[tony soprano]

Originally Posted by olecapt

There is no way the LV Valley has 74.7% of it homes underwater. And anyone who uses three decimal places in such a number is obviously lying.

Other than the use of three decimal places is there any data that refutes their number?

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by tony soprano

Other than the use of three decimal places is there any data that refutes their number?

Generally accepted that 30% of US homes are owned outright. LV should be somewhat larger do to high senior population.

29% of the SFRs in Clark County were last purchased before 2000. The are all above base value. There may of course have been refi so it can't be pinned down.

Around 7% of the housing stock has been bought for cash in the last three years.

Any underwater assessment requires knowledge of house values. There is no known way to do that with any accuracy.

I would think they meant 75% of the homes with mortgages...but even that is likely high.

And three digits says someone is reading a model with precision not possible.

[eventusstultorummagister]

Originally Posted by tony soprano

Are you familiar with dividends? You may have noticed that every single institution at the link you provided above paid the US govt. either interest or dividends in return for the TARP money. Most of the financial institutions chose to issue preferred stock to Treasury in exchange for TARP money. For every share of preferred stock that Treasury owned they were paid a dividend. That dividend payout as a percentage of the implied cost basis of the preferred stock is the effective interest rate that those finance institutions paid for TARP money.

So, the notion that banks are being kept afloat by TARP money while not lending is misguided as the four largest mortgage lenders in the US have paid back all the TARP money they accepted. Secondly, dividends or interest - call it what you will but TARP money was not free.

Shares in a floundering business enterprise (Ponzi Scheme)?

I have an idea. Why don't all the victimized homeowners who are underwater give their lenders shares in their equity in lieu of interest payments?

[eventusstultorummagister]

Originally Posted by olecapt

Generally accepted that 30% of US homes are owned outright. LV should be somewhat larger do to high senior population.

29% of the SFRs in Clark County were last purchased before 2000. The are all above base value. There may of course have been refi so it can't be pinned down.

Around 7% of the housing stock has been bought for cash in the last three years.

Any underwater assessment requires knowledge of house values. There is no known way to do that with any accuracy.

I would think they meant 75% of the homes with mortgages...but even that is likely high.

And three digits says someone is reading a model with precision not possible.

I would think more than a few of those homeowners availed of equity lines of credit for investment capital. I remember a day when I counted 15 offers in my mailbox in ONE DAY! Kinda hard to resist the dessert cart when they park it right under your nose...

[Natali :)]

Originally Posted by olecapt

I would think they meant 75% of the homes with mortgages...but even that is likely high.

And three digits says someone is reading a model with precision not possible.

YES, they meant 75% of the homes with mortgages --> see one more time for this my post

Originally Posted by Natali :)

Bank foreclosures, delinquent mortgages continue to rise - Las Vegas Sun

CoreLogic reported that Las Vegas continues to lead the nation with mortgages that are underwater. In the first quarter, the Las Vegas valley had 74.7 percent of its homes underwater and 2.9 percent near negative equity

@ olecapt
so u are OK with 75% but u have concern about there numbers-> 74.7% because it have three digits ?

I like u olecapt - its good for Re agent to be so meticulous
....but u act as a seller agent ... so, as a potential buyer, I do not like u...

[tony soprano]

Originally Posted by olecapt

I would think they meant 75% of the homes with mortgages...but even that is likely high.

Yes, it says as much in the article. Here's Natali's cut & paste without her liberal use of emphasis -

Originally Posted by LVSun

CoreLogic reported that Las Vegas continues to lead the nation with mortgages that are underwater. In the first quarter, the Las Vegas valley had 74.7 percent of its homes underwater and 2.9 percent near negative equity.

"With mortgages" being the key.

Oops. Natali slipped in before me.

[tony soprano]

Originally Posted by eventusstultorummagister

Shares in a floundering business enterprise (Ponzi Scheme)?

I have an idea. Why don't all the victimized homeowners who are underwater give their lenders shares in their equity in lieu of interest payments?

Well if you're going to pay a dividend on those shares like the banks did, I would think you may as well just pay your mortgage interest.

My personal preference is that homeowners stick with interest payments because if the housing market ever comes back strong then I'd have to listen to all the outrage about the homeowners who were victimized into sharing their equity.

[Natali :)]

Originally Posted by tony soprano

Yes, it says as much in the article. Here's Natali's cut & paste without her liberal use of emphasis .

@tony soprano

u understand my nature

emphasis ! yes, I am very liberal about this !

[Natali :)]

Originally Posted by tony soprano

Oops. Natali slipped in before me.

no, not before u ...we did it synchronously

[ITChick]

Originally Posted by tony soprano

Are you familiar with dividends? You may have noticed that every single institution at the link you provided above paid the US govt. either interest or dividends in return for the TARP money. Most of the financial institutions chose to issue preferred stock to Treasury in exchange for TARP money. For every share of preferred stock that Treasury owned they were paid a dividend. That dividend payout as a percentage of the implied cost basis of the preferred stock is the effective interest rate that those finance institutions paid for TARP money.

So, the notion that banks are being kept afloat by TARP money while not lending is misguided as the four largest mortgage lenders in the US have paid back all the TARP money they accepted. Secondly, dividends or interest - call it what you will but TARP money was not free.

Your joking right? I know you're trying to impress me with your intelligently written logic, but seriously, I read the link I sent you also. When a company such as Bank of America borrows 45 billion and only pays back, in Dividends and fees a total of 3 billion, you're going to to tell me that they're paid back in full? Seriously?
"Below is a list of recipients and how much they’ve paid in dividend or interest payments so far. Also included in the totals are special fees by a couple recipients, most notably Bank of America.":
http://bailout.propublica.org/main/list/dividends