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Old 02-18-2013, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Murrieta California
3,038 posts, read 4,763,664 times
Reputation: 2314

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9162 View Post
1.2M house with only $6890 in taxes? This is less than 1%, also what about a change in ownership? Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems even with prop 13, taxes on this house should be at least double the $6890 rate...
It happens all the time. That is one of the big complaints about Prop 13. You can have 2 houses side by side that are virtually identical but one pays more than 10 times what their neighbor does because one has been in their home for several years and the other purchased many years later.

In 2006, my next door neighbor paid more than double for property taxes than what I did and yet my home was worth a lot more. The reason is that I bought mine in 2002 and she bought hers in 2005. That is because prices more than doubled from 2002-2006.
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Old 02-18-2013, 05:30 PM
 
28,110 posts, read 63,531,084 times
Reputation: 23235
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9162 View Post
1.2M house with only $6890 in taxes? This is less than 1%, also what about a change in ownership? Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems even with prop 13, taxes on this house should be at least double the $6890 rate...
When I bought in 2005 the owner was paying about $1200 a year on the home he built in 1956-57

Shortly after escrow closed the taxes went to $8800 based on the $598k price I paid...

Home was listed on the MLS and I happened to see the sign as I drove by...

Here is the real kicker... the Assessor claimed I didn't pay enough and made several attempts to tax me more... Three visits later over the course of 7 months before the Assessor let the price stand...

Home is 1725 square feet in East Oakland with original kitchen and baths... Formica counters, etc...

Assessor tried to make the case the fair market value was 100k more than I paid and I said it could easily be with extensive upgrades being made...

When Real Estate crashed... bigger home up the street with all the upgrades sold for $425k...

So the tax on my home will forever be based on my $598k purchase price plus inflation and improvements.

The family that bought the nice, larger home up the street will forever be based on the $425k purchase price...

That is how Prop 13 works... assessesed value is based on the value at the time of transfer plus inflation factor and improvements made.

Property Tax is the above plus any voter approved special or additional assessments... in my case this is about 1.6% of value or higher.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Murrieta California
3,038 posts, read 4,763,664 times
Reputation: 2314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
When I bought in 2005 the owner was paying about $1200 a year on the home he built in 1956-57

Shortly after escrow closed the taxes went to $8800 based on the $598k price I paid...

Home was listed on the MLS and I happened to see the sign as I drove by...

Here is the real kicker... the Assessor claimed I didn't pay enough and made several attempts to tax me more... Three visits later over the course of 7 months before the Assessor let the price stand...

Home is 1725 square feet in East Oakland with original kitchen and baths... Formica counters, etc...

Assessor tried to make the case the fair market value was 100k more than I paid and I said it could easily be with extensive upgrades being made...

When Real Estate crashed... bigger home up the street with all the upgrades sold for $425k...

So the tax on my home will forever be based on my $598k purchase price plus inflation and improvements.

The family that bought the nice, larger home up the street will forever be based on the $425k purchase price...

That is how Prop 13 works... assessesed value is based on the value at the time of transfer plus inflation factor and improvements made.

Property Tax is the above plus any voter approved special or additional assessments... in my case this is about 1.6% of value or higher.
That is not entirely true. When prices crashed here, Riverside County automatically reassessed all the homes in 2009 and 2010. The county decided to be proactive to avoid being deluged with applications for reassessments. My property taxes dropped by 30%. They started to inch back up a little last year.

Now, though my assessed value was reduced drastically, the new assessed value is not subject to the 2% inflation limit until it reaches the pre-crash value then the 2 limit kicks in again.

Last edited by JohnSoCal; 02-18-2013 at 06:27 PM..
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:16 PM
 
28,110 posts, read 63,531,084 times
Reputation: 23235
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnSoCal View Post
That is not entirely true. When prices crashed here, Riverside County automatically reassessed all the homes in 2009 and 2010. The county decided to be proactive to avoid being deluged with applications for reassessments. My property taxes dropped by 30%. They started to inch back up a little last year.

Now, though my assessed value was reduced drastically, the new assessed value is not subject to the 2% inflation limit.
Exactly... it is only a temporary market adjustment in a county with a forward thinking Assessor.

I have paid for two formal appeals that are currently pending in Alameda County.

The Assessor was deluged with requests so they started charging $50 an appeal.

Three years ago I spent the better part of a day compiling supporting comps in my area... submitted the package and was told none 21 of the 22 comps could not be considered because they were distress sales... well, guess what... Bank Owned, Short Sales comprised the entire market here in East Oakland... there were no normal sales!

The kicker is the county has two years to respond while the taxpayer has to pay all taxes as billed and hope for a refund a couple of years down the road.

A friend with ties to the office said it is official policy to delay refunds and hearings because each day it can be postponed is another day the county keeps the money.

