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Old 03-16-2009, 07:05 AM
 
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I work in a Jewish facility on the weekends, and on Saturdays, I have to go to the door and open it for some of the visitors. They have to follow me in (it's strange to me because it's an automatic door, but I digress), and when they go to the elevators, I think someone has to push the button for them. It's the same thing when they leave.

I was just wondering what is the origin and reason for this custom? Does anyone here know?
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Old 03-16-2009, 08:21 AM
 
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This custom is called the Sabbath (or Shabbat, or Shabbos). Its origin is in the Torah (various places, starting with the Genesis), but the specific rules of Shabbat behavior come from the Talmud. Shabbat -- Saturday for Jews -- is the day of rest and prayer. When I say "rest", I don't mean it in the sense of doing whatever you feel like doing, but in the religious sense of the word, a rest from ordinary every-day existence that distracts people from the Divine. On Shabbat, observant Jews may not cook, do any work, perform chores, transact business or operate any machinery or electronics. Much is encompassed in the prohibition against "kindling or extinguishing fires" on Shabbat: it means that flipping a light switch or pushing an elevator button is forbidden. Even accidentally making a "spark" go off is a violation of Shabbat, so street lights with sensors that light up when you walk by are a problem, for example. Triggering an automatic door or operating an elevator are definitely violations of Shabbat.

Over the centuries, observant Jews have devised various ways to work around the limitations imposed by Shabbat. Timers, that turn lights, heat and dishwashers on and off on Saturdays, are a fixture in a Jewish home. Many buildings in Israel are simply open on Saturdays, with elevators simply riding up and down on a predetermined schedule and stopping on every floor. Strings are put around whole neighborhoods to convert them into "courtyards" that are exempt from the prohibition of carrying things or pushing strollers on Shabbat. One of the earliest ways of getting around the rigors of Shabbat was, of course, to ask or pay a Gentile to do things you aren't allowed to do. However, while this is generally permissible, it's also understood that this cannot become a "loophole" by a which an observant Jew can get out of Shabbat's harshest restrictions. Thus, there is some disagreement on to what degree a Gentile's help may be used to get around Shabbat, but it's still common to see arrangements such as the one in which you are working.
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Old 03-16-2009, 09:35 AM
 
Location: Wherever women are
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I can't imagine what they will do when they get the call of nature
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Old 03-16-2009, 10:33 AM
 
Location: Tulsa
2,529 posts, read 4,349,970 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redisca View Post
This custom is called the Sabbath (or Shabbat, or Shabbos). Its origin is in the Torah (various places, starting with the Genesis), but the specific rules of Shabbat behavior come from the Talmud. Shabbat -- Saturday for Jews -- is the day of rest and prayer. When I say "rest", I don't mean it in the sense of doing whatever you feel like doing, but in the religious sense of the word, a rest from ordinary every-day existence that distracts people from the Divine. On Shabbat, observant Jews may not cook, do any work, perform chores, transact business or operate any machinery or electronics. Much is encompassed in the prohibition against "kindling or extinguishing fires" on Shabbat: it means that flipping a light switch or pushing an elevator button is forbidden. Even accidentally making a "spark" go off is a violation of Shabbat, so street lights with sensors that light up when you walk by are a problem, for example. Triggering an automatic door or operating an elevator are definitely violations of Shabbat.

Over the centuries, observant Jews have devised various ways to work around the limitations imposed by Shabbat. Timers, that turn lights, heat and dishwashers on and off on Saturdays, are a fixture in a Jewish home. Many buildings in Israel are simply open on Saturdays, with elevators simply riding up and down on a predetermined schedule and stopping on every floor. Strings are put around whole neighborhoods to convert them into "courtyards" that are exempt from the prohibition of carrying things or pushing strollers on Shabbat. One of the earliest ways of getting around the rigors of Shabbat was, of course, to ask or pay a Gentile to do things you aren't allowed to do. However, while this is generally permissible, it's also understood that this cannot become a "loophole" by a which an observant Jew can get out of Shabbat's harshest restrictions. Thus, there is some disagreement on to what degree a Gentile's help may be used to get around Shabbat, but it's still common to see arrangements such as the one in which you are working.
Wow, that was really interesting! Thank you for taking the time to answer supernerdgirl!
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Old 03-16-2009, 10:47 AM
 
Location: PA
2,595 posts, read 4,438,779 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redisca View Post
This custom is called the Sabbath (or Shabbat, or Shabbos). Its origin is in the Torah (various places, starting with the Genesis), but the specific rules of Shabbat behavior come from the Talmud. Shabbat -- Saturday for Jews -- is the day of rest and prayer. When I say "rest", I don't mean it in the sense of doing whatever you feel like doing, but in the religious sense of the word, a rest from ordinary every-day existence that distracts people from the Divine. On Shabbat, observant Jews may not cook, do any work, perform chores, transact business or operate any machinery or electronics. Much is encompassed in the prohibition against "kindling or extinguishing fires" on Shabbat: it means that flipping a light switch or pushing an elevator button is forbidden. Even accidentally making a "spark" go off is a violation of Shabbat, so street lights with sensors that light up when you walk by are a problem, for example. Triggering an automatic door or operating an elevator are definitely violations of Shabbat.

