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Old 07-16-2019, 01:29 PM
 
4 posts, read 2,508 times
Reputation: 10

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaoTzuMindFu View Post
You guys have no idea what an H1-B visa is do you? If there were people here who had the skills for those positions there would not be a need for H1-B. Those people are almost always quant analysts with heavy financial modeling experience. Do any of you or any of your friends have this ability? If not, them maybe you should just shut up about complaining about H1-B until you do more research.

Companies that sponsor H1-B workers are now few and far between except in the tech sector who require specific abilities and knowledge and you do know that the government only allows a certain number of H1-B visas per year right?

Overall, the H1-B program does not affect unemployment figures at all in this country because employers are required to try to find US citizens who have the skills/experience/abilities for those positions FIRST before considering and H1-B candidate. Plus, H1-B candidates cost the employers much more than if they hired US citizen for the position.
100% true.

Not to mention most Americans are not even qualified to work in IT , since the number of STEM graduates has been on the decline in recent years.

Mod Cut

Last edited by Rance; 07-17-2019 at 01:27 PM..
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:19 AM
 
Location: Scottsdale
1,849 posts, read 957,561 times
Reputation: 3399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plasmaph View Post
100% true.

Not to mention most Americans are not even qualified to work in IT , since the number of STEM graduates has been on the decline in recent years.

Mod Cut
I have about 20 years of experience as a software tester in iT.

Here are my observations:
* The shortage of "skills" is true for programming like Python, Java, SQL, NoSQL, test automation
* The shortage of "skills" is even higher for data science (data warehouse, ETL, predictive analytics, machine learning, etc).

The foreign visa workers brought in for the shortage above are quickly put to work and generally become productive (depending on conditions of the job)

Here is where I draw the "line" on shortage versus foreign skills - technical writing for software requirements that requires collaboration with mainstream Americans. In many cases, English as a 2nd language is a limitation for foreign visa workers. But they are often hired to "save money". But it doesn't work because requirements are 100+ times more expensive to fix in production. It's best to stay onshore for technical writing (generally speaking). There are exceptions but far and few in between.

If a company really wants "diversity" without sacrificing quality of technical writing, then they should hire 2nd generation children of foreign immigrants who speak (1) mainstream English and (2) the language of their parents. For example, there are many Cuban Americans of the 2nd generation who speak both English and Spanish extremely well. I saw one project where the technical writing was outsourced to India to save money. It turned out to be ostensible. The foreign writers had a poor grasp of English and the requirements were horrible. It had to be rewritten. The people who rewrote it in Miami were 2nd generation Cuban Americans who are very efficient in speaking English but can also speak Spanish fluently. I noticed that some of them also speak Spanish well enough to discern pure, grammatically-correct Spanish from "Spanglish" or Spanish with a lot of slang. I have seen the same pattern among Asians - the 2nd generation is often very good at both English and their parents' Asian language. I know of one case where the Korean parents had a hard time speaking English since they were in the first generation. But one of the children (2nd generation) got a perfect SAT score (including English).

In summary, programming skills seem reasonable for meeting the shortage, but technical writing is often unrealistic to outsource. Poor requirements that get coded wrong are very hard to fix in production and extremely expensive.

As for me, I am bilingual too. But I grew up in America on a reservation. So, mainstream English is not a problem for me. The language of my indigenous ancestors is dying though. Soon, I will be one of the last to speak it.
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Old 09-09-2019, 04:58 AM
 
5,931 posts, read 5,610,104 times
Reputation: 6897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plasmaph View Post
Did it ever occur to you that Americans aren't qualified to work in Silicon Valley tech firms, since most of them choose to major in communications, English literature, or skateboarding/smoking pot?

Last I checked most American White kids are working at Chick-A-Filet, McDonalds, or In N Out burger after graduation. The more intelligent ones are making lattes at Starbucks, lol.

Don't blame Indians for your personal issues, they are a highly educated and industrious group, and most of them start local businesses which creates jobs for Mexican laborers, as well as White Americans.

