The Pinnacle in Bristol, TN (Knoxville, Johnson City: for sale, movers, credit card)

[noneyabusiness]

I was just reading an updated article posted on tricities.com about the pinnacle. It announced some of the smaller tenants and of interest it brought up two unannounced anchor tenants. If anybody wants to read the article visit the link below. Any guesses on who the two might be?

Officials expecting city, region to reach 'new level' with The Pinnacle - TriCities.com: News

[Rangerred]

I'm generally the positive one here but I have a hard time seeing this development having long-term success. The whole idea of an auto-centric development located on the outskirts of a city is hopelessly outdated. Plus, other than Bass Pro, there is really no store that is not already located in the Tri-Cities. This quote from the developer about this being a regional attraction makes me lol:

“The whole mentality behind this project was to take advantage of the strength of the market,” Johnson said. “This is not a Bristol deal, not a Kingsport deal and not a Johnson City deal. The Pinnacle is designed to take advantage of the combined MSA [metropolitan statistical area] of a half-million people. In the process of doing that, we’ve increased the trade area by so much more.”
None of the cities that make up the Tri-Cities has enough population and buying power to sustain a development of this scale on its own, he said.
“With this lineup and this amount of critical mass, energy and quality of tenant, The Pinnacle will pull from Morristown and southeast Kentucky and have people making the drive from Asheville and Wytheville and maybe Roanoke and southern West Virginia. That trade area has over 2 million people in that and we all win by that,” Johnson said.
The developer compared The Pinnacle to Bristol Motor Speedway, Eastman Chemical and East Tennessee State University, noting that each is located in one city but impact the entire region.
“I think each city in the region should claim The Pinnacle and use it to spur new business and industrial recruitment. This is a great tool for our region to attract new business,” Johnson said, adding that it will offer quality-of-life opportunities typically found in larger, more metropolitan areas.

This guy really thinks people are going to drive 2 hours from Asheville to visit this development when they can drive 1 hour to Greenville/Spartanburg for much better shopping? Heck, I live in Johnson City and will never go. I'd much rather go to Mahoney's than Bass Pro and every other store is also in Johnson City. He will probably pull from SW Virginia and E Kentucky but that's it. And comparing this development to a Fortune 500 corporation (Eastman) and a large stat University? Please. Yes there will be jobs created out of this but they will be low-paying, part-time retail jobs that provide a negligible contribution to the economy.

This type of development is not sustainable and will lead to more empty storefronts in Bristol. Thank god Johnson City hasn't fallen for this crap (yet).

[PINKYLEE123]

I agree with above nothing new here - Steak n Shake is the only thing I would ever go to and at that distance .....not often. They are planning to draw from Morristown ??? - I think they go to Pigeon Forge and Knoxville -

[s_wall98]

As crazy as it sounds, I think Cabelas at The Falls (if it happens) is the key to drawing from the south.
I can't imagine coming from anywhere below Greeneville to go to the Pinnacle when i could drive a little further south to a larger Bass Pro Shops then another 30 minutes to either Knoxville or Pigeon Forge Gatlinburg.
Now if you add a Cabelas to the mix i could see people coming up 81 for both.

[Serious Conversation]

I absolutely agree. The stores are either duplicates of what's already here or are just shuffling locations around. Does it really matter whether Belk is in the mall or at the Pinnacle? The mall location will be closing, and the Bristol mall will be on its last legs.

I also don't see this develop drawing beyond southwest VA and PERHAPS far eastern KY. I can't see people from Morristown coming all the way to the Pinnacle with Knoxville close by. Agreed the Asheville people will just go to Greenville or Charlotte. I did a lot of shopping in Greenville last year because it seemed to have more shopping and was just a much nicer town to hang around in than Knoxville.

[Serious Conversation]

Originally Posted by s_wall98

As crazy as it sounds, I think Cabelas at The Falls (if it happens) is the key to drawing from the south.
I can't imagine coming from anywhere below Greeneville to go to the Pinnacle when i could drive a little further south to a larger Bass Pro Shops then another 30 minutes to either Knoxville or Pigeon Forge Gatlinburg.
Now if you add a Cabelas to the mix i could see people coming up 81 for both.

But these two shops pretty well serve the same market. Most of the area residents also don't have a lot of disposable income, so I can't see them just going out on a spending binge

[noneyabusiness]

I actually think it's going to do well for the area and Bristol is in a growth phase now, over the years I've noticed the tide is shifting to Bristol becoming the center of the Tri-Cities. Every job offer I've got the past few years has came out of Bristol and quite often I find myself up there for some reason or another. Bristol is getting some things not found in the area now it seems like as well, Ollies just opened it's first Tri-Cities location in Bristol, VA recently.

By the way this center is getting a few new things as I can see so far from this list but many are already found in the area. However Steak N Shake, Marshalls, Bass Pro Shop, and Boot Barn do not have any locations in the Tri-Cities so we are getting a few new things to the area and I honestly expect to see some more new stores coming later down the line.

