points out, "American" also sets barriers. In general, that's what words with definitions do. "thatguydownsouth" sets a barrier between you and all the other posters here. That's mostly good. I do not find it offensive at all.

I do not find Christians offensive in using the word "unsaved." Its use does imply a whole way of looking at things that I consider (politely) invalid and (realistically) ridiculous. But most of them do not hold it to be offensive. They, I think, actually see it as an opportunity to "save" me or some other "unsaved" soul. Nonsense, but not malice.

Likewise, some Jews, particularly orthodox, mean no offense in using the word "goy" or its plural in referring to one or more non-Jews, if there is some reason to do so.

I don't agree with S. I. Hayakawa in everything, but there is at least something to be learned from "Words don't mean; people mean."
No. Americans means people that ARE American. Goy means people that ARENT Jewish. See the difference?
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Old 05-29-2015, 06:21 AM
 
Location: No
467 posts, read 350,564 times
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Yes, that's a good point, although one often leads to the other. In the end, sometimes it's offensive, sometimes it isn't, and the listener may not always perceive what the speaker means (and may occasionally perceive it even better).

Thanks for the contribution.
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