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This video is really misleading, and I think the stance taken by the MTA is as well. Something is fishy here, something doesn't add up.
The dispute is over $8 million worth of funding here, the MTA says Nassau County is on the hook for it....Nassau County says they're not contractually obliged to pay that. Lets forget about that for a brief moment, however, and look at some simple math.
MTA Long Island Bus ridership in 2008 was 32.6 million people. If we look at it very cut and dry, increasing the fare from $2 to $3.50 a ride will yield $48.9 million in revenue that did not exist last year. There are other variables of course, they're eliminating bus routes so that will effect ridership somewhat....as well as the cost, but since those routes were the ones that were supposedly operating at a loss this can be viewed as a gain. On top of that, fuel prices are roughly half what they were at this time last year, and eliminating the unlimited ride Metrocards will net even larger sources of revenue.
Basically, the moral of the story is that the supposed hole caused by Nassau County's "missing" $8 million dollars is getting plugged with a whole hell of a lot more than $8 million. The MTA gets to shove this cost onto it's riders and has a convenient scapegoat in Nassau County's alleged unpaid debt.
Looking at it from another angle, let's say you are somehow right to assume that Suozzi actually is on the hook for this magic $8 million figure (I'm not convinced this is true at all). The MTA's required operating budget is still going to be an additional $50 million or so (give or take), which will work out to roughly a $1.25 increase in bus fare instead of $1.50 - but now that $8 million gets payed by residents of Nassau County in the form of property and sales tax increases......at least, by residents of Nassau County who pay taxes, and don't live on government assistance.
The real gaping hole in funding, and the real reason the MTA is jacking it's fares up is that they have a legal obligation to pay back the $500,000,000+ that they lost in pension funds managed for their employees. It's no different than the NYC Subway, the LIRR, NYC Bus, etc. It's all the same root problem, but I guess they've chosen to rape LI Bus riders the hardest because they had a convenient excuse in the form of Suozzi and Nassau "not paying their share". What Suffolk puts into Suffolk Transit and Westchester into Bee Line is irrelevant unless someone shows me formal documentation that says Nassau County has to pay a larger amount.....and even then (again) does everyone realize we're just going to get hit with those taxes on the sales/property end? It's not like Tom Suozzi can snap his fingers and make money appear out of nowhere.
Don't believe everything you read in the paper, or see on YouTube. This is bogus....
This video is really misleading, and I think the stance taken by the MTA is as well. Something is fishy here, something doesn't add up.
The dispute is over $8 million worth of funding here, the MTA says Nassau County is on the hook for it....Nassau County says they're not contractually obliged to pay that. Lets forget about that for a brief moment, however, and look at some simple math.
MTA Long Island Bus ridership in 2008 was 32.6 million people. If we look at it very cut and dry, increasing the fare from $2 to $3.50 a ride will yield $48.9 million in revenue that did not exist last year. There are other variables of course, they're eliminating bus routes so that will effect ridership somewhat....as well as the cost, but since those routes were the ones that were supposedly operating at a loss this can be viewed as a gain. On top of that, fuel prices are roughly half what they were at this time last year, and eliminating the unlimited ride Metrocards will net even larger sources of revenue.
Basically, the moral of the story is that the supposed hole caused by Nassau County's "missing" $8 million dollars is getting plugged with a whole hell of a lot more than $8 million. The MTA gets to shove this cost onto it's riders and has a convenient scapegoat in Nassau County's alleged unpaid debt.
Looking at it from another angle, let's say you are somehow right to assume that Suozzi actually is on the hook for this magic $8 million figure (I'm not convinced this is true at all). The MTA's required operating budget is still going to be an additional $50 million or so (give or take), which will work out to roughly a $1.25 increase in bus fare instead of $1.50 - but now that $8 million gets payed by residents of Nassau County in the form of property and sales tax increases......at least, by residents of Nassau County who pay taxes, and don't live on government assistance.