Case in point: the hotels in my area are owed by several Indian-American Gujaratis, and all teheir maids and kitchen cooks are Mexicans or Central Americans. While the desk workers (front desk agents) and bookkeepers are Americans.
It is a prudent thing to avoid Indian run businesses. It is always something lacking or gross. Indians are great bs masters, bosses love finely tuned bs. Shortage of STEM graduates is 50 years+ old bs . There is a glut of stem graduates, stem Ph.D. glut is especially severe. Besides have you ever thought that it is kinda strange that underfunded, backward 2nd and 3rd world universities ripe with corruption and bs are producing all those cutting edge university graduates American corporations crave?
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Old 09-09-2019, 01:40 PM
 
16,837 posts, read 2,048,879 times
Reputation: 27727
Quote:
Originally Posted by grad_student200 View Post
I have about 20 years of experience as a software tester in iT.

Here are my observations:
* The shortage of "skills" is true for programming like Python, Java, SQL, NoSQL, test automation
* The shortage of "skills" is even higher for data science (data warehouse, ETL, predictive analytics, machine learning, etc).

The foreign visa workers brought in for the shortage above are quickly put to work and generally become productive (depending on conditions of the job)

Here is where I draw the "line" on shortage versus foreign skills - technical writing for software requirements that requires collaboration with mainstream Americans. In many cases, English as a 2nd language is a limitation for foreign visa workers. But they are often hired to "save money". But it doesn't work because requirements are 100+ times more expensive to fix in production. It's best to stay onshore for technical writing (generally speaking). There are exceptions but far and few in between.

If a company really wants "diversity" without sacrificing quality of technical writing, then they should hire 2nd generation children of foreign immigrants who speak (1) mainstream English and (2) the language of their parents. For example, there are many Cuban Americans of the 2nd generation who speak both English and Spanish extremely well. I saw one project where the technical writing was outsourced to India to save money. It turned out to be ostensible. The foreign writers had a poor grasp of English and the requirements were horrible. It had to be rewritten. The people who rewrote it in Miami were 2nd generation Cuban Americans who are very efficient in speaking English but can also speak Spanish fluently. I noticed that some of them also speak Spanish well enough to discern pure, grammatically-correct Spanish from "Spanglish" or Spanish with a lot of slang. I have seen the same pattern among Asians - the 2nd generation is often very good at both English and their parents' Asian language. I know of one case where the Korean parents had a hard time speaking English since they were in the first generation. But one of the children (2nd generation) got a perfect SAT score (including English).

In summary, programming skills seem reasonable for meeting the shortage, but technical writing is often unrealistic to outsource. Poor requirements that get coded wrong are very hard to fix in production and extremely expensive.

As for me, I am bilingual too. But I grew up in America on a reservation. So, mainstream English is not a problem for me. The language of my indigenous ancestors is dying though. Soon, I will be one of the last to speak it.
If you are a real native speaker you should not have a problem leaving IT to move to ed.
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Old 09-22-2019, 08:23 AM
 
14 posts, read 6,304 times
Reputation: 118
I am a former H-1b worker. The whole program is just intended to create a supply of workforce that has less bargaining power than the regular workers. The actual skills which deployed by employers of these workers can be found by sufficiently training US college graduates, but employers wont do that because its costly.
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Old 09-22-2019, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
1,111 posts, read 1,058,958 times
Reputation: 877
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plasmaph View Post
Did it ever occur to you that Americans aren't qualified to work in Silicon Valley tech firms, since most of them choose to major in communications, English literature, or skateboarding/smoking pot?

Last I checked most American White kids are working at Chick-A-Filet, McDonalds, or In N Out burger after graduation. The more intelligent ones are making lattes at Starbucks, lol.

Don't blame Indians for your personal issues, they are a highly educated and industrious group, and most of them start local businesses which creates jobs for Mexican laborers, as well as White Americans.

Case in point: the hotels in my area are owed by several Indian-American Gujaratis, and all teheir maids and kitchen cooks are Mexicans or Central Americans. While the desk workers (front desk agents) and bookkeepers are Americans.
This is so true. China and India produced more engineers. US has more tech jobs than any other countries in the world but only few take STEM course in college.
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