Friends in neighboring Contra Costa were able to achieve satisfactory results with a couple of phone calls... unfortunately, not in my county...
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:25 PM
 
1,515 posts, read 2,268,428 times
Reputation: 3138
Come to NJ and you will all be in for a treat. Paying 13k on a house assessed at $296k. And we aren't even in a great district. Very depressing.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:39 PM
 
28,110 posts, read 63,531,084 times
Reputation: 23235
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linmora View Post
Come to NJ and you will all be in for a treat. Paying 13k on a house assessed at $296k. And we aren't even in a great district. Very depressing.
I have a friend in NJ that just sold and moved... he just said the high cost was no longer worth it...

He had no intentions of moving when he bought 18 years ago...
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:42 PM
 
Location: Murrieta California
3,038 posts, read 4,763,664 times
Reputation: 2314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
Exactly... it is only a temporary market adjustment in a county with a forward thinking Assessor.

I have paid for two formal appeals that are currently pending in Alameda County.

The Assessor was deluged with requests so they started charging $50 an appeal.

Three years ago I spent the better part of a day compiling supporting comps in my area... submitted the package and was told none 21 of the 22 comps could not be considered because they were distress sales... well, guess what... Bank Owned, Short Sales comprised the entire market here in East Oakland... there were no normal sales!

The kicker is the county has two years to respond while the taxpayer has to pay all taxes as billed and hope for a refund a couple of years down the road.

A friend with ties to the office said it is official policy to delay refunds and hearings because each day it can be postponed is another day the county keeps the money.

Friends in neighboring Contra Costa were able to achieve satisfactory results with a couple of phone calls... unfortunately, not in my county...
I don't think that Alameda County had the same price declines as Riverside County. One of the reasons it hit so hard here is we had thousands of new homes built in the 2002-2006 period when prices went through the roof. The population of Murrieta, where I live, went from 42,000 to 104,000. As far as I know Riverside County is the only county that did reassess the values on their own, however I may be wrong on that. The county did a pretty good job with the new assessed values being pretty accurate.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:46 PM
 
Location: Murrieta California
3,038 posts, read 4,763,664 times
Reputation: 2314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linmora View Post
Come to NJ and you will all be in for a treat. Paying 13k on a house assessed at $296k. And we aren't even in a great district. Very depressing.
Boy, their property tax costs more per month than their mortgage payment would be.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:56 PM
 
28,110 posts, read 63,531,084 times
Reputation: 23235
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnSoCal View Post
I don't think that Alameda County had the same price declines as Riverside County. One of the reasons it hit so hard here is we had thousands of new homes built in the 2002-2006 period when prices went through the roof. The population of Murrieta, where I live, went from 42,000 to 104,000. As far as I know Riverside County is the only county that did reassess the values on their own, however I may be wrong on that. The county did a pretty good job with the new assessed values being pretty accurate.
Can't speak for the county...

I can give specific addresses where homes had sold as late as 2007 for over 500k that were later sold between 80k and more typically in the 130k range here in East Oakland...

Incredible to see 80% reversal of value... like 20 or more years of appreciation evaporated and it is only now getting better as these home are now in the 180k range....

21 of 22 home sales two years ago in my zip code were short or REO sales...
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Old 02-18-2013, 07:15 PM
 
Location: RSM
5,113 posts, read 19,726,301 times
Reputation: 1927
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
When I bought in 2005 the owner was paying about $1200 a year on the home he built in 1956-57

Shortly after escrow closed the taxes went to $8800 based on the $598k price I paid...

Home was listed on the MLS and I happened to see the sign as I drove by...

Here is the real kicker... the Assessor claimed I didn't pay enough and made several attempts to tax me more... Three visits later over the course of 7 months before the Assessor let the price stand...

Home is 1725 square feet in East Oakland with original kitchen and baths... Formica counters, etc...

Assessor tried to make the case the fair market value was 100k more than I paid and I said it could easily be with extensive upgrades being made...

When Real Estate crashed... bigger home up the street with all the upgrades sold for $425k...

So the tax on my home will forever be based on my $598k purchase price plus inflation and improvements.

The family that bought the nice, larger home up the street will forever be based on the $425k purchase price...

That is how Prop 13 works... assessesed value is based on the value at the time of transfer plus inflation factor and improvements made.

Property Tax is the above plus any voter approved special or additional assessments... in my case this is about 1.6% of value or higher.
Your assumption is a bit off. There is a limit to how far it can raise, but not how far it can fall. If your home loses 50% value one year and then goes up 100% next year, you're capped based on that low value. If they won't reassess, sue them. That's their job.

Also, in 30 years when you're still in Oakland your property tax will be low compared to the newbies.
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