The real gaping hole in funding, and the real reason the MTA is jacking it's fares up is that they have a legal obligation to pay back the $500,000,000+ that they lost in pension funds managed for their employees. It's no different than the NYC Subway, the LIRR, NYC Bus, etc. It's all the same root problem, but I guess they've chosen to rape LI Bus riders the hardest because they had a convenient excuse in the form of Suozzi and Nassau "not paying their share". What Suffolk puts into Suffolk Transit and Westchester into Bee Line is irrelevant unless someone shows me formal documentation that says Nassau County has to pay a larger amount.....and even then (again) does everyone realize we're just going to get hit with those taxes on the sales/property end? It's not like Tom Suozzi can snap his fingers and make money appear out of nowhere.
Don't believe everything you read in the paper, or see on YouTube. This is bogus....
I agree, this has much more to do with pure and utter mismanagement and ineptness at all levels of the MTA than any 'missing' funding from Nassau County. Suozzi, through no fault of his own has been put between a rock and a hardplace by the MTA from their own stupidity.
The real gaping hole in funding, and the real reason the MTA is jacking it's fares up is that they have a legal obligation to pay back the $500,000,000+ that they lost in pension funds managed for their employees. It's no different than the NYC Subway, the LIRR, NYC Bus, etc. It's all the same root problem, but I guess they've chosen to rape LI Bus riders the hardest because they had a convenient excuse in the form of Suozzi and Nassau "not paying their share". What Suffolk puts into Suffolk Transit and Westchester into Bee Line is irrelevant unless someone shows me formal documentation that says Nassau County has to pay a larger amount.....and even then (again) does everyone realize we're just going to get hit with those taxes on the sales/property end? It's not like Tom Suozzi can snap his fingers and make money appear out of nowhere.
Don't believe everything you read in the paper, or see on YouTube. This is bogus....
Bingo.
this is what I was i was thinking. I always suspected it was the pension liability that is sinking the mta. Mismanagement has something to do with it. The MTA has to cut services drastically AND raise fares, in this case almost double?
This video is really misleading, and I think the stance taken by the MTA is as well. Something is fishy here, something doesn't add up.
The dispute is over $8 million worth of funding here, the MTA says Nassau County is on the hook for it....Nassau County says they're not contractually obliged to pay that. Lets forget about that for a brief moment, however, and look at some simple math.
MTA Long Island Bus ridership in 2008 was 32.6 million people. If we look at it very cut and dry, increasing the fare from $2 to $3.50 a ride will yield $48.9 million in revenue that did not exist last year. There are other variables of course, they're eliminating bus routes so that will effect ridership somewhat....as well as the cost, but since those routes were the ones that were supposedly operating at a loss this can be viewed as a gain. On top of that, fuel prices are roughly half what they were at this time last year, and eliminating the unlimited ride Metrocards will net even larger sources of revenue.
Basically, the moral of the story is that the supposed hole caused by Nassau County's "missing" $8 million dollars is getting plugged with a whole hell of a lot more than $8 million. The MTA gets to shove this cost onto it's riders and has a convenient scapegoat in Nassau County's alleged unpaid debt.
Looking at it from another angle, let's say you are somehow right to assume that Suozzi actually is on the hook for this magic $8 million figure (I'm not convinced this is true at all). The MTA's required operating budget is still going to be an additional $50 million or so (give or take), which will work out to roughly a $1.25 increase in bus fare instead of $1.50 - but now that $8 million gets payed by residents of Nassau County in the form of property and sales tax increases......at least, by residents of Nassau County who pay taxes, and don't live on government assistance.
