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I have recently spoken with a couple of contractors looking to hire competent help. There is not a whole lot of guys out there willing to work and learn a trade. Cheap labor is actually beneficial for everyone as the savings get passed on all the way to the customer. I am 34 and out of all the people I went to school with and know, there are a couple plumbers and a few electricians that I know of. This is the real problem out there not the contractor who is charging crazy money who is getting under bid.
My husband is a contractor for over 30 years and I've handled his paperwork for the past 20. I think I might have a little more insight into this than you have had by speaking with a couple of contractors.
Believe me, there are plenty of guys looking for work, looking to learn as evidenced by the phone calls I receive on a daily basis. The men who call range from barely able to speak English to those who are fluent. Some men flat out tell me they want $25 an hour, that they are experienced (5 years doesn't make one a mechanic in the trade) and others are willing to come in, show what they know and then negotiate. Some of these fellow are very skilled at what they do, others have no clue.
Cheap labor in the form of an apprentice learning a trade is one thing; in hiring an illegal and circumventing all the laws from county through federal level is something else.
Liability and workers comp insurance (which all licensed contractors are required to have) are rated based on payroll exposure. My record -- clean, no claims -- still garners me $38,000 in premium this year. Commercial auto (clean - no claims) is another $12K. Before I even open my door, I am $50K out in insurance. This is part of my overhead which is part of my operating costs which are passed on to my clients.
$1000 a week right off the bat. Guess what? The insurance companies don't care. They want their premium. Homeowners don't want to pay a lot. I have men I've kept working for years, through the dips and surges in the economy. This time around, with the surge of illegal labor, the increase in guys operating unlicensed or falsifying their books, it has been very hard. Sales are down considerably.
Cheap illegal labor doesn't equate competent or quality. If a business is cutting corners hiring cheap illegal labor and circumventing laws, one has to question where else they are cutting corners.
I totally agree with what Ohbeehave says. I just got out of business and one of the reasons was the insurance premiums, the clients who do not want to pay, the employers who maintain that we made a fortune (we didnt), the competition of others doing what we did illegally and also the regulations.
We were in the pest control industry which is heavily regulated. Landscapers who are not certified to do what we did, or are illegal and using chemicals bought in different countries, all get away with no fines, no punishment. While us that have been doing it the right way for 20 years are been squeezed out. We just didnt want to put up with it anymore.
You don't have to me explain any of your financial troubles to me. I have close personal friends as contractors including my old boss who I worked for for 12 years. I understand all of the nonsense involved with dealing with workman's comp and such. So what you are telling me is there are plenty of white under 30yr old carpenters, tile guys, masons looking for work?
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
My husband is a contractor for over 30 years and I've handled his paperwork for the past 20. I think I might have a little more insight into this than you have had by speaking with a couple of contractors.
Believe me, there are plenty of guys looking for work, looking to learn as evidenced by the phone calls I receive on a daily basis. The men who call range from barely able to speak English to those who are fluent. Some men flat out tell me they want $25 an hour, that they are experienced (5 years doesn't make one a mechanic in the trade) and others are willing to come in, show what they know and then negotiate. Some of these fellow are very skilled at what they do, others have no clue.
Cheap labor in the form of an apprentice learning a trade is one thing; in hiring an illegal and circumventing all the laws from county through federal level is something else.
Liability and workers comp insurance (which all licensed contractors are required to have) are rated based on payroll exposure. My record -- clean, no claims -- still garners me $38,000 in premium this year. Commercial auto (clean - no claims) is another $12K. Before I even open my door, I am $50K out in insurance. This is part of my overhead which is part of my operating costs which are passed on to my clients.
$1000 a week right off the bat. Guess what? The insurance companies don't care. They want their premium. Homeowners don't want to pay a lot. I have men I've kept working for years, through the dips and surges in the economy. This time around, with the surge of illegal labor, the increase in guys operating unlicensed or falsifying their books, it has been very hard. Sales are down considerably.
Cheap illegal labor doesn't equate competent or quality. If a business is cutting corners hiring cheap illegal labor and circumventing laws, one has to question where else they are cutting corners.
You don't have to me explain any of your financial troubles to me. I have close personal friends as contractors including my old boss who I worked for for 12 years. I understand all of the nonsense involved with dealing with workman's comp and such. So what you are telling me is there are plenty of white under 30yr old carpenters, tile guys, masons looking for work?
It is one thing to actually be involved first hand (the business owner) to understand the "nonsense." It is another to be on the outside looking in (friend or employee.)
And to answer your question which I have placed in bold -- yes, there are many.
As previously written we have men calling our office on a daily basis in search of work. Some follow our vans to lumber yards looking for the owner. I have resumes left in my mailbox, too. I've had guys from the Bronx, Queens and Brooklyn who begged for work -- who claimed they would commute from those areas to job sites on eastern LI -- the recession has left many hungry for work.
