Property and income taxes seem high? (Lee's Summit, Washington: sales, vehicle registration, health insurance)

[tcbelvis]

Been offered a job in KCMO. I am a little shocked to read what the tax rates are, especially income and property. I have read MO is one of the lowest cost of living states? So is everything else inexpensive? Auto and home insurance etc? I believe I read gas tax is low. Is a person able to save money elsewhere beyond taxes? Thank you for the good info here on neighborhoods!

[Okey Dokie]

I guess the tax rates are relative. Pretty low if you’re comparing to Illinois or New York. Be aware that although Missouri gas tax is one of the lowest in the nation, there is a 10 cent increase (inplemented over several years) on the ballot next month. Whether that passes or not, I don’t know.

[Bluefox]

Originally Posted by tcbelvis

Been offered a job in KCMO. I am a little shocked to read what the tax rates are, especially income and property. I have read MO is one of the lowest cost of living states? So is everything else inexpensive? Auto and home insurance etc? I believe I read gas tax is low. Is a person able to save money elsewhere beyond taxes? Thank you for the good info here on neighborhoods!

Also look into the local 1% e-tax if you live or work in KCMO. Local taxing districts in KC often have sales tax rates of as high as 11% though officially the state tax rate is much lower. And if you own a car or boat you must pay a personal property tax annually.

They nickel and dime you in this area, that’s for sure.

[kcmo]

Taxes in metro KC are very high. And you get very little in return for such high taxes. Mostly a lot of corporate welfare.

Annual property taxes on everything, not just homes. If you have a couple of cars, a boat etc this can be big payment every year.

Sales taxes that are absurdly high. Not only are sales taxes already pretty high for non major coast city, most developments people shop at in metro KC have additional development taxes that are only there to subsidize the retail development you are shopping at. Pretty much every retail center in metro KC from suburban Walmarts to the plaza to Oak Park Mall is subsidized by local sales taxes at the minimum, many are subsidized by supertiffs, star bonds, etc as well. Apparently retail must be subsidized by the government in order to operate anywhere in the KC area, even affluent suburbs.

KCMO does have the Etax too, but in general, KCMO does have lower taxes overall than places like KCK, JoCo, Lee's Summit etc, so it's actually not a big deal unless you live in KCMO city limits of Platte County or something where you get hit by high county taxes too. A good chunk of KCMO etax is paid by non KCMO residents (that live in high tax suburbs), so if it were not for the E tax, KCMO's other taxes would be much higher. If you work in KCMo, may as well live there. You have to pay the etax anyway and collectively taxes will be lower if you live there vs living in most suburbs and also pay the etax (plus trash pickup etc).

Utility taxes are high in metro KC. I think one main reason for this is because the infrastructure of the metro is just so spread out, making it less efficient and more costly to maintain.

And you really don't get a lot in return. Metro KC does not spend a lot of money on transit, highways, recreation, parks etc, not nearly as much as most similar sized or larger metro areas. Most commercial development in metro KC don't pay jack in taxes either (office development, hotels, factories etc). Its all heavily subsidized. Nearly every single office building, hotel etc in metro KC is subsidized, some are funded over 50% by state and local tax revenue, again even in affluent growing suburban areas. So much of the tax burden falls on the individual tax payers and residential. So high taxes, little in return.

Compared to Maryland:

My home, car and family health insurance all either stayed about the same or went down when I moved to Maryland.
In MD and VA, sales taxes are never more than 5-6% no matter where you shop. There are very few places that add on extra taxes like they do in KC. And much of our taxes go to transit, parks etc. I would pay a higher tax for more investment in transit, recreation etc.

You pay more in state and local income taxes I think, although not much more. Most counties in DC metro have an etax of 1-3% for example and state income taxes are slightly higher.

You pay more for gas I think (but I honestly don't pay attention to gas prices much).

You pay more in tolls. Depending on where you live, tolls can be a pretty big expense.

You pay more for groceries.

YOU PAY MORE FOR HOUSING. This is the big one. A 150k home in metro KC is 450k in metro DC and the property taxes are relative, so you pay more in property taxes (even though the actual rates are similar if now lower). In VA you pay property taxes on vehicles on top of high housing cost (ouch). No car tax in MD. (you do have emissions taxes which are minimal).

Traffic camera are EVERYWHERE. Speed cameras, toll cameras, stop sign cameras, red light cameras, school bus cameras etc. So you will on average pay more for camera tickets.

Parking tickets are a part of life out here. If you don't get at least a couple a year, you are doing something wrong. And parking tickets are not $35 out here.

Speaking of parking. You will pay hundreds of dollars more per year in parking fees than you do in KC.

So bottom line is, while local sales and property taxes are very high in metro KC. At the end of the day, it's still much cheaper to live there. But at the same time, you do sort of get what you pay for. It would be hard for me to give up all that this area offers just to save a few hundred dollars a year. In KC you are pretty much paying to subsidize development and businesses and not much goes to infrastructure, highways, parks, recreation etc. I don't think most people in KC realize how many parks, bike trails etc there are in most bigger cities.

