Los Angeles finally about to crack down on homeless camps (San Diego: attorney, law school)

[Exitus Acta Probat]

Originally Posted by majoun

San Diego didn't have a spike in crime, nor did the state as a whole. If 47 had been the cause crime would have increased statewide. It actually decreased statewide.

This is directly tied to the homeless issue. San Francisco which also has a severe homeless issue also saw an increase.

Are you a law enforcement officer?

[Exitus Acta Probat]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

OMG, so if Ms.Grey says it, it must be true! Look, I have no idea who this person is, but she's full of crap and here is why:

Are you in the business of law enforcement? Furthermore, do you know Officer Grey?

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat

Are you in the business of law enforcement? Furthermore, do you know Officer Grey?

I am SO looking forward to the response.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat

Are you in the business of law enforcement? Furthermore, do you know Officer Grey?

I worked in law enforcement for 24 years. And if you were correctly quoted what she said, then she's full of crap.

[Exitus Acta Probat]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

I worked in law enforcement for 24 years. And if you were correctly quoted what she said, then she's full of crap.

How is it that my Senior Lead Officer, whose job it is to investigate property crimes, is incorrect? And are you accusing her of being disingenuous, or ill-informed? And if ill-informed, how could that be, since it would be evident to her if the perpetrator of a crime was recently released from prison?

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat

How is it that my Senior Lead Officer, whose job it is to investigate property crimes, is incorrect? And are you accusing her of being disingenuous, or ill-informed? And if ill-informed, how could that be, since it would be evident to her if the perpetrator of a crime was recently released from prison?

Did you even bother to read this? How about asking "your" lead officer to provide proof that what she said is correct. What I posted here is based on 24 years of experience in law enforcement, plus 13 years as a paid consultant to law enforcement. I don't care why your lead officer gave you bad information, the fact is that she did. It was naive and just flat out wrong to state that an increase in crimes is due to prop 47, please quit trying to think of what to say next and take 5 minutes to read what I posted.

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

OMG, so if Ms.Grey says it, it must be true! Look, I have no idea who this person is, but she's full of crap and here is why:

1) It is too early to tell if prop 47 will impact the crime rate. 6 months of data is all that is available and the results are VERY mixed. Crime is up in some areas, down in others but the crime rate is influenced by so many factors that it's impossible to say with any degree of certainty how much prop 47 is effecting it.

2) Prop 47 may end up reducing crime because when fewer people are jailed for relatively minor crimes, i.e. personal drug possession, jails will not come under pressure to release serious offenders early in order to free up beds- and that has been a real issue in Los Angeles.

3) The typical police argument is that when simple drug possession was a felony the courts could offer a drug rehab program instead of prison. Fact is, few courts did this and the "drug treatment" usually offered consisted of required attendance at of AA or NA meetings which have a success rate of about zero for coerced attendees.

4) Many offenders don't have any idea what the penalty is for a crime they commit, if they were the sharpest tacks in the box they wouldn't be out there getting arrested. Also, one of the symptoms of 'criminal thinking' is the inability to recognize and be deterred by either the potential penalty or the likelihood of getting caught.

5) Crime is almost always committed by young males - 16 to 25, after that most mature out and get on with their lives, sometimes what prevents that exit from criminal behavior is a felony record which makes the young man ineligible for most meaningful employment. By reducing the penalty for the least serious crimes it very well could mean that more young offenders will transition to a lawful productive life.

6) LAPD spent the last 4 years harping about how crime was rampant because of AB109 which required non violent, non serious offenders to serve prison sentences in county jails rather than state prison, and transferred the responsibility for post release supervision to counties rather than state parole. Well the results are in, in a report just released recidivism is down, crime is not up, and most remarkable - offenders receiving drug treatment in jail and after release have a remarkably low recidivism rate of 21%.
http://www.cdcr.ca.gov/Adult_Researc...t_7-6-2015.pdf

[Exitus Acta Probat]

Originally Posted by 2sleepy

Did you even bother to read this? How about asking "your" lead officer to provide proof that what she said is correct. What I posted here is based on 24 years of experience in law enforcement, plus 13 years as a paid consultant to law enforcement. I don't care why your lead officer gave you bad information, the fact is that she did. It was naive and just flat out wrong to state that an increase in crimes is due to prop 47, please quit trying to think of what to say next and take 5 minutes to read what I posted.