My masons find the same thing, although not quite as many. More would rather swing a hammer than lay stone. As for tile -- we do that. It is not subbed out.
It is one thing to actually be involved first hand (the business owner) to understand the "nonsense." It is another to be on the outside looking in (friend or employee.)
And to answer your question which I have placed in bold -- yes, there are many.
As previously written we have men calling our office on a daily basis in search of work. Some follow our vans to lumber yards looking for the owner. I have resumes left in my mailbox, too. I've had guys from the Bronx, Queens and Brooklyn who begged for work -- who claimed they would commute from those areas to job sites on eastern LI -- the recession has left many hungry for work.
My masons find the same thing, although not quite as many. More would rather swing a hammer than lay stone. As for tile -- we do that. It is not subbed out.
I find it hard to believe that these are American born white guys under 30 yrs old. The only way i could is if these guys had union jobs and were laid off due to the recession. Nobody is looking to work for a contractor willingly unless they were making 300+ a day or had health benefits unless they had to. Paid vacations, sick days, 12 paid holidays and an annuity and pension make it impossible for a contractor to compete with. Regardless this is getting way off topic and in my estimation and with the jobsites I view and the guys buying at the lumber yards I can tell you that there is a lack of young American born white tradesman. There are many legal immigrants in the field that might be confusing for the op.
I find it hard to believe that these are American born white guys under 30 yrs old. The only way i could is if these guys had union jobs and were laid off due to the recession. Nobody is looking to work for a contractor willingly unless they were making 300+ a day or had health benefits unless they had to. Paid vacations, sick days, 12 paid holidays and an annuity and pension make it impossible for a contractor to compete with. Regardless this is getting way off topic and in my estimation and with the jobsites I view and the guys buying at the lumber yards I can tell you that there is a lack of young American born white tradesman. There are many legal immigrants in the field that might be confusing for the op.
Again, you're not immersed in the field and only viewing a small sampling.
You're assuming that guys want to make $300/day and perhaps benefits. Those who expect that in this economy are sitting home waiting for the phone to ring.
The illegal day laborers (who tend to live in communities with familiar people from their home countries -- i.e. Patchogue) are not skilled tradesman (Joe hanging out at 7-11 is laying brick one day, raking a yard the next) but are offering their muscle at substantially less than a legitimate, tax-paying citizen can afford to earn. As long as there are slum lords and people willing to hire illegals, this problem will plague LI and the country as well.
If we look to Spain, they have increased their border patrol and have decreased the number of illegal immigrants entering the country -- in the name of preserving the Spanish economy. It's not perfect, but it is a start. The US needs to follow Spain's lead.
Again, you're not immersed in the field and only viewing a small sampling.
You're assuming that guys want to make $300/day and perhaps benefits. Those who expect that in this economy are sitting home waiting for the phone to ring.
The illegal day laborers (who tend to live in communities with familiar people from their home countries -- i.e. Patchogue) are not skilled tradesman (Joe hanging out at 7-11 is laying brick one day, raking a yard the next) but are offering their muscle at substantially less than a legitimate, tax-paying citizen can afford to earn. As long as there are slum lords and people willing to hire illegals, this problem will plague LI and the country as well.
If we look to Spain, they have increased their border patrol and have decreased the number of illegal immigrants entering the country -- in the name of preserving the Spanish economy. It's not perfect, but it is a start. The US needs to follow Spain's lead.
You are the one perhaps that needs to get out in the field a little more and not sitting at the desk taking calls. I would love to have definitive proof but, will say that American born white kids are not looking to do manual labor anymore unless they are making alot of money. Like an electrician or plumber. I know I know you have been filling out paperwork for 20 years. You know best. Show me the 25 year old white kid who wants to swing a hammer for 80 a day and I'll show you the 100 immigrants willing to compete with that 1 kid. I'm not sure what they charge or pay out in the east end of LI but, if you are a full mechanic or a lead man in a crew out in Nassau you are getting 300 a day or 250 plus full benefits. Unless you are working for a shiesty contractor or have no other choice.
I now know you are misinformed because, unlike the US, Spain messed up very badly in their immigration policy in the early 2000's. They admitted several hundred thousand south and central americans and eastern Europeans legally to obtain residency. Nobody snuck into Spain. Now with 25% unemployment the citizens are understandably upset. In the long run it might actually help both Spain and the US as the youth aren't having children and someone is gonna have to pay for social security.
Go ahead and tell me about all of these American born white kids who dream of being landscapers and busboys and dishwashers ect. Oh no that's right the black street youth are the ones that are looking for those jobs.
Well aren't you such a patriot. . . . some scum moves in wrecks the neighborhood and you're so spineless you move......
What a awesome answer. . .
