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Isn't the corporation's job is to maximize profits for shareholders/investors? Executives can easily be fired as well.
Senior executives at large corporations typically have employment contracts that have big payouts if they are fired other than for cause, they frequently also have retirement benefits.
The shareholder maximization thing is more complicated than it sounds, and doesn't itself dictate specific policy objectives that a company must follow. There are many paths and philosophies to delivering shareholder value. See Costco versus, say, Walmart. Both deliver value for shareholders and consumers and both have starkly different employment practices and views regarding unions.
Thanks for posting that sojourn. Most people that complain about this strike & call the Verizon striking workers entitled among other things have no idea what they are talking about. Unless they actually work for them & have had to deal with this crap.We know 5 people that work for Verizon. One is a supervisor & has been working 18 hour shifts since the strike started. My friend has only seen her husband a few times since this strike started 5 weeks ago. We have 2 family members & 2 friends that work in training & customer service. They both fear what was said above in soujourn's post. Like so many companies Verizon is trying to move these jobs OVERSEAS. The exact thing the people that complain & say these striking workers are acting like entitled jerks...I bet those same people will not be all too thrilled when they call Verizon or any company & the call is answered by someone with an accent that you can't even understand! Because those jobs will now be outsourced to places like India! Can't have your cake & eat it too. We back these striking workers 200%. Workers that have worked for Verizon for almost 20 years are being screwed by corporate greed. But the same people that wine they are being entitled jerks....are also probably the ones here complaining how everyone is fleeing LI due to High Cost of Living! What so you think will happen if Verizon wins this? Lots of jobs lost. Pay for the workers go way down. Verizon employs quite a large workforce on LI. Think before you speak.
- Supervisor, not part of the strike, is the one working long hours as a result of the union striking. If you tell me workers today are working 18 hours a day as a requirement, then obviously that's something a union would be good for.
- Overseas call centers - we have dealt with it for a very long time - I am not complaining about that, although some do. This is not something new and 1 union for 1 company potentially going down this road isn't going to persuade me the other way after all the points I've made. I don't know what Amazon does, but their reps sound foreign yet they are among the best customer service companies around. Not to mention, how many people here already complain about Verizon issues with current CSRs? Billing mistakes, etc.
- You personally know workers and I know it can be frustrating, but you have not made any points that show workers DESERVE what they are asking for. Are they unique in some way and provide a value others cannot? When you say they are being screwed, they are facing corporate actions common in any industry - are they being screwed - as if they are being fired just before they qualify for pensions and the like?
- I don't complain about people fleeing LI. LI will always have a strong population. Always.
- If Verizon wins this, they will go through with whatever they planned to do. Same as any company. Do they have an obligation to the local economy? Should they?
- Again, I am not saying what Verizon is doing is right. I have stated my company has done the same thing (and has been for over a decade) and people here still survive, still have great benefits. It simply doesn't justify what the union is doing either. My division has stated they want only 20% US workers. As bleak as it sounds, what right do I have to say otherwise? The union has very little to stand on, and you've mentioned the word entitled enough for the both of us. I should get back to building new skills...
Senior executives at large corporations typically have employment contracts that have big payouts if they are fired other than for cause, they frequently also have retirement benefits.
contractual employment or golden parachute as they call it is usually for the very top senior execs. The contract is more about protecting the large corporation than the executive which isn't so obvious to many people. Of course a few superstar execs do have a lot of clout in terms of bargaining power.
I have personal friends how have such contracts. I assure you they have a lot of pressure to perform and to keep their career moving forward like most employees.
contractual employment or golden parachute as they call it is usually for the very top senior execs. The contract is more about protecting the large corporation than the executive which isn't so obvious to many people. Of course a few superstar execs do have a lot of clout in terms of bargaining power.
I have personal friends how have such contracts. I assure you they have a lot of pressure to perform and to keep their career moving forward like most employees.
The senior exec who loses his job (not for cause) is in a very different position (he'll be fine) than an excessed union telephone line repairman. Fundamentally, that's why I believe in unions.
Your level of resentment for union workers confuses me. Has the system not treated you well? Why begrudge these people? What you are saying over the course of these threads is that you're pissed off that such workers get to have middle class salaries when they really deserve... what? 15k-20k less? Is that something that would really make you feel better/make the world a better place?
The senior exec who loses his job (not for cause) is in a very different position (he'll be fine) than an excessed union telephone line repairman. Fundamentally, that's why I believe in unions.
Your level of resentment for union workers confuses me. Has the system not treated you well? Why begrudge these people? What you are saying over the course of these threads is that you're pissed off that such workers get to have middle class salaries when they really deserve... what? 15k-20k less? Is that something that would really make you feel better/make the world a better place?
yes its different. Some are fine, some are not fine. Its hard for most people both financially and psychologically when their careers are suddenly comes to an abrupt halt.
This is a thread about unions. You are free to start a thread about execs who steal or corrupt politicians. I am sure there will be some people here chiming in.
- Supervisor, not part of the strike, is the one working long hours as a result of the union striking. If you tell me workers today are working 18 hours a day as a requirement, then obviously that's something a union would be good for.
- Overseas call centers - we have dealt with it for a very long time - I am not complaining about that, although some do. This is not something new and 1 union for 1 company potentially going down this road isn't going to persuade me the other way after all the points I've made. I don't know what Amazon does, but their reps sound foreign yet they are among the best customer service companies around. Not to mention, how many people here already complain about Verizon issues with current CSRs? Billing mistakes, etc.
- You personally know workers and I know it can be frustrating, but you have not made any points that show workers DESERVE what they are asking for. Are they unique in some way and provide a value others cannot? When you say they are being screwed, they are facing corporate actions common in any industry - are they being screwed - as if they are being fired just before they qualify for pensions and the like?
- I don't complain about people fleeing LI. LI will always have a strong population. Always.
- If Verizon wins this, they will go through with whatever they planned to do. Same as any company. Do they have an obligation to the local economy? Should they?
- Again, I am not saying what Verizon is doing is right. I have stated my company has done the same thing (and has been for over a decade) and people here still survive, still have great benefits. It simply doesn't justify what the union is doing either. My division has stated they want only 20% US workers. As bleak as it sounds, what right do I have to say otherwise? The union has very little to stand on, and you've mentioned the word entitled enough for the both of us. I should get back to building new skills...
This is where your school of thought originates. You believe that, since the system has treated you one way, it is fundamentally unfair that others be put in a better position than you. It explains so much.
^ Others "put in a better position" and how & why they are getting there is exactly why I've been posting. Still don't see an answer on why they deserve it. Until then, they can cry more and I won't change my viewpoint on that being exactly what they're doing. It has been shown that this avenue has been exploited above and beyond (and you haven't responded to where it could possibly end) and of course it irks us.
And for what it's worth, I don't get any joy from seeing these people lose their jobs (if it happens). It happens.
^ Others "put in a better position" and how & why they are getting there is exactly why I've been posting. Still don't see an answer on why they deserve it. Until then, they can cry more and I won't change my viewpoint on that being exactly what they're doing. It has been shown that this avenue has been exploited above and beyond (and you haven't responded to where it could possibly end) and of course it irks us.
And for what it's worth, I don't get any joy from seeing these people lose their jobs (if it happens). It happens.
Your whole argument is premised on the idea that your personal situation is the yardstick by which all other job situations should be measured. That's why your argument is flawed.
And strawman claim revolving around "where can it possibly end" is not grounded in reality. There are two sides with differing interests in a labor negotiation. A Union does not simply demand and receive unlimited benefits. As demands increase, bargaining strength decreases and pushback increases. It's a balance, just like any negotiation.
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