Back for Another Visit, My Take On Johnson City (Knoxville: 2015, apartment)

[Rangerred]

Your main savings in TN are going to be on property taxes and vehicle registration. There will be some savings on gasoline. Much of it just depends on where you are coming from and your current income. The lack of an income tax can be very helpful if you have a high income. Lower income, not so much. Sales taxes are very regressive.

[DaveinMtAiry]

I know there was a thread about this but I was wondering about utility costs. We currently pay, negotiated deal by threatening to move to DirecTV, about $150/month for cable/internet with HD and one DVR. Our electricity rates are around 9 cents per KWH. We have a well/septic so I have no idea what water/swear bills would cost.

[wombattver]

Originally Posted by DaveinMtAiry

OK my test is compete. To review I purchased 7 non-perishable items in Roanoke, then the same list in Johnson City and finally back home in Mount Airy, Maryland as a way of comparing grocery costs.

My list in Roanoke totalled 12.80. When I got home and bought the same list the total came to....wait for it....12.80. Every single item was the exact same price, how weird is that? Now the worst part, once I added tax and accounted for the full price of items that were on sale when I bought them in JC the total came to 14.10.

Very surprising and disappointing that my grocery bill either be the same or 10% higher with a move south.

My grocery bill is MUCH higher here, but I came from AZ and the groceries (and especially produce) there are much cheaper and without tax. I even compared my year's worth of gas and electric bills to see how the crazy high air-con bills in AZ would stack up. Over the whole year, it came out nearly even, within $40 or so. That surprised me, but I guess the heat used in winter here equaled the air-con use in AZ summer. And I generally like a colder house in winter whereas I can't cut back on my precious air-con!

You may also be a bit disappointed with grocery selection (or lack of) here. I've often had a hard time finding things that I don't think are all that exotic. However, with Whole Foods and ALdi's it seems to be getting better.

[Serious Conversation]

Originally Posted by DaveinMtAiry

I know there was a thread about this but I was wondering about utility costs. We currently pay, negotiated deal by threatening to move to DirecTV, about $150/month for cable/internet with HD and one DVR. Our electricity rates are around 9 cents per KWH. We have a well/septic so I have no idea what water/swear bills would cost.

A "package" like cable/internet is virtually the same about everywhere you go. We had Charter back home, I had Mediacom when I went to Iowa, and now I have Comcast in Indiana. Charter and Comcast are pretty much tit for tat in pricing and speed. These days both are probably over 99.9% uptime. Unless you're in the sticks somewhere, I think internet is pretty much a wash anywhere where there isn't high grame FiOS or Google Fiber.I don't think you'll find a major difference with these national conglomerates.

Electricity is cheaper by KWH in TN than what I pay now, but I don't recall by how much. It is noticeable.

Originally Posted by Rangerred

Your main savings in TN are going to be on property taxes and vehicle registration. There will be some savings on gasoline. Much of it just depends on where you are coming from and your current income. The lack of an income tax can be very helpful if you have a high income. Lower income, not so much. Sales taxes are very regressive.

Agreed, though I'd rather pay the sales tax than an income tax. To some degree, I can throttle my consumption, or even avoid TN tax altogether with a lot of craiglist purchases, yard sales, etc, or just shopping in Virginia. An income tax is much harder and less practical to avoid.

Originally Posted by wombattver

My grocery bill is MUCH higher here, but I came from AZ and the groceries (and especially produce) there are much cheaper and without tax. I even compared my year's worth of gas and electric bills to see how the crazy high air-con bills in AZ would stack up. Over the whole year, it came out nearly even, within $40 or so. That surprised me, but I guess the heat used in winter here equaled the air-con use in AZ summer. And I generally like a colder house in winter whereas I can't cut back on my precious air-con!

You may also be a bit disappointed with grocery selection (or lack of) here. I've often had a hard time finding things that I don't think are all that exotic. However, with Whole Foods and ALdi's it seems to be getting better.

Also agree on the grocery costs. We've had many discussions on grocery prices in the Tri-Cities on this forum and there are valid theories out there, but I'm not a grocery insider and have no idea how true they are. Regardless, I've found grocery prices for basic staples higher in the Tri-Cities than virtually anywhere else I've lived, and the selection has lacked compared to bigger cities. When I go back home every month to six weeks and grab a few snacks at Food City, it's pretty apparent. I'm not a picky eater, eat mostly simple foods, and don't cook anything exotic at home, but the grocery selection, even at the farmer's market, lacks compared to what I'm used to now.

