Touring KC's urban core on the MAX and 51 bus lines (St. Louis: sales, transfer)

[xenokc]

For those visiting or metro suburban people accustomed to city buses who would like to do a weekend tour of the city on a city bus, there are two great lines to do this - the MAX (orange line) and the 51 bus.

Fares are $1.50 with a 2 hour transfer or $3 for a day pass. Insert/drop the fare in fare box next to the driver and s/he will push a button to pop out a transfer ticket - take it for next ride. Best to have exact change/bills. Swipe the ticket on fare box next time you get on the bus.

For those who have not ridden a bus, you need to pull the yellow line along the bus windows a block or so before the stop you want to get off of. As should be expected in any city, you'll likely be tagging along with street people on the bus through certain parts of the city. If unadventurous and/or that's not for you, don't bother reading further or spoil the thread by posting all about it. It is what it is.



There are two MAX lines - you want to take the Orange line down Main, not the Green line.

This line will take you to many of the major highlights including City Market, Downtown Loop/Power and Light, Xroads, Union Station, Crown Center, Art Museum District (Nelson and Kemper to the E of stop), Plaza - and there is an extend line that also goes to Plaza Library, UMKC, Brookside and Waldo (inner ring burbs).

Orange Line Map
http://www.kcata.org/images/uploads/maxmwk.gif



The 51 bus will get you through some cool urban/semi-urban hoods, mansions and a small mall further S KC. This goes from downtown (10th/Main) to W Side, Broadway, Uptown Theatre, Westport, W Plaza hoods, Ward Parkway mansions and Ward Parkway Mall (with a Trader Joes coming this summer). This line goes 90 blocks so can take a while if doing entire line.

51 Map
http://www.kcata.org/documents/routes/maps/51mwk.gif


I'd suggest metro residents start with the MAX line either in City Market on N side or Plaza or Waldo stops on the S side. For those new to the city, you might want to just ride the entire line your first outing to get a feel for the city.

Other metro bus maps/schedules can be found here..
http://www.kcata.org/maps_schedules/

See pics here of most of the districts you can hit...
What is there to do in Kansas City??? Lots! If you plan to visit KC, visit this thread first...

[ykamom]

I love this Xeno! Thanks for the info. Will give it to my son as an intro to getting around town on the bus!

[kcmo]

Good summary of MAX


YouTube - MAX Bus Rapid Transit

[xenokc]

Ugh, did you need to post such a dorky promo vid? Oh my sun gods of the Incas that's quite awful. It's just a freakin bus.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by xenokc

Ugh, did you need to post such a dorky promo vid? Oh my sun gods of the Incas that's quite awful. It's just a freakin bus.

[xenokc]

Sorry, late night overreaction. It does belong in the Wiki entry for 'lame promos' though - those scripted group reactions are just sad.

I use MAX regularly... it's basically just a bus that has arrival times posted at each stop. If it controlled the street lights as it was supposed to do, I'd rather have a MAX line down every main corridor running every 5-10 minutes than light rail that would only be down one corridor every 15.

Is effective but needs to control the street lights. Would be great to see MAX lines down State Line, SW Twfy, Broadway, Gilham, and major crosstown streets too. Commuter rail to the burbs would make more sense than light rail in the city.

[aragx6]

I can see your argument about more Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) lines which are obviously much cheaper than one light rail line. In a city like KC that has relatively little traffic BRT lines make a lot of sense. The only problem with them is this: People don't like buses. There's still a pretty significant general disdain for buses -- and that's true in nearly every city.

[xenokc]

If LRT were in the city it would be put down Main. That wouldn't do any good for your neighborhood. I was loosely involved with the LRT committee several years ago and saw the detailed CBA. The ongoing maintenance costs for just a few miles were unreal. They would've had to significantly cut other bus service to support it, which was happening in STL at the time. It just wasn't worth it.

Agreed that LRT attracts those timid to transit but if commuter rail were done first to the burbs, many would experiment with that and then obviously learn the bus system. Whether LRT or commuter, you still often rely on bus for starting or final connection.

I favor BRT for roads and LRT on dedicated paths, not sharing street lanes. For KC, we have so many rail lines, commuter rail makes more sense. But getting timeshare with freight and upgrading to passenger grade is another challenge.

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by xenokc

Sorry, late night overreaction. It does belong in the Wiki entry for 'lame promos' though - those scripted group reactions are just sad.

I use MAX regularly... it's basically just a bus that has arrival times posted at each stop. If it controlled the street lights as it was supposed to do, I'd rather have a MAX line down every main corridor running every 5-10 minutes than light rail that would only be down one corridor every 15.

Is effective but needs to control the street lights. Would be great to see MAX lines down State Line, SW Twfy, Broadway, Gilham, and major crosstown streets too. Commuter rail to the burbs would make more sense than light rail in the city.

No problem, I was just trying to show what the line looks like. Was hoping people can look past the dorky testimonials which are god awful terrible.

Originally Posted by aragx6

I can see your argument about more Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) lines which are obviously much cheaper than one light rail line. In a city like KC that has relatively little traffic BRT lines make a lot of sense. The only problem with them is this: People don't like buses. There's still a pretty significant general disdain for buses -- and that's true in nearly every city.

While this is true, I don't see a billion dollar light rail line worth the investment in KC. At least not any of the plans I have seen. It makes no sense to run full blown light rail trains down main street at 25 mph. Very few would ride it, probably no more than what rides MAX today. If the line jumps into its own right of way and also reached into the more congested suburban commuter corridors, I-70 or I-35, (not on city streets into the low density northland) that would make sense. But I have yet to see a LRT plan in KC that does makes any sense.

MAX works pretty well and does the job. Tourists use it all the time and seem to like it.

Having said that, MAX needs to be upgraded to a higher quality BRT system with larger articulated buses, off bus ticketing and more dedicated lanes and the shelters at major stops could be a bit larger. There are now some very popular modern BRT lines around the country that I would say do as well or better than Light Rail.

Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal

Whatever Samantha

[aragx6]

I don't disagree with you. There's a certain density required to make light rail worth it and with as spread out as KC is, that density doesn't seem to be there. And like I said, BRT works fine because there's few, if any, traffic delays.

The corridors along which Metro runs in St. Louis are significantly more dense, in addition to the fact that St. Louis simply has more downtown attractions. Beyond their daily 60,000+ ridership, Cardinals, Blues and Rams games draw a large number of riders (during which time traffic on highways and side streets actually is a significant detractor from driving) in addition to multiple larger downtown festivals including Fair St. Louis and First Night.

It should also be noted that, while St. Louisans were initially reticent to pay for public transit, there's been a real shift in the collective thinking in recent years. The service cuts you mentioned xeno were put in play in 2008-2009 because of a half cent sales tax initiative that failed.

However, with increased education, a large campaign and a change of heart from, particularly, county residents, when the initiave was put back on the ballot in 2010 it passed decisively -- by more than 60% if I recall correctly.