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Old 06-02-2015, 11:43 AM
 
13,593 posts, read 11,253,331 times
Reputation: 9365

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The question is, does the Uber model constitute an improvement for the average passenger (in this case in Vegas) over the current taxi model, on the bread an butter routes (between airport and casinos, between casinos, etc.)? I think the jury is out on that, and won't come back until Uber is in full operation, with full access to those facilities. I fully support allowing that to happen.

But in the end, it very well may not prove superior. Even if Uber's methodology allows quicker pickups than older methods of calling livery cars, it's not quicker than walking up to a cab line and just getting in a waiting cab. Where I see it being superior is between venues that have less traditional cab service, and don't have the huge built in cab infrastructure that McCarren and the casinos do. But in Vegas, where nearly everyone who lives there has cars, that probably isn't a huge market. This works much better in cities like NYC, where less people have cars, and there's more local demand for livery service.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoopLV View Post
I preferred it before you edited this post when you simply called me insane. That's just precious.

Read up on your George Santayana. You know, what happens to people who do not learn from history.


"Why would you use a computer to book an airline ticket when you have travel agents to book tickets for you? Besides, old people will never be able to figure out how to use a computer." -- Travel agents, 1995.

"People like newspapers. They don't mind if it stains their fingertips black. They WANT to be able to do the crossword puzzle and read all the stories, printed on paper. Besides, old people will never be able to figure out how to use a computer." -- Newspaper editors, 1990.

"People love records and CDs. Why would they want a digital copy of music? That could be wiped out just by typing, 'DEL *.*' A CD or a record is permanent. Besides, old people will never learn how to figure out FTP file transfers." -- Record executives, 1990.

"Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?" -- Movie producers, 1927

"Airplanes are interesting toys. But they have no military value." -- various generals, 1914

"I drank what?" -- Socrates, 399 BC
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:52 AM
 
Location: Lancaster, CA / Henderson, NV
1,107 posts, read 1,257,550 times
Reputation: 1029
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegas_Cabbie View Post
Just picked up at Treasure Island and dropped off at Terminal 1. Two younger girls who blabbed between themselves nonstop. Asked me to turn up A/C... Which I did for them.
Four bags, two of them at least 60 pounds (trust me, I swear my wife packs blocks of lead in her bags on vacations... I know the weight).
Took Strip to Flamingo, Flamingo to Koval, Koval to Trop, Trop to Terminal 1. Shortest route, $14.84 right in front of their departing airline's check in.
Hands me a $20 and asks for $5 back. Thanked them and told them to have a good day.

Onto the next ride.
Maybe the cabbie that took them from the Airport to TI, when they arrived in town, tricked them into double tipping and therefore you unfortunately got the payback for the first dishonest cabbie.
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Old 06-02-2015, 12:00 PM
 
Location: England
26,275 posts, read 7,128,681 times
Reputation: 31241
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegas_Cabbie View Post
Just picked up at Treasure Island and dropped off at Terminal 1. Two younger girls who blabbed between themselves nonstop. Asked me to turn up A/C... Which I did for them.
Four bags, two of them at least 60 pounds (trust me, I swear my wife packs blocks of lead in her bags on vacations... I know the weight).
Took Strip to Flamingo, Flamingo to Koval, Koval to Trop, Trop to Terminal 1. Shortest route, $14.84 right in front of their departing airline's check in.
Hands me a $20 and asks for $5 back. Thanked them and told them to have a good day.

Onto the next ride.
That's the same route the taxi driver took my wife and her mother, when they stayed at TI. He talked all the way to the airport about how long hauling gives the industry a bad name. Similar fare to yours. My wife gave him a good tip.

When we stayed at TI in 2007, we got to see the back of all the casinos on our journey through the tunnel. Nice view though.........
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Old 06-02-2015, 12:09 PM
 
Location: Sunrise
10,865 posts, read 15,242,910 times
Reputation: 9047
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBMW View Post
The question is, does the Uber model constitute an improvement for the average passenger (in this case in Vegas) over the current taxi model, on the bread an butter routes (between airport and casinos, between casinos, etc.)? I think the jury is out on that, and won't come back until Uber is in full operation, with full access to those facilities. I fully support allowing that to happen.

