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Old 01-20-2009, 12:52 PM
 
7,658 posts, read 19,099,600 times
Reputation: 1325

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Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
-Too many school administrations (too many districts)
-Police compensation out of control
-State and Federal mandates that are unfunded...and usually not needed here on LI
-Huge Taj Mahal like fire houses
-Large illegal immigrant population that inflates the school rolls without paying any taxes.
-Corruption

That about sums it up.

crooks

 
Old 01-20-2009, 12:57 PM
 
13,506 posts, read 16,951,445 times
Reputation: 9684
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexisT View Post
A lot of the 2 teacher (or teacher plus assistant) classes are special ed, which can't be cut because of mandates and student needs. (The huge growth in special education services is also a big factor in the increase in expenses and consequently taxes.) The number of teachers with doctorates is small, so I don't think that would be anything more than political point scoring. IIRC, a lot of the early retirement programs ended up not saving any money because the cost of pensions, payouts, and new teacher salary was more than just paying the existing expensive teacher. In-service credits encourage teachers to go back to school, and I don't see that as any different from what many private companies do.

I've never liked pay to play because it hits poor kids and districts really hard. Funding drives don't work when none of your neighbors have any money either. It doesn't even save much--when districts go on austerity and cut all this stuff, taxes don't go down.

In order to cut budgets substantially, we would need to cut salaries (lowering teacher quality, because if you can teach elsewhere for the same money and half the cost of living, you will), or shift pension and benefit costs on to teachers, which would be politically suicidal.
I don't know if it would be politically suicidal..the majority of people on LI I've talked to have an axe to grind with teachers because they blame them for their property taxes.

Again, the point that always needs to be made...a highway detail guy making $80 an hour...cops making 120K after 5 years with some overtime....people on LI want teachers to be making 50K per year in that same environment and still have the schools be regarded as they are? I know the old cranksters don't care about the schools anymore..their kids are already out so they vote the budget down every year, but what about everyone else?
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:19 PM
 
745 posts, read 1,499,183 times
Reputation: 479
When I worked as a teacher, it was more than a 40 hour week. Grading papers, lesson plans, etc. took up A LOT of time. I don't think what I made was too much, considering the amount of time and effort I put into everything.

And for what its worth, I decided to be a teacher because I love history and I have passion for it. I wanted to instill this same joy for learning in my students. Although some of my colleagues only got into it because of the summers/weekends off and pay, the majority of us loved what we did.

How much do you expect teachers to make? Do we really expect teachers to go into incredible debt for college just to get paid 40k a year?

I personally have more of an issue with how much cops make. Maybe I should have taken the police exam instead of going to college.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:25 PM
 
13,506 posts, read 16,951,445 times
Reputation: 9684
Quote:
Originally Posted by StephM View Post
When I worked as a teacher, it was more than a 40 hour week. Grading papers, lesson plans, etc. took up A LOT of time. I don't think what I made was too much, considering the amount of time and effort I put into everything.

And for what its worth, I decided to be a teacher because I love history and I have passion for it. I wanted to instill this same joy for learning in my students. Although some of my colleagues only got into it because of the summers/weekends off and pay, the majority of us loved what we did.

How much do you expect teachers to make? Do we really expect teachers to go into incredible debt for college just to get paid 40k a year?

I personally have more of an issue with how much cops make. Maybe I should have taken the police exam instead of going to college.
A lot of us are saying that. It would be ridiculous if it weren't true..you can't find a better paying job relative to education level and qualifications.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 33,178,038 times
Reputation: 7337
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotkarl View Post
Fortunately, (or unfortunately, depending on how you look at) LI'ers are very adapatable, and somehow, most of the population is able to roll with the changes both culturally and economical. The politicians know this.
Rolling with the changes ECONOMICALLY is only possible with steady increases in income. Unfortunately the income of many LI'ers have remained stagnant while expenses are constantly rising. The politicians are killing the golden goose (middle class) slowly but surely.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:32 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 33,178,038 times
Reputation: 7337
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyc4582 View Post
As many as it takes to inform the residents of LI so that the cops compensation is more in line with the rest of the county.
Uh not so fast. If the income goes "in line with the rest of the country" we will get total goobers for police officers because the expenses on LI are not in line with the rest of the country. So how about a little higher than "in line with the rest of the country?" And employee benefits that reflect what is standard for the year 2009 instead of what was standard in the 1950s? That would save even more money than cutting salaries.

I also have to say that I watch a lot of crime shows and see some really boneheaded moves by local police departments out there who make low money in the rest of the country that I think our police would NOT make. Look at the Jon Benet Ramsey case. I think OUR cops would have done a much better job on that instead of the ones in Colorado that were so impressed with the "rich people" they let them contaminate the crime scene. Or the OJ Simpson case. I think our cops would have handled that a lot better too. And those are just a few examples.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:33 PM
 
1,010 posts, read 3,916,425 times
Reputation: 187
dman, for myself, I am very happy to pay teachers $75-100K a year. That's what a person with a master's degree and experience SHOULD expect to make in a high COL area.

Political suicide doesn't stop with the voters--it also means the unions. As a bloc, they have a lot of power, and all of them would oppose major pension/benefit concessions by one of them. And given that a lot of civil servants accept lower salaries in return for benefits, I can't entirely blame them for not wanting to take a big financial hit. If, say, they stopped having all their health insurance paid, and had to pay out of their existing salary (with no compensatory increase), that would be quite a loss. Benefits are effectively extra income.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:34 PM
 
19,579 posts, read 20,401,433 times
Reputation: 16235
Listen to your folks kids!
My old man used to bust my chops all the time about college, and more so, these "secure" jobs- cops, fireman, civil service etc...I just thought he was breaking my balls. Now I realize what an idiot I am, because more than likely I'll be working til the day I die, and I will most likely die on the job. I missed most of the golden opportunities. I'm too old to become a cop or fireman. Plus, I don't meet the education requirements anymore. Back when, all you needed was a HS diploma to be a cop. And even with many of the better civil service jobs, they are looking for some kind of college or degree, or well-backed documentation of required experience.

I was young, dumb, and thought I was going to set the world on fire.
The only thing I did was shoot myself in the foot.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:39 PM
 
Location: west sayville,NY
9 posts, read 20,670 times
Reputation: 10
I'm just on the first page of posts right now, but I would like to mention the schools. Always want an increase every year and if they don't get it, they take away from the children. I think is horrible.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 01:40 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 33,178,038 times
Reputation: 7337
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYSinger View Post
The salaries are ridiculous. When you think about it, the median annual household income in 2007 in the United States is $50,233.00. So, 100K IS a lot of money. When the average "starter home" is around 350K on Long Island and you are supposed to spend only 2.5-3 times of your gross income on a house.
You are contradicting yourself here. In the context of what a starter home costs, $100K is not a "lot of money," it's not even a liveable wage if someone aspires to buy their own home, is it?
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