The real gaping hole in funding, and the real reason the MTA is jacking it's fares up is that they have a legal obligation to pay back the $500,000,000+ that they lost in pension funds managed for their employees. It's no different than the NYC Subway, the LIRR, NYC Bus, etc. It's all the same root problem, but I guess they've chosen to rape LI Bus riders the hardest because they had a convenient excuse in the form of Suozzi and Nassau "not paying their share". What Suffolk puts into Suffolk Transit and Westchester into Bee Line is irrelevant unless someone shows me formal documentation that says Nassau County has to pay a larger amount.....and even then (again) does everyone realize we're just going to get hit with those taxes on the sales/property end? It's not like Tom Suozzi can snap his fingers and make money appear out of nowhere.
Don't believe everything you read in the paper, or see on YouTube. This is bogus....
Here's some recent articles with facts and figures about the LI Bus dispute:
LI Bus needs major restructuring, advocates say -- Newsday.com (http://www.newsday.com/news/local/suffolk/ny-libus2712590452mar27,0,1260196.story - broken link)
The dispute is not over a "missing $8M" and Suozzi is not refusing to pay anything at all. Suozzi will pay around $10.5M towards LI Bus's total budget of $132M, the rest made up of fares, funding from NYS (which rose from $20.5 million in 1999 to $57.8 million in 2009) and funding from the MTA. The increase in fares, while very large, still does not come close to allowing LI Bus to operate with no additional funding. I don't think there is any public transportation system in the entire world that is self-supporting, so why should we expect LI Bus to be? The US Post Office certainly isn't totally self-supporting, but I don't see cries to abolish it. Ten years ago, in 1999, Nassau paid $21.7 million towards LI Bus. Nassau still owns LI Bus, but has seen fit to take advantage of others to pay the lion's share of its operating costs these days. As citizens of NYS, we still end up paying towards it anyway. As for sales and property tax in Nassau being increased because of what Nassau is currently agreeing to pay, $10.5M, that is incorrect. It is in the budget already and will not cause any tax increases, although I can understand how you could get confused with the way Suozzi has been talking to the press. The dispute is that Suozzi is not paying nearly enough compared to what other municipalities like NYC, Westchester and Suffolk pay towards their public transportation. Perhaps Nassau should study HOW NYC, Westchester, and Suffolk fit their public transportation into the budget. I don't think any of these counties are immune to budgetary woes either, but they manage to do it and I have not heard of them raising taxes to do so.
Even if Suozzi got his wish and there was a regionalized mass transit system, that would not mean that once the MTA officially "owns" LI Bus instead of simply managing it, Nassau should not pay anything to support it. Suozzi is mistaken in that respect (LI Bus serves the citizens of Nassau County and people from elsewhere who use it to come to work in Nassau County and Nassau has a responsibility to it). More likely, he is deliberately confusing the issue to sidestep the responsibilities of here and now. Obviously there is no contract that says exactly how much Nassau should be chipping in to support its mass transit system, LI Bus, which is arguably one of the best and most comprehensive suburban mass transit systems around. In most suburban areas of the country, people are literally doomed without a car. Do we really want Nassau to be just like that? Suffolk's bus system is not nearly as comprehensive and Suffolk pays $30M towards it. How are they managing to do so when we can't?
Where to get more money right now is the question. LI Bus receives its funding from fares, the MTA, Nassau and NY State. If fares were raised to match the $2.50 proposed for NYC Transit, that would be a start. Perhaps there is a way Nassau could apply for a Federal grant towards some of the stimulus money, since LI Bus will retain and create jobs and is a "green" method of transportation compared to the alternative on Long Island (everyone in their own separate car). Obama has made it clear he wants the stimulus money to create jobs and to support a greener way of life in terms of utilizing energy. We might as well get something out of this stimulus plan if we can and supplementing the budget to support LI Bus would be a good use of some of this money. Why can't someone in Nassau County government give this a try?
