[RationalExpectations]

Originally Posted by Svoboda

On a side tangent, if anyone has IT openings at their place of employment, please shoot me a note. I'm already scouring all of the normal places.

Found out a couple weeks ago my company is outsourcing all remaining infrastructure. Only IT left will be management layers.

Why not work for the outsourcing company?

[Cold Warrior]

Originally Posted by ddrhazy

Your argument is that I didn't say 1/6? OK Boomer. Maybe next I'll be telling my friends in Cali working in Silicon Valley to come to Vegas because a guy called Cold Warrior said it's a good idea because of the data center jobs.

LOL! Math really is hard! For you, anyway. Buy a calculator.

[ddrhazy]

Originally Posted by Cold Warrior

LOL! Math really is hard! For you, anyway. Buy a calculator.

The average salary for a programmer is around 60k. You pulled weird numbers, but it doesn't even matter if it was 200k. The point stands, the CEOs of those companies steal large amounts of labor from the programmers.

This isn't to make a pity party for comp sci majors or STEM in general. They are some of the CHUDiest workers out there. Because they are better compensated than other industries, they are fine with being "somewhat exploited".

So continue arguing with me. It seems your boomer brain gets a sick satisfaction from it.

[lvmensch]

Originally Posted by ddrhazy

The average salary for a programmer is around 60k. You pulled weird numbers, but it doesn't even matter if it was 200k. The point stands, the CEOs of those companies steal large amounts of labor from the programmers.

This isn't to make a pity party for comp sci majors or STEM in general. They are some of the CHUDiest workers out there. Because they are better compensated than other industries, they are fine with being "somewhat exploited".

So continue arguing with me. It seems your boomer brain gets a sick satisfaction from it.

You obviously have never managed programmers...particular heavy duty ones. They are the least CHUDest people on earth. Can be a wild ride though. And the heavy programmers go past $150K.

[ddrhazy]

Originally Posted by lvmensch

You obviously have never managed programmers...particular heavy duty ones. They are the least CHUDest people on earth. Can be a wild ride though. And the heavy programmers go past $150K.

The tech bro culture in SV pretty much has destroyed the working class in Cali and lays the blame on working class people for not being boot strappy enough.

I get that they can earn high wages, not even my point and further, those are outliers, not the average. Even Google uses a lot of contracted work to keep wages down. Hell even today there's an article about Google shutting down a movement that workers are trying to unionize.

Lots of non compete understandings between Google/Apple and other big names out there, they got hit with lawsuits for that a few years back.

[Cold Warrior]

Originally Posted by ddrhazy

The average salary for a programmer is around 60k. You pulled weird numbers, but it doesn't even matter if it was 200k. The point stands, the CEOs of those companies steal large amounts of labor from the programmers.

This isn't to make a pity party for comp sci majors or STEM in general. They are some of the CHUDiest workers out there. Because they are better compensated than other industries, they are fine with being "somewhat exploited".

So continue arguing with me. It seems your boomer brain gets a sick satisfaction from it.

I guess there must be people who are not computer scientists or computer engineers or computer programmers and don't know the difference between the three. That person wouldn't have a STEM degree and would never have looked at glassdoor to see what STEM jobs actually pay.

[Svoboda]

Originally Posted by RationalExpectations

Why not work for the outsourcing company?

Because I get paid too much. Why pay me when they can get 10 for a $1 overseas? Sure, they'll lose the entire knowledge base but if they can get 50% efficiency for the pennies they'll pay those 10 people, they "win" in the end.

[lvmensch]

Originally Posted by ddrhazy

The tech bro culture in SV pretty much has destroyed the working class in Cali and lays the blame on working class people for not being boot strappy enough.

I get that they can earn high wages, not even my point and further, those are outliers, not the average. Even Google uses a lot of contracted work to keep wages down. Hell even today there's an article about Google shutting down a movement that workers are trying to unionize.

Lots of non compete understandings between Google/Apple and other big names out there, they got hit with lawsuits for that a few years back.

You are in the wrong environment. Google or Apple as an enterprise hires lots of people. Only a small percentage are programmers and an even smaller portion are the top level. I ran organizations with large numbers of heavy programmers...though in my case virtually all were electrical engineers. And if you really want to deal with the heavy weights get off into the people who design work station systems. And they are not in the least CHUDish. And in the higher levels we all knew each other...so non compete between the corporations had no clout. I was about as high as an engineer can be in that milieu. And we had no problem picking off an engineer from Apple or losing one to them. It happened. It actually fact the high level infrastructure of the area had a pretty good view of what everyone was up to...the question always was who was right.

[ddrhazy]

The entire corporate culture of SF has pretty much turned it's back on the working class. They have been instrumental in the gentrification of large portions of SF, San Jose, Oakland, etc, etc.

Whether they were witting or non witting is not really relevant. It's well known that STEMs have a sense of superiority against everyone else. It's honestly really silly because they are workers and they are being exploited, which was my point. But when you're at the upper tier of the economic rung, economic inequality of other people is less important to you.

To pretend that because you in your capacity as an electrical engineer 30 years ago didn't really see it or it was not relevant then...is silly. It's happening right now. Maybe it's not a big deal to some people, but it's obviously a big enough deal that people in Google want to unionize and Google busts that attempt.

[ddrhazy]

https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...ring-collusion

https://www.washingtonpost.com/techn...nion-activity/