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayfouroh
I think we are all missing the first question: how do you even know they are illegal?
C'mon are you really serious here... everyone that walks into my shop before they walk out i know they're legal or not just by talking with them for 1 minute. . . Yes you can also just open your eyes too. . .
Not some of you, some of you can't get past what is illegal and then being on that high horse of oh help them there battered.
Please, i sat next to a nun at a monthly meeting once she asked why i was here, i had told her to do something about the utter stupidity in govt to save lives of kids that are just being ignored and to show them how simple a positive is rather than just make a new stupid dangerous law....
Then i asked her why she was here, curious now why a nun was at legislative meeting...
She was there to help illegals stay in the U.S. . . .
Well for the next 2 hours i educated her on stuff she had no clue, i started with so you would save me even though i killed than man next to you so i could gain his money and feed my children. Oh no, thats murder, and taking a life is a mortal sin, ok, so intentionally coming here illegally to set out to make money and then get credit to fraud this country and then flee back to my country leaving maybe atleast 1 or 2 women here pregnant is ok though....
For 2 hours i drilled to her that she only see's one side and that side is the 1 or 2 that comes to her and complains and that by only looking from her one single door she is not doing justice or any holy work in saving very evil people looking to work the system anyway they can.
I told her if you want to truly speak on there behalf and defend them you better make friends with these people and LEARN what they are truly about, then you'll find that 95% are criminal in all activities and plans.
I gave her details for quite a long time and she kept with the god created us equal routine. . . . finally I then said while i do not condone hurting people and i do help those i see need help, i am sorry but i strongly disagree with what you are doing and in the manner of how you're doing it and with no knowledge of what is really happening you if successful will be doing more harm than good if god-forbid they listen to you
Quote:
Originally Posted by okaydorothy
Last I heard was that the illegals are charging $125 a day, plus lunch plus a drive home.
The illegal children in the high schools brag to the american children that they dont need insurance, dont need a drivers license etc. So what is that teaching our children ; that you dont have to follow the law.
If the government really wanted to sort the immigration mess out, they could. All they need to do is zone in on the areas mentioned, deport the illegal people and do this for a few weeks until they get the message. I have no problem with legal people, I just have a problem with the illegal people coming in, sponging off our government, having anchor babies, and not putting anything back into the economy. Oprah had a whole article about illegals this month ; but it is totally based on the illegal people. Nowhere did it mentioned that the person was not contributing back to society.
They're charging $150, plus lunch and coffee, driven to and from. . .
Yes if you ever go to court and are lucky to be there when a illegal actually shows up for speeding and no license you'll find yourself ready to choke the crap out of the judge when you gotta pay anything for front plate not affixed to vehicle and surcharge bs. . .
This is how i found out about the illegal safe havens here all ACROSS NYS, and patchoque is a safe haven for illegals, isn't that awesome, make it to farmingville, patchoque pretty much all of brookhaven and your illegal you are now safely in the US
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Originally Posted by ydsavaged
LINY - do you have an obsession with illegal immigrants? Nobody is forcing you to keep an eye on Patchogue or any other town.
Nice to see someone actually using the internet for something good and that would be opening you closed unpatriotic pos lack of unity in any neighborhood views on anything or upholding any laws of this country and doing your part....and god-forbid make you do something about it....
Bu those people are all dying off and the new USA will be filled with you not caring about anything other than your immediate self and not to worry about it until it finally effects you, well when your stabbed by one i hope i get to see it and your s/n is on your shirt so i can reiterate this to you. . .
This is about the best post on here rather than to post stupid wasteful meaningless whining complaining asinine crap. . .about planes and other stupidity. . .
Quote:
Originally Posted by ydsavaged
Go back to the Ronkonkoma isn't far from Manhattan threads...You have an unhealthy obsession with that too.
You complaining on an internet forum is not going to solve the problem. Trust me I am not a fan of illegals either..but what's complaining here going to do?
Do you think you get the real truth from the news
So then possibly using the internet to make people aware of just how serious the problem is, otherwise what is this stupidity for, just to come here and see meaningless banter and other stupidity....
What was that about the best schools and brightest people are from where? ? ?
Disgusting the people on this board and there stupid stupid comments. . .
. Technically this forum is just for the nonsense of buying a home and you doing none of your own footwork, instead listen to 5 or 6 idiots that may have absolutely nothing in common with you and you make a life decision...another stupid stupid tool to use the internet for. . .
I don't think Long Island is enough of an illegal immigrant hot spot from a federal Point-of-view. They seem more keen on border states and Florida. Let's create a hot spot on their map by reporting all activity we witness.
Go to the link below to report Immigration and Customs related crime.
Kayo_M, long island almost all of it is a safe harbor, i'll post the link later.
1st the people need to take there head out of their ass and have that repealed.
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