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I've only visited both cities for a week and lived in neither, but I think this is a matter of preference. I much preferred Silver City to Bisbee.
Bisbee and Silver City are an interesting comparison. Bisbee might be my choice relative to a tourist stop but I think Silver City would be a better permanent residence.
Bisbee would be a great choice if you really love the historical aspect of the town but Silver City would probably be a better choice for amenities and shopping and such. I like both towns. Looking forward to more exploration around Silver City.
Bisbee and Silver City are both rather isolated, but it was the near perfect temperatures and increased precip I was interested in. Neither is too hot nor too cold with their elevation micro-climates.
SC is more artsy, and has a touristy downtown too, but Bisbee I'm sure draws a much bigger crowd with the history, and more tourists I think visit AZ as a rule. Both are littered with souvenir type shops. Both grew from mines I believe.
I'd hate to get caught in Bisbee during a downpour though. Those houses, hundreds and hundreds of them are literally on top of each other with narrow unimproved roads or walk-up only! Must be a nightmare for a tow truck, moving truck, fire truck, ambulance or during a monsoon storm. And If you don't like your next door neighbor's dog or music, well...should have thought of that before buying. Get on google earth and drive around! Silver city housing (built later?) for the most part has more yard per house.
Both towns are interesting and fun to visit, that's for sure.
I realize that if I move to LC I will be "roughing it". I'm used to unlimited water, green stuff growing, and all stores one could desire, and sticking my hand in my garden dirt without a glove and never looking to see what could be lurking in there. I also am in an area where I never worry about my car being stolen or broken into. I seriously wonder sometimes if I would regret moving to NM, it doesn't seem the local or state police have a grip on crime.
But...I hate winter. In Michigan it could snow tonight, low 25. High today is 45. We're well below average, and it feels like punishment.
LC seems to have the perfect climate for me. I like it hot. I adjust come summer and it doesn't bother me until into the 90's, but that's in a very humid climate in direct sun.
Moved to LC in December from Michigan. Love it here! Shorts and t-shirt in February! Plenty of places around LC where crime is not an issue. It’s hot but it’s not humid hot which makes all the difference. I’ve made the drive up to Cloudcroft a couple of times (about an hour and 20 min away) this summer and it’s around 9,000 feet and roughly 20 degrees cooler. El Paso is 40 minutes from my place and I’ve gone there multiple times for restaurants and other big city stuff.
I don’t miss Michigan at all! The people are friendly, the weather’s great, beautiful scenery and the cost of living is more than reasonable.
Regarding snakes and other venomous creatures, I can only hope that in about five years there will be enough ~2200 sq ft homes on ~ 1/4 acre plots surrounded by paved streets in and around the communities of interest. Hopefully, that may deter enough snakes to minimize encounters, but I doubt there's much reason for optimism given these stats. https://pediatrics.aappublications.o...38/5/e20160491
Tornadoes truly scare the crap out of me; NY gets 12 on average a year, though the vast majority are Category 0 thru 2. Hurricanes are likely to be a lot more dangerous in NY though they occur less often on average yearly. A tornado may have passed through our backyard during hurricane Sandy 8 years ago. It must have came and left our neighborhood so fast if it came at all that I didn't see it, though I stayed indoors during the entire storm. No damage to our home; not from Sandy either. But Sandy did lots damage on the southern LI coast and NYC. There was probably some damage in upstate NY. https://www.wrvo.org/post/sandy-blow...igh-winds-rain
It's good to know that most tornados in NM are weak and short-lived. But if soils in Las Cruces and other communities are not especially absorbent isn't there a lot flooding bad enough to cause considerable home damage during the rain season?
Nearby AZ definitely gets earthquakes. How many have hit places near Las Cruces, Los Lunas, Alamogordo and Socorro within the last ten years? Were many homes damaged?
I recently moved to Las Cruces from Michigan and I was somewhat concerned about snakes too. During Covid I have done nothing but hike (mainly in and around the Organs). I have done over 200 miles of hiking since February and have yet to see a snake (I have seen one dead one in a trail). I don’t hike in parks or near the city but way out in the mountains and desert (don’t want to be around people) and na-da! I’m sure I will see one but I also realize they want nothing to do with you. I keep my dog on a tight leash while hiking and never let her go into areas where snakes might be. I don’t believe this is a very active area when it comes to earthquakes.
Where ever I build my retirement home, owing to age, budget and retirement income, that place will have to be my last stop-so I’ve got to be dead sure or else; no second moves. And among other factors, anyone buying or building a home better know how geophysics and weather patterns and climate change can and eventually will impact that house. Naturally, I’m obliged to heed the advice of experts. And so when USGS studies and maps show that much of NM is prone to sinkholes that rules out places like Rio Rancho, Santa Fe County, Las Cruces and Alamogordo.
