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For the record, I was not necessarily discussing the origin of homelessness. I was discussing the fact that many homeless people are mentally ill (and suffer from substance abuse), and how that aspect needs to be addressed for public health and safety concerns.
HOWEVER, discussing the origin of homelessness, in all its entirety, is a different post. My post was focusing on the mental health aspect of homelessness, not an overall synopsis on its causes.
To think that ALL homeless people are homeless because of mental disease is, in fact, short-sighted and inaccurate. But it does not negate that there is a huge connection to mental illness, and that it is not being solved by simply providing food, beds, and shelter.
You keep missing the point. Everything is tied together, it isn't a different issue at all. Your solution doesn't solve anything, period. Society, our legal system, our healthcare system, funding, taxing, housing, education would all have to change fundamentally to even begin to address the smallest of issues. Throwing solutions like "locking them up in an institution" is not a solution because it doesn't create the infrastructure and support to continue giving these people care. It only results in history repeating itself and money wasted (much like what you think is happening now). Reform is needed in all of the above areas before we can even begin to address mentally ill homeless people. I agree with you that something needs to be done. But your extremist views on the matter, your penchant for making up statistics are only damaging and don't address anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by disgruntled la native
We're only "biased" against them because they're at the very least, annoying, and often, dangerous and homicidal.
Nobody shuns HIV anymore! It's like having Diabetes.
You live in West Hollywood and you're saying this? Learn what sero-sorting is. Learn how this drastically affects the gay community. Google HIV stigma and inform yourself for once. Jesus.
Quote:
Originally Posted by erin_elise_
yes. i have never said it was not important or key.
I am saying that the mental health aspect is being harmfully neglected by many who do not know that mental illness and substance abuse problems plague the homeless community. Most do think that all we have to do is provide them with food and shelter, when that is ONLY the beginning.
What about the counseling, treatment, group therapy, medicine etc??
Hypothetically, if we were to build numerous housing for homeless, the ones with mental illness and substance abuse problems would not, (which does account for about half of the homeless community), wholeheartedly benefit in that their disease would remain present without treatment. A bed and food does not cure schizophrenia.
I have a family friend who suffers from schizophrenia who ran away from home and is now homeless somewhere. (His family has been unable to find him since November) He is obviously unable to receive his NECESSARY treatment. Without such treatment, he is abnormally unpredictable.
So what are you suggesting? Besides the Hitler nonsense you've already mentioned in this post?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MordinSolus
Don't downplay depression and anxiety. They can be debilitating. I know Americans scoff at mental illnesses like depression but it's not a minor issue.
Case and point about what lack of education has done and the ignorance it creates.
ensuring that homeless who are mentally ill seek mental health treatment is "hitler nonsense". wow.
I was looking at ONE aspect of homelessness: mental illness and substance abuse.
Do you think it is safe for those homeless who suffer with such to be left with no treatment? I know a person with mental illness, as I mentioned before who is now homeless. Without treatment, he can be a danger to himself and others. Ensuring that those receive care should be germane to our society. (His back-story his that his mother was trying her best to care for him, but he ran away and is now living on the streets as diagnosed schizophrenic.)
How is it not extremist, as you contend I am, to allow them to live untreated with all the ramifications that can ensue.
Please look to the topic of this post. It was concerning "mental illness", ONE aspect of this issue. Do you think I do not believe this is a multi-faceted issue? Nothing I have said thus far has suggested that it is not.
And again, with the statistics, what would I have to gain from "inflating" them? 30% does not change anything. (I feel repetitive regurgitating my explanation for my inclusion of the substance users into the 50% stat I originally gave, but I digress)
the bottomline bpeeps is that I genuinely do feel that to be mental unhealthy and homeless MUST be awful to endure, as this post was to highlight that aspect of homelessness.
I was suggesting that those with mental illness who are homeless must be treated for their safety and the public's safety.
My intention was not to upset or offend you, and if I did, I sincerely apologize.
as i much as it pains me to discuss this topic, I feel this needed to be said.
with the growing homeless issue around the country, it is obviously especially felt in L.A. for various reasons. obviously, LA has become a bastion of homelessness centered around Skid Row and other areas.
the court system has done nothing to curb the problem, and we residents are left to deal with this complex issue.
does one remember about 30 years ago, when people could be committed to mental hospitals without their permission? well as draconian as some might perceive that, I feel that something along those lines needs to happen again. The outpatient mental services is not working, which is the system we moved to after.
It is reported that nearly 50% of all homeless suffer from mental illness. Can someone please tell me how that is not a large threat to public safety and health? If it is, then measures need to be taken. How can a civilized society allow these circumstances to worsen for our cities. And especially here in LA, which is a popular, sought out destination for homelessness "containment".
If fact, it is even documented that other cities actually SEND their homeless to L.A. The councilman for the downtown district admitted that, and I was watching a video on the homeless in San Diego, and it was said that they send theirs homeless away on a bus. (I wonder to where?)
Well yes, I know this is a sensitive topic, but something practical must be done. How can we as residents "help" people out of homelessness if they are mentally incapacitated? They need treatment. If not, then this issue will persist and it will become more commonplace to see tents and encampments spring up all around our communities, as they are doing now.
I thought I'd chime in here with my POV...
