Kansas City development and construction thread (Overland, Center: lease, living, to move)

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by gfisch95

Isn't a lot of the reason for the design we have to try to maintain the view of the P&L Building in the skyline? I thought that was why they went with the skinny tower off to the side instead of a more filled out design.

Sure, I get that, but they could do something a little more in line with 2016. Maybe the renderings are not what it will look like. I hope not.

Here is another hotel tower going up in Austin that as a similar thin side with a wide side to preserve the view of the P&L tower. It has a pretty boring design, but at least its modern looking.

[shindig]

I like the Hyatt design along with the one you posted above. For a hotel, I don't want it to look like a standard, modern office tower. The geometric pattern/design is kind of different, although it might look a little boring from a distance, but up close, I think it will look be pretty dramatic.

[Anzacosf]

Originally Posted by kcmo

Sure, I get that, but they could do something a little more in line with 2016. Maybe the renderings are not what it will look like. I hope not.

Here is another hotel tower going up in Austin that as a similar thin side with a wide side to preserve the view of the P&L tower. It has a pretty boring design, but at least its modern looking.

I don't think it will look 1970ish at all. I agree they could have done a better job in the rendering. Overall, it seems like it will be all glass while staying away from looking like an office tower. The Austin is rather boring than elegant. I think it will match the Kauffman center in terms of color while still able to give the impression of a glass tower at night.

[kcmo]

The night rendering looks good. So maybe the rendering I posted above is just off a bit.

[kcmo]

Another older office building goes residential (except first two floors). You would think that will all the office towers that have gone residential, that downtown would see demand for new modern office towers.

http://www.bizjournals.com/kansascit...f&t=1456521785

[adebord]

I honestly hope it all goes residential. It will help avoid the problem of a "9-5" downtown like wilimington delaware has.

[rwiksell]

Originally Posted by adebord

I honestly hope it all goes residential. It will help avoid the problem of a "9-5" downtown like wilimington delaware has.

Do you know the first thing about downtown KC? Or about downtowns in general?

Kansas City's downtown is not having any trouble with night life. Combine that with the residential boom already going on, and there is no risk of it being a "9-5" downtown.

However, if all the offices leave, it removes a lot of the ongoing incentive for people to live downtown. It's not sustainable if it's not a mixed-use neighborhood; it will just be the place a bunch of young people want to live to be close to the bars and theaters.

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by adebord

I honestly hope it all goes residential. It will help avoid the problem of a "9-5" downtown like wilimington delaware has.

That's fine so long as they start to replace all the lost office space with modern class A office towers. I think class A space downtown does very well, it's class B and C space that has problems and those are the buildings going residential. Downtown KC seriously lacks modern class A office space. The last multi tenant building to go up downtown (1201 Walnut) was built in 1990. That is almost three decades ago!!!!

The main problem is that KC doesn't have developers that are willing to do spec office towers. Combine that with the fact that local companies are more interested in suburban office parks and KC has had a terrible net loss of downtown employment over the past 20 years. If it were not for the federal government, Downtown KC would have a workforce smaller than towns like Tulsa or Little Rock today. It's that bad.

KC has fixed one problem (lack of residential) yet created another problem (all those new residents are having to commute to suburban jobs). Downtown KC needs to have a good mix of jobs, residents, hotel room and entertainment. Residents and hotel rooms are starting to catch up, but KC has lost more downtown jobs in the past 20 years than any other major downtown except San Antonino even after a multi billion dollar transformation of the downtown.

Right now the best that KC can hope for is an out of town developer notices that KC has an attractive downtown that has not seen a new class A office tower go up three decades and build something in KC. I believe spec tower would fill up in rather quickly in downtown KC, but nobody in KC will build one, they are too busy raping the states of MO and KS for incentives to build in suburban greenfields to even consider downtown. Till developers stop getting massive incentives to build in western KCK, western Lenexa, southern Overland Park and Leawood, KCMO has almost no chance of seeing new downtown office space and that will eventually slow growth in other areas (hotels, residential etc).

[shindig]

Originally Posted by kcmo

That's fine so long as they start to replace all the lost office space with modern class A office towers. I think class A space downtown does very well, it's class B and C space that has problems and those are the buildings going residential. Downtown KC seriously lacks modern class A office space. The last multi tenant building to go up downtown (1201 Walnut) was built in 1990. That is almost three decades ago!!!!

The main problem is that KC doesn't have developers that are willing to do spec office towers. Combine that with the fact that local companies are more interested in suburban office parks and KC has had a terrible net loss of downtown employment over the past 20 years. If it were not for the federal government, Downtown KC would have a workforce smaller than towns like Tulsa or Little Rock today. It's that bad.

KC has fixed one problem (lack of residential) yet created another problem (all those new residents are having to commute to suburban jobs). Downtown KC needs to have a good mix of jobs, residents, hotel room and entertainment. Residents and hotel rooms are starting to catch up, but KC has lost more downtown jobs in the past 20 years than any other major downtown except San Antonino even after a multi billion dollar transformation of the downtown.

Right now the best that KC can hope for is an out of town developer notices that KC has an attractive downtown that has not seen a new class A office tower go up three decades and build something in KC. I believe spec tower would fill up in rather quickly in downtown KC, but nobody in KC will build one, they are too busy raping the states of MO and KS for incentives to build in suburban greenfields to even consider downtown. Till developers stop getting massive incentives to build in western KCK, western Lenexa, southern Overland Park and Leawood, KCMO has almost no chance of seeing new downtown office space and that will eventually slow growth in other areas (hotels, residential etc).

I think a new office tower will break ground in downtown KC within a couple years. Denver is building their first spec tower since the early 1980's 🙀. That's longer than KC. Denver has had several new hotels and apartment/condo towers, but really no new commercial and that city has been building like crazy for the last 10-15 years. It will happen, just takes time

[kcmo]

Are you sure about Denver? I know they are building a very large tower and it's been a long time, but I think Downtown Denver has seen quite a bit of office space go up, they just have not been 40 story buildings. Maybe they were not spec. Either way, KC has not seen much of anything except the 17 story H&R Block building. So hopefully you are right and KC does get something in the next few years and hopefully it's something larger than 15-20 stories. I don't think many cities have lost as much office space to residential as KC has. I doubt any city has actually. I get the 1930's buildings, but KC has been losing many somewhat modern buildings as well like Wallstreet Tower, Commerce Tower, 10 Main, now Traders on Grand etc.

I don't really get it. Office space is being converted to residential at a ridiculous rate and yet there is almost no activity for new office. KC does not even see proposals or renderings. Most other cities at least have proposals for very large downtown office towers. Most cities, even smaller cities like OKC, Omaha, Milwaukee etc as well as rustbelt cities like Cincy, Cleveland and Pittsburgh have seen major new office towers go up.

The only remotely possible proposal is the copaken-brooks tower near sprint center and I will give them about a 5% chance of completing that.

Cerner Cerner Cerner...KC could be gong through a skyline changing Comcast-Philly or Amazon-Seattle scenario right now. Why why why can't Cerner have just a small presence downtown. A small presence could be one or two 40 story towers for them and it would do so much for downtown.