True, I’ve yet to learn of a house in Rio Rancho falling into a sinkhole. I haven’t investigated this deeply enough; perhaps when housing blocks were acquired the builder excavated deep enough to then dump so many tons of rock or soil free of gypsum and salt into each section of each excavated lot-assuming that would at all help prevent sinkhole cave-ins (??). But even if homes built on sinkhole prone land could be protected from cave-ins, protecting users of thousands of miles of public roads is impossible. Indeed, Youtube is full of TV news stories of Rio Rancho drivers suddenly falling into sinkholes.
So Silver City seemed like the most logical and hospitable choice. However, I don’t know about how serious the crystal meth and water quality problems I’ve heard about are, but if seasonal monsoons and flash flooding are as serious there as they are in many parts of NM-and as Silver likely lacks the tax base and state assistance funding to build effective flood water control and re-use facilities-I don’t see how I could risk buying land there. NM is also among the worst ranked states for health care quality-a big concern for seniors and those who are serious about sticking around to enjoy their retirement years (assuming that will ever again be possible given the caliber of this country’s leadership).
This is all very upsetting; ditto Rio Rancho. as I know some NY and CA transplants who are very happy there. There’s barely a day that goes by when I don’t fantasize about living in Grant County, NM or Puma County, AZ. Desert plains landscapes that reach out and grabs me. But from what I’ve seen it’s just too risky for one or more reasons.
Upstate NY is far from my “thanks but no thanks” list of retirement places. But western NY near the PA border has sinkholes and all major rivers and lakes flood very badly during storms-and will get worse with polar ice melts. But there’s about 10 counties which are relatively safe. NY has very good health care quality, much lower numbers of venomous wildlife, less crime and abundant quality goods and services. Some of those areas, the more plains like among them, are somewhat akin to the western states.
Ironically, what I fear is that if certain conditions become worse in NY by the time I start looking to buy land I may have look towards those few areas in NM and AZ. All I can do is hope that conditions improve in those regions of NM and AZ four years from now, though I can’t see that happening without a population boom and a lot higher taxes-not an especially lovely scenario.
Longislandmire,
I have also considered all of your concerns, because I too will have one shot to do it right. The thought of buying a home and then being unhappy with it, paying closing costs and realtor costs to sell it only a couple years into it to then buy again in a different location is not in my planned budget.
Sinkholes have not been on my list. However, is there not insurance that would cover sinkholes also?
The main reason I have studied and visited the same cities in NM and AZ is climate. Tucson is out, too hot. ABQ is out, too much crime. Rio Rancho is a possibility, but really it's just a suburb of ABQ, what I consider to be sprawl, but much safer with garages mandatory. The problem is that it's a drive to be walking "downtown". I want to be able to be in the thick of things quickly.
NM taxes SS, AZ does not. But NM has a much more diverse and authentic feel. AZ feels more bottled for tourists and public consumption, less authentic. How much am I willing to pay for more authentic? A B&E? No. Car jacking? No. But some risk must be assumed to move to NM.
Las Cruces may well prove too hot. I don't like winter, but extreme heat zaps my energy. Las Cruces seems to lack any energy of a real "downtown" except for Saturdays at the farmer's market? That's bizarre for a town of over 100k.
So Silver City to Alamogordo to Sierra Vista were where I set my sites, looking for those micro-climates of less opressive heat in higher elevation while still avoiding the true winters of Taos or Flagstaff or Ruidoso.
Alamogordo and Sierra Vista lack the energy of cities, imo. They have too much blue collar feel, or it's the nearby military that tones the energy down to a low hum instead of an excited pitch. Surrounding Tucson or ABQ are my desires.
I can't find a single location that has it all.
Silver City is ideal in many ways, however the houses are expensive for a Santa Fe style, or mostly boring older ranches in my price range. Silver City is only building Adobe style homes well into the 300k and up. Silver City is also isolated, an hour to anywhere with major shopping, large venues, and speciality hospitals.
I want the vibrancy of a fairly big city, I love the energy, and that's my dilemma.
Longislandmire,
I have also considered all of your concerns, because I too will have one shot to do it right. The thought of buying a home and then being unhappy with it, paying closing costs and realtor costs to sell it only a couple years into it to then buy again in a different location is not in my planned budget.
Sinkholes have not been on my list. However, is there not insurance that would cover sinkholes also?