I don't think people will come from Morristown (they will still likely head to closer by Knoxville, which still has way more than what we have in this area) and such just to shop here but the Tri-Cities metro most definitely and it's close to many rural spots in KY and VA to where Bristol is the nearest shopping destination for them so I see people from those areas traveling here more often and coming down to shop. I have a friend in Harlan, KY and the Tri-Cities is the closest place for him to come to for any real shopping and restaurants so I know he and other people in his area will shop in Bristol once this is completed.

[noneyabusiness]

Just to add here I think people don't realize this area has enough of a population to support way more than what it has, look at Greeneville, SC which has 61,397 located in the city vs Johnson City at 65,123. The Tri-Cities CSA is actuallly 500,538 and the urban population of Greeneville, SC is actually 400,492 although Greenevilles MSA is larger at over 850,000. So in some aspects the Tri-Cities has similar to stats to Greenville, SC which seems to have much more in the area than what we have. So I don't buy the argument many make that we are "too small" we actually have a decent size metro area around here and I've seen smaller cities/areas have things that we don't.

Even Asheville seems to have more than the Tri-Cities and Asheville's MSA is only 425,000 although the City itself has 84,000 residents. I admit Asheville has a unique vibe to it, a wonderful downtown, and Biltmore to draw in people. Which the Tri-Cities lacks any appeal to actually draw people in to visit the area. At least Bristol is trying to do something by making it a shopping location to those in the area and for the rural residents in nearby KY and SW VA.

[Serious Conversation]

Originally Posted by noneyabusiness

I actually think it's going to do well for the area and Bristol is in a growth phase now, over the years I've noticed the tide is shifting to Bristol becoming the center of the Tri-Cities. Every job offer I've got the past few years has came out of Bristol and quite often I find myself up there for some reason or another. Bristol is getting some things not found in the area now it seems like as well, Ollies just opened it's first Tri-Cities location in Bristol, VA recently.

By the way this center is getting a few new things as I can see so far from this list but many are already found in the area. However Steak N Shake, Marshalls, Bass Pro Shop, and Boot Barn do not have any locations in the Tri-Cities so we are getting a few new things to the area and I honestly expect to see some more new stores coming later down the line.

I don't think people will come from Morristown (they will still likely head to closer by Knoxville, which still has way more than what we have in this area) and such just to shop here but the Tri-Cities metro most definitely and it's close to many rural spots in KY and VA to where Bristol is the nearest shopping destination for them so I see people from those areas traveling here more often and coming down to shop. I have a friend in Harlan, KY and the Tri-Cities is the closest place for him to come to for any real shopping and restaurants so I know he and other people in his area will shop in Bristol once this is completed.

Bristol is definitely catching on, but I still think it is a bit behind Johnson City. In time, maybe it will fully catch up, but Bristol definitely has its niche.

I don't see a Steak and Shake, or any chain restaurant, as significant economic development. Ditto with Marshall's and Boot Barn. While it's nice to have more shopping than less, these things are not big retail movers, with the exception of Bass Pro. I'd like to see a Costco, more grocery store variety, a Macy's or Dillard's, etc. The area's shopping range is big enough to support them, but it's not getting them. We probably have at least a half million, if not approaching 750k, the "greater shopping area" could draw from.

The problem with the Tri-Cities, as opposed to Greenville, is that the Tri-Cities aren't one city, nor do they behave in any cohesive way. Also, the local government of Greenville has been far more forward thinking for a longer time in developing the area, and appear to be far more competent than any local government around the Tri-Cities.

[Ted Bear]

Originally Posted by noneyabusiness

The Tri-Cities CSA is actuallly 500,538 and the urban population of Greeneville, SC is actually 400,492 although Greenevilles MSA is larger at over 850,000. So in some aspects the Tri-Cities has similar to stats to Greenville, SC which seems to have much more in the area than what we have.

So...Greenville has 70% more heads than the Tri Cities MSA? That is a LOT of bodies.....like 350,000...

The Mall in Bristol dies.....and the traffic/stores go to the Pinnacle. What has changed other than some "new" buildings?

Then there is that empty place along 81 where Hanes, I believe, has an outlet store. How many tens of thousands of square feet of empty retail space are in that building?

And soon, we get Cabelas? Another how many hundreds of thousands of square feet of "shopping" space?

Now, enter whatever is happening at the corner of 26 and 81. What does that do for the Pinnacle, the Mall, the Cabelas, and the Mall at JC which is already up for sale with two dying anchors (JC Penny and Sears)?

I am not a shopper, admittedly. I cant think of a worse way to spend my time. But many people are, and do find it "recreational" to wander around stores thinking about ways to run up their credit cards. But, at what point does saturation take hold? How many places can compete for those 500,000 folks, plus a few transients, who wander into the area and go "wow", a Bass Pro or a Cabelas--there is nothing like that near where we live?

If the current "health" of the area shopping centers is any indication, not enough. Now we are going to spread those people out over THREE additional shopping Malls, and things are going to get better? MORE people are going to spend MORE money? And everyone is going to thrive?

I am not seeing it, quite honestly.