Over the centuries, observant Jews have devised various ways to work around the limitations imposed by Shabbat. Timers, that turn lights, heat and dishwashers on and off on Saturdays, are a fixture in a Jewish home. Many buildings in Israel are simply open on Saturdays, with elevators simply riding up and down on a predetermined schedule and stopping on every floor. Strings are put around whole neighborhoods to convert them into "courtyards" that are exempt from the prohibition of carrying things or pushing strollers on Shabbat. One of the earliest ways of getting around the rigors of Shabbat was, of course, to ask or pay a Gentile to do things you aren't allowed to do. However, while this is generally permissible, it's also understood that this cannot become a "loophole" by a which an observant Jew can get out of Shabbat's harshest restrictions. Thus, there is some disagreement on to what degree a Gentile's help may be used to get around Shabbat, but it's still common to see arrangements such as the one in which you are working.
My Grandmother was from a poor family in the Ukraine. See was Jewish but was paid to kindle the fire and set the table for breakfast on the Sabath for a more well to do family. I wonder if God will punish her for performing these tasks on the Sabbath for other Jews. Or if God will punish this Jewish family for forcing another Jew to perform these task contrary to the law.
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Old 03-16-2009, 10:59 AM
 
998 posts, read 1,332,059 times
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Originally Posted by Nikk View Post
My Grandmother was from a poor family in the Ukraine. See was Jewish but was paid to kindle the fire and set the table for breakfast on the Sabath for a more well to do family. I wonder if God will punish her for performing these tasks on the Sabbath for other Jews. Or if God will punish this Jewish family for forcing another Jew to perform these task contrary to the law.
Unfortunately that is our human nature. We always try to find ways to bend the rules - even if the rule or law was set by God!
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Old 03-16-2009, 11:19 AM
 
3,631 posts, read 10,231,327 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redisca View Post
This custom is called the Sabbath (or Shabbat, or Shabbos). Its origin is in the Torah (various places, starting with the Genesis), but the specific rules of Shabbat behavior come from the Talmud. Shabbat -- Saturday for Jews -- is the day of rest and prayer. When I say "rest", I don't mean it in the sense of doing whatever you feel like doing, but in the religious sense of the word, a rest from ordinary every-day existence that distracts people from the Divine. On Shabbat, observant Jews may not cook, do any work, perform chores, transact business or operate any machinery or electronics. Much is encompassed in the prohibition against "kindling or extinguishing fires" on Shabbat: it means that flipping a light switch or pushing an elevator button is forbidden. Even accidentally making a "spark" go off is a violation of Shabbat, so street lights with sensors that light up when you walk by are a problem, for example. Triggering an automatic door or operating an elevator are definitely violations of Shabbat.

Over the centuries, observant Jews have devised various ways to work around the limitations imposed by Shabbat. Timers, that turn lights, heat and dishwashers on and off on Saturdays, are a fixture in a Jewish home. Many buildings in Israel are simply open on Saturdays, with elevators simply riding up and down on a predetermined schedule and stopping on every floor. Strings are put around whole neighborhoods to convert them into "courtyards" that are exempt from the prohibition of carrying things or pushing strollers on Shabbat. One of the earliest ways of getting around the rigors of Shabbat was, of course, to ask or pay a Gentile to do things you aren't allowed to do. However, while this is generally permissible, it's also understood that this cannot become a "loophole" by a which an observant Jew can get out of Shabbat's harshest restrictions. Thus, there is some disagreement on to what degree a Gentile's help may be used to get around Shabbat, but it's still common to see arrangements such as the one in which you are working.
thanks for the information! it makes more sense to me now.
now if you can just get me to understand Kosher food, i'd be set.
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Old 03-16-2009, 11:47 AM
 
3,486 posts, read 5,682,547 times
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Originally Posted by Nikk View Post
My Grandmother was from a poor family in the Ukraine. See was Jewish but was paid to kindle the fire and set the table for breakfast on the Sabath for a more well to do family. I wonder if God will punish her for performing these tasks on the Sabbath for other Jews. Or if God will punish this Jewish family for forcing another Jew to perform these task contrary to the law.
Did they know she was Jewish? And was she Halachically Jewish?
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Old 03-16-2009, 11:49 AM
 
3,486 posts, read 5,682,547 times
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Originally Posted by Colossus_Antonis View Post
I can't imagine what they will do when they get the call of nature
How is that a problem?
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Old 03-16-2009, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,050 posts, read 34,589,115 times
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Originally Posted by Redisca View Post
How is that a problem?
I think that his question was asked from a position in the gutter, if I may put it that way. Don't bother answering it.
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