But in the end, it very well may not prove superior. Even if Uber's methodology allows quicker pickups than older methods of calling livery cars, it's not quicker than walking up to a cab line and just getting in a waiting cab. Where I see it being superior is between venues that have less traditional cab service, and don't have the huge built in cab infrastructure that McCarren and the casinos do. But in Vegas, where nearly everyone who lives there has cars, that probably isn't a huge market. This works much better in cities like NYC, where less people have cars, and there's more local demand for livery service.
Look at London. The cab drivers there aren't just respected -- they're beloved. They study "the knowledge" for years. They know London like the backs of their hands. They're genial, honest to a fault, and a true asset to the city.

London charges drivers a premium just for the privilege to drive in the city center. It is one of the most expensive cities to operate a motor vehicle.

And despite all of those advantages, Uber is still beating the traditional London cab driver -- pricing and convenience. If the taxi industry founders in London, it cannot hold on anywhere. People will still take cabs when it makes sense to do so. People still ride in horse-drawn carriages, too. That doesn't mean a career as a horse carriage operator makes a whole lot of sense. SOME people can continue to make a living operating a horse and carriage. There are still successful travel agents in 2015. Some people can continue to make a living making buggy whips and corset stays, too.

But to deny that times are changing means a break from reality of Charlie Sheen proportions. Las Vegas isn't nearly as special as the three "cabs aren't going anywhere" users on this thread think.

The next step will be that one cab company will start buying the other companies at cut rate prices. They'll hold on for a while. And people will point to that and say, "See? Cabs aren't going anywhere." But that's a false economy -- just one company wringing a bit more money out of a dying industry before the wheels come off entirely.

They'll lose the suburbs first, and the new system will nibble around the edges until cabs are a distant memory -- like 8-track cassettes.

And even though Uber is worth $40 billion, and it's two founders instantly skyrocketed to the "world's richest people" list, as soon as something better comes along, they're toast, too. Because that's how this revolution works. We're still in the middle of it.

Nobody would have guessed that a San Francisco message board would eventually steal classified advertisements away from newspapers and essentially kill the print news industry. (Newspapers survive on their classified ads. They lose money on the sale of each paper. And print ads aren't the revenue generator that classifieds were -- past tense. Were.) There are still classifieds in every surviving newspaper. But people don't post a boat for sale in the R-J unless they're luddites. They post it on Craigslist.
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Old 06-02-2015, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
1,423 posts, read 1,402,282 times
Reputation: 1716
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoopLV View Post
Look at London. The cab drivers there aren't just respected -- they're beloved. They study "the knowledge" for years. They know London like the backs of their hands. They're genial, honest to a fault, and a true asset to the city.

London charges drivers a premium just for the privilege to drive in the city center. It is one of the most expensive cities to operate a motor vehicle.

And despite all of those advantages, Uber is still beating the traditional London cab driver -- pricing and convenience. If the taxi industry founders in London, it cannot hold on anywhere. People will still take cabs when it makes sense to do so. People still ride in horse-drawn carriages, too. That doesn't mean a career as a horse carriage operator makes a whole lot of sense. SOME people can continue to make a living operating a horse and carriage. There are still successful travel agents in 2015. Some people can continue to make a living making buggy whips and corset stays, too.

But to deny that times are changing means a break from reality of Charlie Sheen proportions. Las Vegas isn't nearly as special as the three "cabs aren't going anywhere" users on this thread think.

The next step will be that one cab company will start buying the other companies at cut rate prices. They'll hold on for a while. And people will point to that and say, "See? Cabs aren't going anywhere." But that's a false economy -- just one company wringing a bit more money out of a dying industry before the wheels come off entirely.

They'll lose the suburbs first, and the new system will nibble around the edges until cabs are a distant memory -- like 8-track cassettes.

And even though Uber is worth $40 billion, and it's two founders instantly skyrocketed to the "world's richest people" list, as soon as something better comes along, they're toast, too. Because that's how this revolution works. We're still in the middle of it.

Nobody would have guessed that a San Francisco message board would eventually steal classified advertisements away from newspapers and essentially kill the print news industry. (Newspapers survive on their classified ads. They lose money on the sale of each paper. And print ads aren't the revenue generator that classifieds were -- past tense. Were.) There are still classifieds in every surviving newspaper. But people don't post a boat for sale in the R-J unless they're luddites. They post it on Craigslist.
Mmkay, but I am finding a huge hole in all your comparisons to other industries... Internet vs. Newspaper... That type of thing. It's not the same as Uber vs. Cabs. Not even close.