Regardless, KC is maxed out on sales taxes now and will have a very difficult time raising revenue for anything in the future to fund the things sales taxes should actually be funding.

[Bluefox]

Originally Posted by kcmo

Taxes in metro KC are very high. And you get very little in return for such high taxes. Mostly a lot of corporate welfare.

Annual property taxes on everything, not just homes. If you have a couple of cars, a boat etc this can be big payment every year.

Sales taxes that are absurdly high. Not only are sales taxes already pretty high for non major coast city, most developments people shop at in metro KC have additional development taxes that are only there to subsidize the retail development you are shopping at. Pretty much every retail center in metro KC from suburban Walmarts to the plaza to Oak Park Mall is subsidized by local sales taxes at the minimum, many are subsidized by supertiffs, star bonds, etc as well. Apparently retail must be subsidized by the government in order to operate anywhere in the KC area, even affluent suburbs.

KCMO does have the Etax too, but in general, KCMO does have lower taxes overall than places like KCK, JoCo, Lee's Summit etc, so it's actually not a big deal unless you live in KCMO city limits of Platte County or something where you get hit by high county taxes too. A good chunk of KCMO etax is paid by non KCMO residents (that live in high tax suburbs), so if it were not for the E tax, KCMO's other taxes would be much higher. If you work in KCMo, may as well live there. You have to pay the etax anyway and collectively taxes will be lower if you live there vs living in most suburbs and also pay the etax (plus trash pickup etc).

Utility taxes are high in metro KC. I think one main reason for this is because the infrastructure of the metro is just so spread out, making it less efficient and more costly to maintain.

And you really don't get a lot in return. Metro KC does not spend a lot of money on transit, highways, recreation, parks etc, not nearly as much as most similar sized or larger metro areas. Most commercial development in metro KC don't pay jack in taxes either (office development, hotels, factories etc). Its all heavily subsidized. Nearly every single office building, hotel etc in metro KC is subsidized, some are funded over 50% by state and local tax revenue, again even in affluent growing suburban areas. So much of the tax burden falls on the individual tax payers and residential. So high taxes, little in return.

Compared to Maryland:

My home, car and family health insurance all either stayed about the same or went down when I moved to Maryland.
In MD and VA, sales taxes are never more than 5-6% no matter where you shop. There are very few places that add on extra taxes like they do in KC. And much of our taxes go to transit, parks etc. I would pay a higher tax for more investment in transit, recreation etc.

You pay more in state and local income taxes I think, although not much more. Most counties in DC metro have an etax of 1-3% for example and state income taxes are slightly higher.

You pay more for gas I think (but I honestly don't pay attention to gas prices much).

You pay more in tolls. Depending on where you live, tolls can be a pretty big expense.

You pay more for groceries.

YOU PAY MORE FOR HOUSING. This is the big one. A 150k home in metro KC is 450k in metro DC and the property taxes are relative, so you pay more in property taxes (even though the actual rates are similar if now lower). In VA you pay property taxes on vehicles on top of high housing cost (ouch). No car tax in MD. (you do have emissions taxes which are minimal).

Traffic camera are EVERYWHERE. Speed cameras, toll cameras, stop sign cameras, red light cameras, school bus cameras etc. So you will on average pay more for camera tickets.

Parking tickets are a part of life out here. If you don't get at least a couple a year, you are doing something wrong. And parking tickets are not $35 out here.

Speaking of parking. You will pay hundreds of dollars more per year in parking fees than you do in KC.

So bottom line is, while local sales and property taxes are very high in metro KC. At the end of the day, it's still much cheaper to live there. But at the same time, you do sort of get what you pay for. It would be hard for me to give up all that this area offers just to save a few hundred dollars a year. In KC you are pretty much paying to subsidize development and businesses and not much goes to infrastructure, highways, parks, recreation etc. I don't think most people in KC realize how many parks, bike trails etc there are in most bigger cities.

Regardless, KC is maxed out on sales taxes now and will have a very difficult time raising revenue for anything in the future to fund the things sales taxes should actually be funding.

Another excellent post, kcmo. Much of what you said about Maryland is also true for Washington. Housing is expensive, way higher than KC, but property taxes are lower. I also don’t mind the 10% sales tax (which is actually less than I was paying in my Northland taxing district) and high vehicle registration fees because I pay zero state income tax, zero local income tax, zero tax on groceries, and zero personal property tax. And somehow, the services are absolutely superior to what I had in KC.

Even factoring the cost of living, including housing, my discretionary income is higher here (with a modest locality pay increase for living in the Seattle metro).

One thing that was much cheaper in MO was auto insurance.

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by Bluefox

Even factoring the cost of living, including housing, my discretionary income is higher here (with a modest locality pay increase for living in the Seattle metro).

Same here. Incomes are higher here, so we actually come out ahead. I really need to get out to Seattle, it's been several years since I have been there.

[tcbelvis]

Thank you all, it seems that most of my research is accurate. A lot to consider when making the decision on what to do.