The main reason I have studied and visited the same cities in NM and AZ is climate. Tucson is out, too hot. ABQ is out, too much crime. Rio Rancho is a possibility, but really it's just a suburb of ABQ, what I consider to be sprawl, but much safer with garages mandatory. The problem is that it's a drive to be walking "downtown". I want to be able to be in the thick of things quickly.
NM taxes SS, AZ does not. But NM has a much more diverse and authentic feel. AZ feels more bottled for tourists and public consumption, less authentic. How much am I willing to pay for more authentic? A B&E? No. Car jacking? No. But some risk must be assumed to move to NM.
Las Cruces may well prove too hot. I don't like winter, but extreme heat zaps my energy. Las Cruces seems to lack any energy of a real "downtown" except for Saturdays at the farmer's market? That's bizarre for a town of over 100k.
So Silver City to Alamogordo to Sierra Vista were where I set my sites, looking for those micro-climates of less opressive heat in higher elevation while still avoiding the true winters of Taos or Flagstaff or Ruidoso.
Alamogordo and Sierra Vista lack the energy of cities, imo. They have too much blue collar feel, or it's the nearby military that tones the energy down to a low hum instead of an excited pitch. Surrounding Tucson or ABQ are my desires.
I can't find a single location that has it all.
Silver City is ideal in many ways, however the houses are expensive for a Santa Fe style, or mostly boring older ranches in my price range. Silver City is only building Adobe style homes well into the 300k and up. Silver City is also isolated, an hour to anywhere with major shopping, large venues, and speciality hospitals.
I want the vibrancy of a fairly big city, I love the energy, and that's my dilemma.
I have visited Santa Fe but only for a day whereas I visited from ABQ south for a week twice. I'm in my 50's and trying to semi retire now. Santa Fe's prices I would have to reconsider that strategy, which is doable and not off the table. Santa Fe does have colder winters than what I ideally want, however quality of life in the area I choose is very mportant. Do I want the Santa Fe vibe? I don't know the area well enough. I was specifically looking at the micro climates in higher elevations but in the southern third of NM and AZ to avoid true winters.
Coming from MI and still having Chicago proper on my list, 40's for daytime highs in Dec, Jan, and Feb, really aren't all that awful (Santa Fe averages).
I have visited Santa Fe but only for a day whereas I visited from ABQ south for a week twice. I'm in my 50's and trying to semi retire now. Santa Fe's prices I would have to reconsider that strategy, which is doable and not off the table. Santa Fe does have colder winters than what I ideally want, however quality of life in the area I choose is very mportant. Do I want the Santa Fe vibe? I don't know the area well enough. I was specifically looking at the micro climates in higher elevations but in the southern third of NM and AZ to avoid true winters. Coming from MI and still having Chicago proper on my list, 40's for daytime highs in Dec, Jan, and Feb, really aren't all that awful (Santa Fe averages).
Thanks for mentioning Santa Fe County (and/or adjoining counties) which next to Silver City (Grant County) may be about the only area in NM not especially prone to sinkholes; perhaps that’s one reason why it became the state capitol. However, I’d have to more intensely scrutinize specific communities in Santa Fe County for sink holes, flooding, earthquakes and wildfire histories. Meanwhile, this commentary, while not necessarily authoritative, is hardly encouraging. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_iVC4s2aQY
Most members of this forum have wisely conceded that no place is the perfect habitat and usually only wealthy transplants have the best chances to get all they want after relocating to their new digs. As a lifelong New Yorker I’d have little problems coping with the colder areas of NM, and being native to Long Island I much prefer suburban living to any kind of densely urbanized environment, no matter how alluring some “high energy” enclaves might be. Sadly, decades of over immigration-across all ages, economic classes and ethnicities-massive institutionalized job outsourcing and trillions in capital flight have long stunted real wage growth and driven up the cost and down the quantity and quality of every basic human necessity in this country. So things are likely to get worse for many, whatever the configuration of our so-called leadership. Thus, even in NM, with under 1/9 NY’s population, expect housing prices and taxes to rise over time, at least in the more hospitable areas-even more so in the western states experiencing bigger population growth, like ID, UT and CO.
No Man’s Land’s hopes versus concerns about places like Alamogordo and Silver City reflect my own. As Gordo’s economy is likely much dependent on that military base, law and order is likely to be a welcome norm there. But quality of goods and services could be problematic if median income levels fall below the national average, as might jet fighter plane noise. As for Silver City, a longtime resident told me there’s a Walmart and Albertson’s there, so if you make big veg salads almost every day like I do (restaurant dining is an income suck and nutritional food value is anyone’s guess), supermarkets selling lots of fresh veggies, Gortons’s frozen fishsticks and Koch grilled white chicken strips and hot rotisserie chicken are essential.
