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Is that a better title? I'll let others decide how stupid it is. But I'm sure this will be brushed under the rug.
I will tell you this. If Maryland or Virginia were to pay out close to 100 million to move two companies and 800 employees from the District to a nearby suburb, all hell would break loose. The people here would be in an uproar, including myself. But then again, the people don’t hate other regional cities like the KC area. While there is a fair amount of competition, there is also a level of respect at the same time. People in the suburbs around DC and Balt don’t hate the cities with near the aggression they do in KC and DC and Balt probably have more reasons to be hated than KCMO does.
But if DC were like KC, there would be no metro rail crossing county and state lines etc.
If Kansas tax payers don’t see a problem with this then whatever I guess, but I would think they wouldn’t be cutting services or raising taxes if they can do this and KCMO has got to find a way to fight back and that may mean charging Kansans extra for everything they use in KCMO. Either way, look for this to get worse before it gets better. MO is going to have to be just as stupid as Kansas to get the point across. When a company like Garmen or Black & Veatch is poached to KCMO with like 300 million in incentives, it might just wake up Kansas, even though the entire metro area will lose.
Anyway. I see nothing wrong with this post after I corrected the title.
After 47 million to steal AMC from KCMO, reports are now coming out that KS (along with Overland Park incentives) has given 41.2 million to steal Teva from KCMO.
Kansas is paying in excess of $100,000 per employee to move from across state line within the metro. Chances are nobody will move to Kansas in these deals and because of all the incentives, these new employees won't pay much in new taxes to Kansas, let alone anywhere near 100,000 per employee. Even if they did, it would take decades, if it's even possible, to pay that much money back via state and city taxes.
Wow.
Link
http://www.kansascity.com/2012/05/04/3594146/kansas-pitching-in-nearly-31-million.html (broken link)
At the same time, Missouri is about to strike back BIG TIME and give Kansas a taste of its own medicine.
Missouri is about to pass legislation that will give MO side leaders the ability to spend 1.5 times the amount that KS spends on poaching.
I feel so sorry for KC area residents. Your corporate tax base is quickly eroding.
VA may not pay companies directly but they do forgo the applicable taxes for years to entice companies to relocate.
MD does much the same, especially on a County level. My home County just gave up close to $100M in property taxes over the next 30 years in order to convince Constellation Energy to build a third reactor at the Calvert Cliffs Nuclear Power Plant.
The MD Legislature just passed what amounts to a tax on electric bills to give to companies so they'll develop off-shore wind power facilities.
VA may not pay companies directly but they do forgo the applicable taxes for years to entice companies to relocate.
MD does much the same, especially on a County level. My home County just gave up close to $100M in property taxes over the next 30 years in order to convince Constellation Energy to build a third reactor at the Calvert Cliffs Nuclear Power Plant.
The MD Legislature just passed what amounts to a tax on electric bills to give to companies so they'll develop off-shore wind power facilities.
Thank you. Rep point coming your way!
I wonder if KCMO has been complaining as loudly about what is happening in his backyard as loudly as he has been complaining about stuff happening in a place he hasn't lived in for sometime. I somehow doubt it.
I wonder if KCMO has been complaining as loudly about what is happening in his backyard as loudly as he has been complaining about stuff happening in a place he hasn't lived in for sometime. I somehow doubt it.
Pretty big difference between subsidzing green issues vs poaching companies across county and state lines in same metro area.
VA may not pay companies directly but they do forgo the applicable taxes for years to entice companies to relocate.
MD does much the same, especially on a County level. My home County just gave up close to $100M in property taxes over the next 30 years in order to convince Constellation Energy to build a third reactor at the Calvert Cliffs Nuclear Power Plant.
The MD Legislature just passed what amounts to a tax on electric bills to give to companies so they'll develop off-shore wind power facilities.
I follow business very closely in the DC area and I have yet to see anything that even remotely compares to what is going on in KC. Nothing at all.
I already mentioned, that you will sometimes see tax breaks. Like property tax breaks etc. You rarely see a city hand out a tif in MD or VA, let alone the state hand out a tif (star bonds as they are called in KS).
What's going on in Kansas is WAY beyond even tifs. The state of Kansas is FRONTING companies tens of millions of dollars in CASH to move only a few miles from KCMO across the state line.
The state of Maryland wants to subsidize alternative energy and while I'm not going to take a side on that, I'm not sure it's a terrible idea to pay a little extra a month to make wind power work vs fossil fuels. Also, while utility customers might pay more to subsidize off shore windmills, the main reason the state is giving the power plant a tax break is too help keep utility rates low. None of that has a thing to do with what is going on in KC.
Find me an example of a suburban county in DC or Baltimore paying in excess of $100,000 per employee to lure a company a few miles from the city into a suburb. You won't even find an example of 20k per employee or 5k and if you even find that, it will generally be to relocate a company from hundreds or even thousands of miles away.
... of course nobody in Kansas wanted anything to do with it, but it might give you some perspective of just how unique and absurd Kansas is being with incentives.