I think LI Bus is important to Nassau County and needs to be supported by all, even non-bus riders because:
The less people who travel one to a car, the less traffic there is, which means less time and fuel wasted in traffic jams
Students need the bus
Low wage workers and young people who don't have a car need the bus
Non-drivers need the bus
Senior citizens who shouldn't be on the road anymore need the bus
Caregivers of seniors such as home health aides need the bus and often home health care is the difference that allows seniors to stay in their own homes rather than be placed in a nursing home
Business owners who employ low-wage workers need their workers to have transportation
People whose car is in the shop need a low-cost alternative to a taxi to get to work temporarily
Taking the bus to the LIRR creates less strain on the already-packed parking lots
Compared to the typical suburb in middle America where a person is totally stranded without a car, Nassau is in a much more attractive position courtesy of LI Bus. We should be proud to have a system like LI Bus when most suburbs have nothing like it at all
LI Bus needs major restructuring, advocates say -- Newsday.com (http://www.newsday.com/news/local/suffolk/ny-libus2712590452mar27,0,1260196.story - broken link)
The dispute is not over a "missing $8M" and Suozzi is not refusing to pay anything at all. Suozzi will pay around $10.5M towards LI Bus's total budget of $132M, the rest made up of fares, funding from NYS (which rose from $20.5 million in 1999 to $57.8 million in 2009) and funding from the MTA. The increase in fares, while very large, still does not come close to allowing LI Bus to operate with no additional funding. I don't think there is any public transportation system in the entire world that is self-supporting, so why should we expect LI Bus to be? The US Post Office certainly isn't totally self-supporting, but I don't see cries to abolish it. Ten years ago, in 1999, Nassau paid $21.7 million towards LI Bus. Nassau still owns LI Bus, but has seen fit to take advantage of others to pay the lion's share of its operating costs these days.
Wait, I messed up. I got $8 million missing out of budget by adding the NYS funding ($57.8M - I actually read $64M somewhere else, maybe that's what they're putting in for 09-10) + Nassau's $10.5M + the $48.9M that the fare hike will roughly net.....however, that is wrong: I should have added the total revenue from the fare hike, not just the increase over last year's $2 fee. If ridership stays at 32.6 million (like I said in my previous post, it probably won't - but at the same time, routes operating at a loss have been eliminated and gas is cheaper so it should all work out to roughly the same thing), a $3.50 fare should yield roughly $114.1M in revenue. The $57.8M in state aid alone more than covers the $132M operating budget, and Nassau's $10.5 million (without state aid) would almost cover the entire thing!
Beyond all the fishy math, the whole argument seems like a bait and switch to me. The bottom line is that the MTA is forced to raise their fares because of a pension liability to their employees. Maybe Nassau County should subsidize MTA Long Island Bus, maybe they even have a legal responsibility to....however whether they kick in the $22M they did in 1999 or the $10.5M they are in 2009, this is not impacting the bus fare either way. I'm also more inclined to believe Suozzi on this one because the MTA tried to blame the whole situation on Nassau. I do know Nassau's "ownership" of Long Island Bus was born out of the bankruptcy of several trolley and independant bus lines between the 1920s-1960s, so it's not like this was some organization the county started and then couldn't get the money to keep running.
So, is LI Bus just a means for illegals to transport themselves in order to commit crimes against citizens?
Cops: Levittown burglar rode the bus -- Newsday.com (http://www.newsday.com/news/local/ny-lilevi0212608872apr01,0,3522723.story - broken link)
Unfortunately illegal day laborers do make up a chunk of LI Bus riders, and I have to admit I see more of them on LI Bus than Suffolk Transit or NYC bus.
Ever the more reason to hate riding LIB with these savages.
The $3.50 fare will make them commit even more robberies!
Unfortunately illegal day laborers do make up a chunk of LI Bus riders, and I have to admit I see more of them on LI Bus than Suffolk Transit or NYC bus.
Ever the more reason to hate riding LIB with these savages.
The $3.50 fare will make them commit even more robberies!
The N70/71/72 buses from Hempstead get loaded up with illegals headed toward Farmingdale, the N27 gets them going from Hempstead to the Gold Coast.
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Nassau Needs LI Bus
