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I think you missed my point. My thought was that skilled professionals should be demanding pensions, benefits, and salaries in line with or greater then what union jobs receive. We do (did) live in a 1st world nation. Instead of taking away the benefits of a few, we should be demanding living wages and better benefits from the private sectors. I am surprised that the conditions CPAs work under are even legal under labor laws. It seems like many people are using teachers as scapegoats instead of asking more from corporate America.
Should, should, should. Easy to say when you have tenure. Not so easy for people who live in fear every day of losing their jobs or taking a pay cut. No one is going to be the squeaky wheel these days. Just another thing that people who work in la-la land don't get.
YOU'RE the one missing the point. The only reason the pension system works for teachers is because you have a never-ending supply of money from people who can't do anything about it - the taxpayers. It's a simple matter of "come up with a budget, get it passed" - when you are in the private sector, you're talking about people who actively must prove their productivity. That's not the case with the schools. I have twins and the difference in their education this year is staggering, mind blowing, whatever adjective you can come up with. But the cr@p teacher has tenure, and she's not going anywhere, despite at least 5 years of complaints about her and poor performance by her students on the 3rd grade tests. The other teacher is a superstar whose students regularly come out on top on the state tests. In the private sector the one teacher would be let go. The other would be promoted at some point if they so desired. And the company would suffer because of the poor productivity of the one teacher. When productivity suffers in the real world, the company's profits suffer, pension funds suffer, market volatility comes into play - all because the company can't just tell its customers "we're raising the costs of our goods and services 8,10,12% a year because that's the only way we can pay out the salaries and benefits we need to pay out" - the only entities getting away with that are school districts.
Justifying the way school districts are doing things by saying the private sector should do the same just proves how out of touch civil servants are. As someone wrote to the Garden City News a couple of weeks ago "it used to be that civil servants were just that - they worked for the people. Now the people work to pay FOR THEM". You can't make any argument that that makes any sense.
That's not good enough for some! As mentioned on this thread, they "deserve" babysitter pay $8 per hour per student (30 kids = $210 an hour). And don't forget the benefits, pensions, paid days off, etc., that "babysitters" don't get.
Well, if you re-read my post, I said that at babysitting wages, I don't require benefits or pensions. I would do that myself.
I also said that if you paid me babysitting wages, I would never complain about my salary. I never said that I deserve them, so don't put your words in my mouth.
Paid days off? I never got a paid day off as a teacher. The holidays and summers are days of no school, so there are no students to teach on those days. Now listen carefully, teachers do not get paid for the days off...that is a popular misconception. We are salaried contract workers and we only get paid for the 182 days, or so, that we work.
Oh, I just checked 30 X $8 is still $240, not $210 as you stated. Use the calculator to check my math.
Paid days off? I never got a paid day off as a teacher. The holidays and summers are days of no school, so there are no students to teach on those days. Now listen carefully, teachers do not get paid for the days off...that is a popular misconception. We are salaried contract workers and we only get paid for the 182 days, or so, that we work.
Oh, I just checked 30 X $8 is still $240, not $210 as you stated. Use the calculator to check my math.
Really? No sick days? No personal days? Are you sure?
Really? No sick days? No personal days? Are you sure?
None that were not in my contract. No sick days, no personal days beyond which were allowed in my Collective Bargaining Agreement™. A triumph of American labor relations. I love America, even will defend to my death the right of people to disagree.
yes, they're overpaid, only because you have people who go into teaching only because of how much they make. is they didn't make like they do in LI we would get creme de la creme, not every one wanting to be a teacher. yes you get time off and you have paid summers so please stop.
Should, should, should. Easy to say when you have tenure. Not so easy for people who live in fear every day of losing their jobs or taking a pay cut. No one is going to be the squeaky wheel these days. Just another thing that people who work in la-la land don't get.
YOU'RE the one missing the point. The only reason the pension system works for teachers is because you have a never-ending supply of money from people who can't do anything about it - the taxpayers. It's a simple matter of "come up with a budget, get it passed" - when you are in the private sector, you're talking about people who actively must prove their productivity. That's not the case with the schools. I have twins and the difference in their education this year is staggering, mind blowing, whatever adjective you can come up with. But the cr@p teacher has tenure, and she's not going anywhere, despite at least 5 years of complaints about her and poor performance by her students on the 3rd grade tests. The other teacher is a superstar whose students regularly come out on top on the state tests. In the private sector the one teacher would be let go. The other would be promoted at some point if they so desired. And the company would suffer because of the poor productivity of the one teacher. When productivity suffers in the real world, the company's profits suffer, pension funds suffer, market volatility comes into play - all because the company can't just tell its customers "we're raising the costs of our goods and services 8,10,12% a year because that's the only way we can pay out the salaries and benefits we need to pay out" - the only entities getting away with that are school districts.
Justifying the way school districts are doing things by saying the private sector should do the same just proves how out of touch civil servants are. As someone wrote to the Garden City News a couple of weeks ago "it used to be that civil servants were just that - they worked for the people. Now the people work to pay FOR THEM". You can't make any argument that that makes any sense.
First of all, I am neither a teacher or civil servent or part of a union. I am not trying to get into a debate over whether or not some teachers are better then others (same goes with any job...and in a private sector the better worker usually gets promoted with more work, and less of a chance of being laid off...not a higher salary or better benefits) I am simply advocating that all private employees should get similar benefits that teachers and other public employees receive., pensions, good health insurance, sick leave and OVERTIME. I feel that many people like to make scapegoats out of unionized professions instead of demanding better benefits from business. Why not get angry at the heads of monopolies and other businesses that rake in billions of dollars but do not give any benefits to their employees and send jobs overseas? Why attack working class, tax paying citizens...most of whom want to help their communities?
Well said, Jamie. I get the anger meant for the really fat cats.
02-13-2010, 05:14 PM
grant516
n/a posts
In the majority of the school districts, when it comes to employees with the standard educational level (in this case Master's Degree)... you have the highest paid employee as ONE Sup't with a set salary in the 200K range, and the starting point MA teacher with something along the 55K range. That's 4X the salary.
vs. say a company like Best Buy, where the one CEO is compensated about 2.5 Million with a Bachelors degree, whereas store assistant managers with the same degree are making 30K a year. A difference of say... 70x the salary.
There's some arguments back and forth that make quality points.
I personally think Movie Stars and Professional Athletes are overpaid.
Teachers are the least of my worries.
... and a special woe to the poster with twins with diff. teachers. Please look into whatever other resources the district can give you to supplement the one's education. Utilzie after school programs, etc. Kids all deserve stellar teachers.
Rachael if your boyfriend is not making at least 80 k he is under paid. If I offended anyone I appologize I was going by my area. But some are overpaid!
no teacher should be paid 80k a year if they aren't working a full-year. if you work half a year, you should be paid for half a year. So, they should be making less NOT more than people who work all year make. Yes, they are definitely overpaid.
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