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I guess it’s just how different Jews are “wired.” I would simply ask a qualified LORD (local orthodox rabbi dude) “what’s the Halacha?” And no further effort is required. Life must be really difficult when you don’t have a rabbi who knows the Halacha, and you’re constantly having to make your own morality or halachic decisions, essentially in the dark, no?
I guess it’s just how different Jews are “wired.” I would simply ask a qualified LORD (local orthodox rabbi dude) “what’s the Halacha?” And no further effort is required. Life must be really difficult when you don’t have a rabbi who knows the Halacha, and you’re constantly having to make your own morality or halachic decisions, essentially in the dark, no?
If my Local Conservative Rabbi said I have to stand for Kaddish I would. If he said I had to sit for Kaddish I would. But instead he accepts that people have different family minhagim on this and both are acceptable. That IS his halachic decision.
I was engaging in discussion here only because someone else was giving a rationale for the position which I do not follow. I did not mean to assert that I would place that over the paskening of my Local Conservative Rabbi. But if he gave as his reasoning that we should stand because we are affirming something about Hashem, I would certainly ASK him why this does not apply to other tfillot. And I am sure he would give me an enlightening answer.
Do not mistake a willingness to engage in back and forth on an online forum for inability to find a local posek.
BTW, of course, as I said above there is a (fairly small) group of halachically educated young people who DO choose to make their own halachic decisions. But they find it empowering, not burdensome.
granted, this moves past certain complex topics too quickly, but it has some important info.
That is pretty good as far as I read. Key points - somewhat different takes in the C vs the O community. An acceptance that there are different personal minhagim on this.
I was raised Reform - we did not do readers kaddish. In the more traditional R shul of my childhood only mourners rose for mourners kaddish - in all Reform communities I encountered later all rose "because someone somewhere needs you to say kaddish for them"
When I entered the C world it was in communities where only mourners rose for mourners kaddish, and people sat for other kaddishes. I followed that. My wife however, comes from an Orthodox family where it was the custom to stand for the kaddish (other than the mourners kaddish) so she stands. It is her way of showing kibbud av v'em. There are a few others in our shul who follow that minhag, and no one thinks its wrong to do so. No one feels at a loss for guidance as far as I know. If you want the rabbi to pasken, he will. If you want to follow your halachically acceptable family minhag, you may (of course this is not disruptive to the service). If you want to accept the rabbi's paskening without questioning you may. If you want to chat about halachic reasoning over oneg, you may.
That’s a very good explanation, BBD, and gives good insight into how C Jews think and behave.
Of course the practice of all normative Orthodox Ashkenazi Jews is to stand. In 20 years inside this movement, I’ve never once seen a Jew sit for Kaddish, unless they they were injured, lost in thought, or putter for some halachic reason. Literally never once.
As you know, it’s forbidden for Torah Observant Jews to step foot in a R/C shul during tefilla, and I have blotted out all memories of what it was like when I was a kid in those shuls. So I find it interesting about the way these other Jewish and Jew”ish” Jews do their thing.
That’s a very good explanation, BBD, and gives good insight into how C Jews think and behave.
Of course the practice of all normative Orthodox Ashkenazi Jews is to stand. In 20 years inside this movement, I’ve never once seen a Jew sit for Kaddish, unless they they were injured, lost in thought, or putter for some halachic reason. Literally never once.
As you know, it’s forbidden for Torah Observant Jewsto step foot in a R/C shul during tefilla, and I have blotted out all memories of what it was like when I was a kid in those shuls. So I find it interesting about the way these other Jewish and Jew”ish” Jews do their thing.
1. If you mean Orthodox Jews, or Haredi Jews, please say so. There are Conservative Jews who are completely halachically observant (al pi Conservative) and its not really appropriate here to imply they are not Torah Observant. They obviously DO step into C shuls during tfillah
2. AFAICT many modern O authorities (kol va khomer, the Open Orthodox authorities) allow someone to step inside a C shul during tfillah, though they would probably have to daven the Amidah seperately
3. I once, after a community event on a weekday, which was held at a C shul here in greater DC, found myself asked to complete an (all male) minyan held in a side room. Someone needed to say kaddish. Most of the participants appeared to be O, and at least one was black hat, IIRC.
Your Rov may have told YOU, a BT, to avoid even being present in an R or C shul during tfilah, but I do not believe that even all haredi Jews hold by that. Certainly its not held by all Orthodox authorities from all I can gather.
Yes, I would have thought that the Haredi movement, being relatively new, is a branch off the trunk of Orthodox Judaism?
Its all a question of how we read pre modern mainstream authorities. Not surprising that many Haredim see the Rambam, say, as Haredi. Of course I know the Rambam was a great Conservative Rabbi
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