I did read your post.

Why is it too early to tell if prop 47 is a factor in crime? When somebody is apprehended, is it not evident that the person apprehended was recently released from prison, at the very least during the booking process?

The rest of your post is a political statement, but does not refute Senior Lead Officer Maria Grey's statement that prop 47 has caused an uptick in crime in the city of Los Angeles.

[UKWildcat1981]

Ask Donald Trump what do about the homeless, he is a brilliant MENSA member I am sure he has all the right answers lol

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Exitus Acta Probat

I did read your post.

Why is it too early to tell if prop 47 is a factor in crime? When somebody is apprehended, is it not evident that the person apprehended was recently released from prison, at the very least during the booking process?

The rest of your post is a political statement, but does not refute Senior Lead Officer Maria Grey's statement that prop 47 has caused an uptick in crime in the city of Los Angeles.

I already addressed 'why' it is too early to tell, but let me try this again.

1) Her Chief of Police, Charlie Beck states it's "too early to tell" "Proposition 47 cannot be taken out of the equation," Beck said. But he added there is no data to support that yet, noting that several statewide studies are underway. Beck also cited a rise in homelessness as a possible reason for the increase in crime. "The city has seen an increase in folks who live on the street who are more likely to be involved in violent incidents," he said. Beck pointed to a 6 percent increase in domestic violence and an increase in gang-related crimes as other reasons. "Its really the totality of these things," he said. Criminal justice experts have said it’s too early to determine whether the increase in crime is related to changes in incarceration policies, and whether it represents a longer term trend. They note crime remains at historic lows".
Crime in LA up, Chief Beck says it's too early to know why | 89.3 KPCC

2)Rearrests after prop 47 Counties show 'mixed results' while a statement from CDCR states:
Statewide numbers from the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation show that 3,068 inmates were released from California prisons since Prop 47 passed last November. Since then, just 14 have returned -- a recidivism rate of .005 percent. That's just a sliver of a fraction compared to the state's overall recidivism rate of 61 percent.
Inmates released under Prop 47 -- Where are they now? | Local News - KCRA Home

3) Prop 47 the debate continues: Prop 47: The Debate Continues

• Among the issues that have cropped up in Los Angeles is an apparent reluctance to make arrests for the low-level crimes that used to lead to felony charges. It’s a change that retired California Superior Court Judge George Eskin has called counterintuitive.
  
• One criminologist who isn’t a fan of the early assessments of Proposition 47’s impact on crime is Barry Krisberg, a Senior Fellow of the Earl Warren Institute at the University of California Berkeley Law School—and an occasional contributor to The Crime Report. “This alleged increase in property crimes, I’m not believing it,” he said in an interview. “That information isn’t even officially produced yet; it’s based on police counts, which are often inaccurate.
  
• John Jay College criminologist Peter Moskos, a former Baltimore police officer, said in an interview that in the short-term, an increase in certain types of crime would be expected.
  
• Former San Diego Police Chief Bill Landsowne, who retired in March 2014, says law enforcement organizations — in particular the state’s Police Chiefs, Sheriffs' and District Attorneys associations — are responsible for orchestrating a media push to discredit Proposition 47.
  
• “It’s absolutely premature, you can’t just snap your fingers and fix a complicated problem,” O’Donnell, a professor at John Jay College, said. “This is going to be something that has a long-term impact; trying to make a 60-day assessment is impossible.”

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by jm1982

Maybe we should start requiring people that move here have something going on.

A job ,money , etc..

If you want to move to this State and your plan is to panhandle or sponge off us while spreading your 'belongings' on our public sidewalks and streets that shouldn't be acceptable.

I think that's against the law