The advantages that Uber has over cabs isn't locked down to only Uber. I think most of us would agree that their biggest asset is probably the electronic dispatch/tracking system.
See, some drivers like the local routes... Especially the Veteran drivers who want a more relaxed day instead of the hustle and bustle of the strip. The cab companies are starting to pounce on taking Uber's advantages away one by one. The first is the tracking/gps/digital dispatch. Drivers will have an app and it will work in the same way.
Uber is still an individual car picking up five passengers or less... Just like a cab.

See, I dont think cabs will just poof, disappear... I think it will be an evolution... A combination of the standard taxi line service as well as the tracking service. I think the cabs will be able to offer the best of both worlds... Easy strip pickups where when you walk out, we are there... And the suburban drivers being electronically dispatched. This blended approach is coming sooner than you think.
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Old 06-02-2015, 12:53 PM
 
13,593 posts, read 11,253,331 times
Reputation: 9365
London as a taxi market is much more like NYC than Vegas. It's very dense, with a lot of people who don't have cars, and riders that are going from anywhere to anywhere. Vegas is just not that way. I'd like to see a statistic for what percentage of cab mileage in Clark County is racked up going between the airport and casinos (on the strip or downtown) or between the casinos. I bet it's over 50%. At those venues, with their dedicated taxi stands that always have immediately available cabs, Uber doesn't have an advantage, and is likely at a disadvantage.

But I may be wrong, and I'd like to see Uber tried in Vegas, to find out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoopLV View Post
Look at London. The cab drivers there aren't just respected -- they're beloved. They study "the knowledge" for years. They know London like the backs of their hands. They're genial, honest to a fault, and a true asset to the city.

London charges drivers a premium just for the privilege to drive in the city center. It is one of the most expensive cities to operate a motor vehicle.

And despite all of those advantages, Uber is still beating the traditional London cab driver -- pricing and convenience. If the taxi industry founders in London, it cannot hold on anywhere. People will still take cabs when it makes sense to do so. People still ride in horse-drawn carriages, too. That doesn't mean a career as a horse carriage operator makes a whole lot of sense. SOME people can continue to make a living operating a horse and carriage. There are still successful travel agents in 2015. Some people can continue to make a living making buggy whips and corset stays, too.

But to deny that times are changing means a break from reality of Charlie Sheen proportions. Las Vegas isn't nearly as special as the three "cabs aren't going anywhere" users on this thread think.

The next step will be that one cab company will start buying the other companies at cut rate prices. They'll hold on for a while. And people will point to that and say, "See? Cabs aren't going anywhere." But that's a false economy -- just one company wringing a bit more money out of a dying industry before the wheels come off entirely.

They'll lose the suburbs first, and the new system will nibble around the edges until cabs are a distant memory -- like 8-track cassettes.

And even though Uber is worth $40 billion, and it's two founders instantly skyrocketed to the "world's richest people" list, as soon as something better comes along, they're toast, too. Because that's how this revolution works. We're still in the middle of it.

Nobody would have guessed that a San Francisco message board would eventually steal classified advertisements away from newspapers and essentially kill the print news industry. (Newspapers survive on their classified ads. They lose money on the sale of each paper. And print ads aren't the revenue generator that classifieds were -- past tense. Were.) There are still classifieds in every surviving newspaper. But people don't post a boat for sale in the R-J unless they're luddites. They post it on Craigslist.
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Old 06-02-2015, 01:02 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas, NV
881 posts, read 1,683,043 times
Reputation: 990
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegas_Cabbie View Post
See, I dont think cabs will just poof, disappear... I think it will be an evolution... A combination of the standard taxi line service as well as the tracking service. I think the cabs will be able to offer the best of both worlds... Easy strip pickups where when you walk out, we are there... And the suburban drivers being electronically dispatched. This blended approach is coming sooner than you think.
Scoop didn't say cabs would disappear. He said there still will be a place for them, but it will be far different than it is today. I totally agree with him.