If Maryland and a city that borders DC like Silver Spring or Bethesda were to lure a 400 person company from central DC with 50 million in incentives, I guarantee you that the press and local politicians would open a huge can of worms and before it was over, everybody from Congress to the FBI would be involved looking into anything that might even hint at something corrupt going on. Even no laws were broken, laws would be passed to prevent such a waste of tax money in the future. Not to mention the breakdown in regional cooperation that would follow such aggression by a suburban city/state. If you keep up with DC news, you would agree with this.
Right, but try to put it in perspective. Here is the post I referenced above, which actually addresses the Northrop Grumman move. I never said it doesn't happen in metro DC. I said what goes on in DC is peanuts compared to KC.
I wanted to show these articles to people in KC because I think it really puts into perspective what's going on in KC with the economic development war that that Kansas has declared on Missouri and just how destructive and unproductive this is to not only Missouri, but Kansas as well. It's a definite net loss for metro KC for sure.
Here in the DC/Balt area, economic development is as fierce as any place in the country. You have the central cities of DC and Baltimore competing with some of the most powerful corporate suburban counties in the nation and the metro as a whole is competing with every large metro in the country and the world.
If people think KC has issues with political boundaries, imagine what it's like in DC where ALL your suburbs are in TWO different states that are totally independent from the city.
These suburbs are not not all that different than those in KC. Family oriented, cheaper, more land to work and they all want economic development.
The numbers thrown around out here are so low compared to what I'm used to in KC that I always have to read them twice and remember, that economic activity in this region is probably triple that of KC. For example, 500 jobs and a ten year lease in metro DC is going to generate far higher eco development numbers due to much higher salaries and cost of doing business.
So the next time Kansas offers 30 million to bring 200 jobs across state line from KCMO, think about what they are doing and just how out of the ordinary such practice really is.
Now this is an extreme example because most of the time, no or very little incentives are offered. This firm MOVED FROM LA to the DC area. You see, you won't see such aggressive incentives to lure a company from VA to MD or DC to VA or DC to MD It doesn't happen. I also don't see it happening in Baltimore and its suburbs. Actually, Downtown Baltimore seems to be the premier choice for Baltimore area companies, but if they do move to Townson or something, it's not because they were lured with tons of cash.
Yet, the incentives offered here to bring a new company HQ to metro DC from LA are far less than the 47 million Kansas has offered to AMC to move across state line. I mean, this is like AMC hitting the lottery, it will be difficult for them to say no and even more difficult for Missouri to even attempt to keep them. (as I have already stated many times).
Lets compare!
14 million for 400 jobs (200k salary) from LA to metro DC.
47 million for 400 jobs (60k salary) from KCMO to suburban KS.
The other article I posted goes on to say:
So, to bring a new company headquarters all the way across the country and its 400 high paying jobs (200k plus average), VA hands out 12-14 million which dwarfs other recent incentive packages to bring in new companies.
All while kansas REGULARLY hands out TENS OF MILLIONS to lure a company from as little as 5-10 miles away within the same metro.
How can anybody find any reason to defend this? It's not sustainable and the real sad thing is that even though Kansas looks like the king of offering ridiculous amounts of corporate welfare, they get few takers that are not already in their backyard. That says a whole lot to me about just how desirable KS really is.
Kansas wants to expand PEAK to companies that are in Kansas too (not just those bringing in jobs from far away places like KCMO). Crazy. What's next, letting anybody and everybody use STAR bonds to subsidize greenfield development? (oh snap!)
And people wonder why taxes are so high in KS and you get so little in return. Expect that trend to continue.
But maybe a few people have gone to see the wizard of oz and found their brain...
BTW, I don't agree with what VA or MD do either. I think it's all corporate welfare. Kansas just takes it to an all new level and in the process they are harming the very city that gives their largest county a reason to exist in the first place. Without KCMO, what is Kansas?? It's Wichita, Topeka and a couple of college towns. Why bite the hand that feeds you? Kansas is pissing off the state of Missouri and Missouri has a much larger economy and if they really wanted to they could really inflict some serious harm on Kansas.
Well, Missouri has been backed into a corner for too long and they are about go to war with Kansas economically. They have tried and tried to be nice, but it's looking like that is no longer an option.
Such a war will not be good for individual tax payers in MO or KS. This all seems like common sense to me. But I guess it's more difficult to comprehend than I think it is.
Pretty big difference between subsidzing green issues vs poaching companies across county and state lines in same metro area.
If this is over your head, I understand though.
Again with the accusations of stupidity. I understand poaching from one's neighboring state, within one's own metro, quite well. I agree that it is inappropriate and destructive to the metro as a whole. I am a Democrat who votes against the state level politicians who promote crap like this. I technically am not within the KC metro.
I like some of your posts, like the ones on the school systems in the Metro, etc.
But, threads like this one really make me and many other posters not care for you too much. Say what you have to say without being such an ***.
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