As for housing prices, ~$300K for a well built 2.2K sq ft house with low taxes and utility costs in a low crime area not far from quality goods and services (??) is hardly unreasonable these days, as explained above. So unless you’ve been earning and saving very serious money for many years I’d think twice about “semi-retiring” for the next several years at least. Keep on working, pare down excess spending, invest wisely and keep saving if you want to buy or build a really nice house with no mortgage!!
However, if “high energy” cosmopolitan living is a priority I can’t see how most places in NM would suit you too well, save for areas close to Santa Fe city and Albuquerque, which are likely to be more expensive and/or have way more crime than places like Silver, Gordo or even Cruces. Perhaps Rio Rancho? Burglaries, car thefts and police presence may or may not still be problems there. However, you can probably get quite a nice house there for ~ $325K or so; low taxes, utilities and only 15 miles from “high energy” cosmo Albuquerque. Rio Rancho Mayor Hull and the city council got a $10 million bond issue passed last year, but how much could that sum lower crime and/or build flood water control and water recapture infrastructure? Trump vowed to take NM this year so Republican controlled RR rolled out the welcome mat for The Donald’s visit last year; maybe some expected payback’s in store.
As most of NM is prone to sinkholes, insuring your house against sinkholes may or may not be expensive. But you should also look into adding sinkhole insurance to your auto policy because the > 125 miles of Rio Rancho roads, like most in NM, carry the same risks. Here’s one of numerous local TV news reports. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oOKEzFmYSY
But aside from environmental risks and seasonal temps, my biggest concern with Santa Fe County would be average vacant land prices and property taxes of land within 25 miles of Santa Fe or other nearby towns with at least one hospital, dental group, car and HVAC repair, reliable wifi service and Walmart and/or Albertson’s supermarkets. Except perhaps for part of Las Cruces, Santa Fe County, which includes the state capitol and celeb communities like Tesuque, probably has the highest priced real estate in NM. Comparatively, crime may be lower as there are likely a lot more cops, kids receive better education as better qualified teachers are attracted and retained by higher salaries, as with other public services. But all that means higher taxes and/or housing prices; seniors may receive some tax breaks, however meaningful.
As most of us have acknowledged, NM is beset with several economic handicaps, which doesn’t make it among the best retirement states. Its public schools rank among the worst performing and high crime rates repel private sector investment and its landlocked location often repel retirees from higher populated and higher income coastal states. Financially secure retirees who like NM’s often semi-arid landscapes are more apt to move there but not if they must travel 40 miles to the nearest hospital or dentist, 20 miles each way to a decent supermarket, have poor quality wifi and lack other basic services, not the least of which is seeing a cop car patrolling once or twice a week. And few but the wealthier more populated counties could likely expect little help from state government for an area > twice the size of NY. So determining the most attractive yet safest retirement spot in NM involves lots of study before hard choices can finally be made. And those like me have only one shot to get it right.
if the southwest is still of interest, 160 miles west of Silver City is Tucson; decidedly more “energetic” but certainly higher crime and/or living costs. However, out in the suburbs for the same ~$325K you can probably still buy a nice house and enjoy low taxes throughout Pima County. Other “exciting” attractions of the Tucson area are not infrequent lightning storms, though usually not especially violent; NY actually tends to get those. I wouldn’t know about the quality of goods and services to be found in and around Tucson. Pima County has beautiful desert landscapes but unless you’re packing a flashlight and a handgun I wouldn’t advise night strolling, as that’s when snakes, black widows, scorpions and other formidable creatures do their hunting. And if you have an attached garage keep that door leading inside your house closed and with no gaps where those same critters can enter. A NY retired transplant to Rio Rancho said his brother who lives closer to Albuquerque found a snake in his living room when he left his attached garage door ajar. Better to build a house with a detached garage.
And while earthquake threats in southern AZ didn’t show up on the USGS map I looked at, the epicenter of a 5.2 quake which they thought was Lordsberg that happened in 2014 turned out to be 31 miles away in Duncan AZ. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...mexico-n143656 While Duncan’s 112 miles from Tucson, non-reinforced adobe can fissure from forceful tremors. And though southern AZ and NM are not on NOAA’s tornado threat list, Tucson did get a tornado visit not long ago. I’m no kind of building designer but a 70/30 mix of wood and brick might be prudent materials for protection from tremors and high winds. And be sure to check those flood zone maps! And if you’re dead set on buying a house or building one in a sinkhole area I’d investigate what steps builders in Rio Rancho and upscale areas in Las Cruces may have take to remediate the plots prior to laying foundations or slabs. If they didn’t then those homes are disasters waiting to happen.
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