Listen, I know it's hard to accept or admit that your industry is changing for the worse (from your perspective), but it's going to happen. You still may have a job as a driver as Uber's presence grows, but many of your colleagues will not. The sooner that you and your fellow cabbies accept that, the better off you'll be.

FWIW, I believe all of you would have a lot more credibility on this topic if you would admit that many of the scare tactics you continually reiterate is primarily motivated because you don't want anyone else competing for your work. In other words, you don't want someone to take your job, which is a totally natural feeling.
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Old 06-02-2015, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas
2,865 posts, read 2,139,212 times
Reputation: 2423
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoopLV View Post
Look at London. The cab drivers there aren't just respected -- they're beloved. They study "the knowledge" for years. They know London like the backs of their hands. They're genial, honest to a fault, and a true asset to the city.

London charges drivers a premium just for the privilege to drive in the city center. It is one of the most expensive cities to operate a motor vehicle.

And despite all of those advantages, Uber is still beating the traditional London cab driver -- pricing and convenience. If the taxi industry founders in London, it cannot hold on anywhere. People will still take cabs when it makes sense to do so. People still ride in horse-drawn carriages, too. That doesn't mean a career as a horse carriage operator makes a whole lot of sense. SOME people can continue to make a living operating a horse and carriage. There are still successful travel agents in 2015. Some people can continue to make a living making buggy whips and corset stays, too.

But to deny that times are changing means a break from reality of Charlie Sheen proportions. Las Vegas isn't nearly as special as the three "cabs aren't going anywhere" users on this thread think.

The next step will be that one cab company will start buying the other companies at cut rate prices. They'll hold on for a while. And people will point to that and say, "See? Cabs aren't going anywhere." But that's a false economy -- just one company wringing a bit more money out of a dying industry before the wheels come off entirely.

They'll lose the suburbs first, and the new system will nibble around the edges until cabs are a distant memory -- like 8-track cassettes.

And even though Uber is worth $40 billion, and it's two founders instantly skyrocketed to the "world's richest people" list, as soon as something better comes along, they're toast, too. Because that's how this revolution works. We're still in the middle of it.

Nobody would have guessed that a San Francisco message board would eventually steal classified advertisements away from newspapers and essentially kill the print news industry. (Newspapers survive on their classified ads. They lose money on the sale of each paper. And print ads aren't the revenue generator that classifieds were -- past tense. Were.) There are still classifieds in every surviving newspaper. But people don't post a boat for sale in the R-J unless they're luddites. They post it on Craigslist.
To understand part of Scoop's argument, you probably need to hop into a cab in London... There is just no comparison to any Taxi service in the world.... You tell them where you want to go, and it could be the most obscure street yet they will take you right there. no GPS. no BS.
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Old 06-02-2015, 01:57 PM
 
13,593 posts, read 11,253,331 times
Reputation: 9365
I get that. That isn't the point. For a Vegas cabbile, to get from McCarren to Caesar's Palace doesn't require a GPS either.

The point is, for standard cab trips in Vegas, using Uber will require the user to jump through hoops that using a standard cab won't. And in Vegas, the percentage of standard cab trips is much higher than in London or NYC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OmegaSupreme View Post
To understand part of Scoop's argument, you probably need to hop into a cab in London... There is just no comparison to any Taxi service in the world.... You tell them where you want to go, and it could be the most obscure street yet they will take you right there. no GPS. no BS.
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Old 06-02-2015, 02:09 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 13,927,233 times
Reputation: 5454
I am reasonably knowledgeable on London and its traffic. Lived there one week a month for a couple of years and rode the cab or drove from London to the suburbs daily.

It is an utterly different situation even from NYC. And GPS will undoubtedly take over there if it has not already. The key to driving in London is an encyclopedic knowledge of back streets and alleys. For instance the escape route from my hotel involved ducking into the alley behind the Japanese Embassy and ducking through a half a dozen back street and alleys to get clear of the neighborhood. Trying to stay on main drags and you would spend a half day getting anywhere.

Bears no resemblance to the rectilinear streets of Las Vegas.

I would think in virtually any outcome the Cabs and Uber et al end up coexisting. The interesting thing will be the transition and how it all balances out. And no Uber is not going to put the cabs out of business in Las Vegas. And as long as the regulatory structure remains intact you are not going to see price competition - at least not from the individual cab companies.
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