Re: homeless people who are mentally ill- I agree with you. I'm not currently in LA, but in the city where I currently reside the adult homeless population is almost entirely due to drug/alcohol abuse and mental health problems. The majority receive SSDI (for those reasons) and some even work, BUT they "allow" the shelters system to provide for all their needs while blowing their money on drugs. When they receive their monthly checks they hole up in motels to drink and drug, and return to the shelters when the money runs out. When social workers help them get nice apartments they leave within a month or so because they don't want the responsibility of paying bills. Some go from one shelter to another (after time limits expire), and others who don't like shelter rules "visit" the shelters for food, showers, etc., and "soup kitchens," while actually living in tents and under bridges. Seems to me they're pulling quite a scam of cheating the system that was designed to help needy people on a short-term basis. So I agree that people who either can't or refuse to do anything for themselves should not have this option.
However, not all homeless people are mentally ill. When someone has life circumstances for which they need assistance (not financial assistance), they're too quickly lumped into the category of addicts or mentally ill even if they're not, and basically left to die on the streets. I could give an example but the story would take up too much space here.
However, not all homeless people are mentally ill. When someone has life circumstances for which they need assistance (not financial assistance), they're too quickly lumped into the category of addicts or mentally ill even if they're not, and basically left to die on the streets. I could give an example but the story would take up too much space here.
I seriously want to know why drugs/alcohol always get conflated with homelessness? I only see the connection after the person became homeless or perhaps the person started using shortly before becoming homeless to deal with growing problems, usually financial, stress or depression, at home. A lot of homeless have held jobs and were sound minded people before homelessness and the people I've talked to volunteering at shelters have said that their illness developed later in life or while on the streets or during periods of great stress and trauma.
We have this notion in this country that the only way you can become homeless is if you get caught up in drugs or have a mental health issue. Because we see a lot of homeless deal with substance abuse or struggle with mental health problems we think the former is the cause for the latter.
Is it another way to always blame the individual? Is it a way to not admit that we do have a flawed society that fails a lot of people?
Mental illness is not the cause of homelessness. I think it's the other way around. And if you want to look for drivers of homelessness it would be employment and family structure.
Mental illness is not the cause of homelessness. I think it's the other way around. And if you want to look for drivers of homelessness it would be employment and family structure.
It's both. Certainly being on the street exacerbates it, but usually a degree of mental illness leads to homelessness in the first place.
Mental illness is not the cause of homelessness. I think it's the other way around. And if you want to look for drivers of homelessness it would be employment and family structure.
...severely mentally ill people who have no resources end up on the streets or in prison. That's how it works. Living on the street doesn't make you schizophrenic, you clod.
You live in West Hollywood and you're saying this? Learn what sero-sorting is. Learn how this drastically affects the gay community. Google HIV stigma and inform yourself for once. Jesus.
HIV isnt the death sentence it once was. It's easier than Diabetes in some ways - you just have to take one pill a day (Stribild) and if you're too poor to afford it, there are resources to pay for it. The long term effects of HIV are still concerning, especially on the brain so I wouldn't encourage gay guys to "bb" and get it on purpose, but it's not the end of the world either. There's also HIV "undetectable" where supposedly the viral levels are so low transmission is impossible and with the right meds many reach that point. You need to learn more about the disease yourself.
You keep missing the point. Everything is tied together, it isn't a different issue at all. Your solution doesn't solve anything, period. Society, our legal system, our healthcare system, funding, taxing, housing, education would all have to change fundamentally to even begin to address the smallest of issues. Throwing solutions like "locking them up in an institution" is not a solution because it doesn't create the infrastructure and support to continue giving these people care. It only results in history repeating itself and money wasted (much like what you think is happening now). Reform is needed in all of the above areas before we can even begin to address mentally ill homeless people. I agree with you that something needs to be done. But your extremist views on the matter, your penchant for making up statistics are only damaging and don't address anything.
You live in West Hollywood and you're saying this? Learn what sero-sorting is. Learn how this drastically affects the gay community. Google HIV stigma and inform yourself for once. Jesus.
So what are you suggesting? Besides the Hitler nonsense you've already mentioned in this post?
Case and point about what lack of education has done and the ignorance it creates.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tia 914
I thought I'd chime in here with my POV...
Re: homeless people who are mentally ill- I agree with you. I'm not currently in LA, but in the city where I currently reside the adult homeless population is almost entirely due to drug/alcohol abuse and mental health problems. The majority receive SSDI (for those reasons) and some even work, BUT they "allow" the shelters system to provide for all their needs while blowing their money on drugs. When they receive their monthly checks they hole up in motels to drink and drug, and return to the shelters when the money runs out. When social workers help them get nice apartments they leave within a month or so because they don't want the responsibility of paying bills. Some go from one shelter to another (after time limits expire), and others who don't like shelter rules "visit" the shelters for food, showers, etc., and "soup kitchens," while actually living in tents and under bridges. Seems to me they're pulling quite a scam of cheating the system that was designed to help needy people on a short-term basis. So I agree that people who either can't or refuse to do anything for themselves should not have this option.
However, not all homeless people are mentally ill. When someone has life circumstances for which they need assistance (not financial assistance), they're too quickly lumped into the category of addicts or mentally ill even if they're not, and basically left to die on the streets. I could give an example but the story would take up too much space here.
yes, sadly, mental illness and substance abuse does plague many of the homeless community given the stats.
But, NO i would not say that this ALL of the homeless population. I never did say that.
All i was saying was that ppl need to be given treatment who need treatment and the city/state has to start taking some measures to facilitate this.
But yes, thanks for seeing my point.
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