Whole Foods is not yet in the Tri-Cities. Johnson City has the Fresh Market and Earth Fare, which cater to the Whole Foods crowd, but are a poor imitation of Whole Foods IMO.

[DaveinMtAiry]

Originally Posted by Serious Conversation

Agreed, though I'd rather pay the sales tax than an income tax. To some degree, I can throttle my consumption, or even avoid TN tax altogether with a lot of craiglist purchases, yard sales, etc, or just shopping in Virginia. An income tax is much harder and less practical to avoid.

That's the way I've approached this whole thing. There is nothing you can do about property/income tax. But you can control sales tax in a number of ways. Things get tight and Starbucks becomes Folgers in a hurry if it has to be that way.

As for selection not a big fan of Whole Paycheck but I do occasionally need more than the local store. I did notice the knockoff in JC, Earth Fair I believe, and that would probably fill me needs.

[Rangerred]

Not sure I'd call Earth Fare a Whole Foods knockoff as it is an Asheville-based chain with about 35 stores across the Eastern US. It does attract the same shoppers as Whole Foods but I think their prices are better and they tend to have more of a local focus.

I usually get all the staples at Kroger (they, IMO, have the best prices, selection, and quality in JC) with trips to Aldi, Fresh Market, and Earth Fare to get more of the specialty-type items. The best part is all four are located less than a mile from one another in South JC. Another plus to living on this side of town.

[NY Annie]

I moved from Staten Island (NYC) to sw TN. Selection is non existent, prices are much higher, and there's far fewer shopping choices. And the reason whether here in SW TN or in NE TN is the same: lack of competition which is a result of lack of shoppers.

In the northeast, there are always lines in the supermarket. ALWAYS - well, maybe not at 3 am. There are not enough stores for too many people. That is a plus for the markets - volume in people equals volume in sales. The stores up north can charge less because they get volume discounts: they can have more selection because it all gets sold. The sales prices are phenomenal up north; down here quite pathetic.

Even the "local" SAM's has prices not much different than the supermarkets and the choices are....oh wait, there's fewer choices.

I have yet to find manicotti stuffed and frozen; can't always find the dry manicotti either - so one makes it at home. (Just one example)

But the COL is far less expensive overall. It's an exchange.

[wombattver]

Originally Posted by Serious Conversation

Whole Foods is not yet in the Tri-Cities. Johnson City has the Fresh Market and Earth Fare, which cater to the Whole Foods crowd, but are a poor imitation of Whole Foods IMO.

Oops, you're right - I was thinking of Earth Fare!

[wombattver]

As NY Annie wrote - "lack of competition which is a result of lack of shoppers" makes sense but it brings me to another question: HOW does Johnson City support all these medical facilities/offices/specialists?!

Hope I'm not hijacking the thread. I've only lived here a year and realize that the medical industry is big here, but it still seems like JC/Tri-cities wouldn't have enough population to support all that's here. Is it due to the ETSU med school? Do these facilities attract many people from outside this area to come here for treatment? I've lived in big cities and suburbs of them, but can't remember ever seeing this many medical facilities just driving around day to day.

[Serious Conversation]

Originally Posted by wombattver

As NY Annie wrote - "lack of competition which is a result of lack of shoppers" makes sense but it brings me to another question: HOW does Johnson City support all these medical facilities/offices/specialists?!

Hope I'm not hijacking the thread. I've only lived here a year and realize that the medical industry is big here, but it still seems like JC/Tri-cities wouldn't have enough population to support all that's here. Is it due to the ETSU med school? Do these facilities attract many people from outside this area to come here for treatment? I've lived in big cities and suburbs of them, but can't remember ever seeing this many medical facilities just driving around day to day.

You also need to remember the Tri-Cities is the biggest area within driving distance for a lot of folks in southwest VA, eastern KY, TN until you get closer to Knoxville, and maybe parts of NC. That's a lot of people who aren't in the metro, but effectively are a part of the Tri-Cities for their "big city" needs.

I think the medical school is part of the reason the facilities are in Johnson City, but the area (aside from Johnson City obviously) skews older than average and older people need a lot of medical treatment.